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Double Bass NEW Euphonic Audio iAMP Doubler

#181
I hear ya and don't disagree. I compared a GK 800RB which I think is something like 170 watts rms into 8. To me, the overall volume was as much as the Doubler which is rated at 330. Biggest difference was a distortion haze (which I'm sure the Glock doesn't have) but the fact that each note seemed to have a stronger physical presence. That's the best way I can describe it. On DB you get paid to walk quarter notes, for the most part. I play the same group, same club every Monday. Everyone in the group said that my walking felt stronger with the Doubler than any other amps I used. (even the drummer who never compliments me on any new gear). I haven't had a gig yet where the Doubler seemed to be struggling, even electric gigs. I'm sure that some dumb loud gig may come up where I need the Iamp800, but it hasn't yet.
 
#182
Hi Mike,

So are you using it w/a mic? How often? Ever mic only? This is my concern. I like having a useable volume from the mic. With the Focus I am able to go mic only often. Is this possible with the Doubler? I usually go mic only in trio settings...singer stuff...etc.

I should say I am using the H clamp and Beta 57 currently.

Roger
 
#183
Mike Arnopol said:
I hear ya and don't disagree. I compared a GK 800RB which I think is something like 170 watts rms into 8. To me, the overall volume was as much as the Doubler which is rated at 330. Biggest difference was a distortion haze (which I'm sure the Glock doesn't have) but the fact that each note seemed to have a stronger physical presence. That's the best way I can describe it. On DB you get paid to walk quarter notes, for the most part. I play the same group, same club every Monday. Everyone in the group said that my walking felt stronger with the Doubler than any other amps I used. (even the drummer who never compliments me on any new gear). I haven't had a gig yet where the Doubler seemed to be struggling, even electric gigs. I'm sure that some dumb loud gig may come up where I need the Iamp800, but it hasn't yet.
Click to expand...

I am looking forward to pulling my AMT back out and see how this head handles that mic with my VL208. I stopped using the mic because the Glock Soul did a very nice job with the pick up only. I also look forward to mixing the signal, I have not had an opportunity to play with the HPF just yet with the holiday weekend and all. I am assuming I will probably tweak it and then find a level that works for me, any further tweaks can be done in the tone shaping.

I am only assuming that the HPF only effects the second channel which will leave channel one flat for my electric tones....or if I want to blend a mic and pick up (which I personally feel can be to much work for most gigs).

I can't stress enough how small this thing is for those of us who never owned the micro. I've had a hard time finding the perfect size case for it but I just wrapped it in a scarf and stuffed it into my stand bag.
 
#184
Peter
make sure tha you mess with the phase control when combining. I have the prototype where it's not working. (I have to wait for all you bums out there get yours before they send me a production Doubler) To me, it's one of the coolest features.
 
#185
Thanks for the tip, I haven't run both channels at the same time or use the mic input and phantom power but I did notice a slight change in the sound as I moved the knob around so I assume it is working.

BTW I did have a slight freak out on my first gig with the doubler, my Alleva-Coppolo started to intermitantly distort and then the signal dropped to a very low level. This didn't happen until the beginning of the third set. I had left the amp on and bass plugged in between the first two sets and then between the 2nd and 3rd I turned the amp off and left my bass plugged in. As it turned out the battery in my preamp was going and a quick swap out quickly fixed the problem..For a moment I had visions of the GK issues...
 
#186
Roger
I don't use just mic, but I did mess aroumd with just mic to check out sounds. I couldn't get close to seeing the amp anywhere near capacity with a mic. Even when using the notch filter I'd hit the feedback threshold way before I'd hit max volume. But I'm using a cardioid condenser (ATM35) and maybe it hits the feedback threshold before a dynamic mic. My experience with mics (solo) and an onstage amp is that you hit the feedback or funky resonance point pretty quick. Using a 5 band parametric ( I have a single rack space Symetrix and a 2 channel 10 band 2 rack space which I will be selling) I can get WAY more usable volume with a mic. When getting to a high stage volume with a mic, I'll wind up notching out 3 or 4 frequencies. The louder you go, the more notching.
 
#187
peterpalmieri said:
I am looking forward to pulling my AMT back out and see how this head handles that mic with my VL208. . . .....................
Click to expand...


Peter,
I guess that you'll just use the line output on the AMT pre amp into the Mic channel of the Doubler it you have the same pre amp that I do. Won't that mean that you will have two HPF's running at the same time? One from the AMT and one on the Doubler. I wonder how that will work out?

Ric
 
#189
Mike Arnopol said:
Roger
I don't use just mic, but I did mess aroumd with just mic to check out sounds. I couldn't get close to seeing the amp anywhere near capacity with a mic. Even when using the notch filter I'd hit the feedback threshold way before I'd hit max volume. But I'm using a cardioid condenser (ATM35) and maybe it hits the feedback threshold before a dynamic mic. My experience with mics (solo) and an onstage amp is that you hit the feedback or funky resonance point pretty quick. Using a 5 band parametric ( I have a single rack space Symetrix and a 2 channel 10 band 2 rack space which I will be selling) I can get WAY more usable volume with a mic. When getting to a high stage volume with a mic, I'll wind up notching out 3 or 4 frequencies. The louder you go, the more notching.
Click to expand...

So are you blending with it then? Does that work well?

Thanks.

Roger
 
#190
Oh yeah. Very nice mic pre. The unit I'm currently using is the prototype on which the phase control is not functioning, but when all of you dumbasses out there get yours maybe they'll send me another. The phase control really sets this apart. It allows you to fine tune the phase interaction between the mic and pickup. Right now I use a Fishman Dual Parametric Direct box for my pickup. It has a phase switch that can put it 180 degrees out of phase. The in-phase combination is nearly unusable with the mic and pickupthat I use.180 degrees out of phase is a huge improvement for me over the in-phase relationship, but the difference is too dramatic in some ways. So being able to find that "sweet spot" in terms of phase can be a night and day difference in terms of combining pickups and mics.
 
#191
I finally had the opportunity to spend some down time at home working on dialing in the Doubler with my DB.

It does have a very nice tone and I still contend that it does lack absolute volume which when it comes to DB playing doesn't really enter the equation for me.

A little background I play a hybrid bass with a planet pickup and spirocores. I also have an AMT mic and focused on working with my VL208 and in some cases the pair of VL208s.

I found the tone with my pickup warm and clear at the same time, which for me in many cases is either one or the other. As my playing moves up on the G string over a D the sound starts to become a little hollow. This is a problem I have seemed to have with most gear I use and is really a flaw in my bass not the amplification. What I did find was rolling back the Treble to about 10 o'clock maybe 9 o'clock works really well without pulling out to many highs of the overtones on the lower notes.

It did take me a fairly long time to try and work on a nice tone with the AMT, I normally have 3 sweet spots that work for me. The first being the center of the bass about 3 inches above the bridge and 2 inches off the top. The second is about 1 inch below the bridge centered and again about 2 inches off the top. The final one is at a slight upward angle about 4 or 5 inches off the top just below the treble side F hole.

In any case getting enough gain using the mic was a challenge, I had to set the gain to about 3 o'clock to achieve the same level as my pickup set around 10 o'clock. While I much preferred the pickup a little past noon, getting that volume on the mic required a wide open pre gain.

By themselves I would lean heavily towards the pickup sound and mixing the 2 signals was interesting and created a nice tone which I don't think was able to eclipse the pickup by itself. I do understand that it can take a lot of time and effort so I will leave that as an open issue that I can work on further.

As I come up in volume on the mic feedback seemed to occur at a frequency above where the notch filter could be set. But overall I could get a decent volume before feedback with the right placement of the bass and amp.

Using the pickup on it's own I prefer channel 1, I believe that is not effected by the HPF and I'm guessing that had something to do with it. A little more presence and growl on the open E.

The intelligent switching is very cool it does seem however if you only plug into channel 2 you cannot access channel 1 tone controls although I might just not be using it correctly.

In any case I think this little head really sounds great for DB, my ear is liking the warmth with clarity that the Glock Soul doesn't provide, I find the Glock to have more clarity then warmth with a piezo. I do not own a Focus any longer so I couldn't do a direct A/B but I can say I was never overlly pleased with the tone on the Focus but was more so really liking all the bell and wistles that could help in certain situations.

So thus far when it comes to DB I am really digging it more so using the piezo vs. the mic and if long term it pans out this way the new micro might have been the less expensive alternative. Although I'll reserve judgement until I've had a longer opportunity to really work with the mic. Again I preferred channel 1 with the highs dialed back to about 10 o'clock and the pre gain around noon.

To recap some of my electric experiences to get a significant volume I have been running the preamp gain upwards of 2 o'clock and in some cases higher. The good news is that it's a very clean signal even up that high. I am also perferring pumping up the bass a little bit around 1:30 or so.

A last comment the darn thing is so small and light you need to hold the amp when plugging in or unplugging anything. I can learn to deal with that....
 
#193
I had the opportunity over the weekend to use the doubler in a few situations.

1. An outdoor (show mobile) gig on electric.

2. My quartet rehearsal, sax, guitar, drums.

I tried something new I have been thinking about at the electric gig and it worked out pretty well. I set up my NL210/doubler rig, off to the side of the stage facing inward towards me and the drummer, utilizing the tilt back handle and far enough away that the drivers had a straight line to my ear. The gig was 3 horns 3 vocals and rhythm section. Again I didn't have much headroom at all I was running the amp a little past 3 o'clock. It didn't get real hot and the sound was very clear. Again a little bass boost seemed to get my tone where I wanted it to be. I am concerned on a bigger gig that I am going to run out of headroom, so I'll keep everyone posted. I've got a street fair this Sunday that is usually very well attended and needs some volume.

As for my jazz rehearsal. I used the Doubler with both VL208s. Not that 2 were needed but I just happened to have the two wired up and ready to go in that section of the basement where we rehearse. Again as I did when playing with the head I used channel 1, backed off the bass to about 10 or 11 and the treble about the same. What a really natural sound. I can say thus far I have never been as happy with my DB tone as I was last night. Everything just sat perfectly, clarity and warmth with a real my bass only louder type natural tone. Again running the pre gain at noon and I didn't need to get the master past 10 o'clock. Being that the head is so small and two cabs stacked is a perfect height I was able to sit just off to the side at an angle and face the head in a way that I could make small adjustments between tunes. That same rig on a loud Electric gig would not be efficient at all, as many of you know the VLs need allot of power but 1 of the VLs and the doubler will make a DB rig that will certainly take me to just about any volume I'll need.

Again not utilizing any of the mic functions I do think that the new micro would certainly be a more efficient use of funds for my use. I also wouldn't mind finding an old VL108 or even possibly try the new less mid focused Wizzy 10.

I again would contend that two 4 ohm Wizzys is probably where the best use of this amp probably is, I do think this is safe at 2 ohms as Bob stated earlier.
 
#194
peterpalmieri said:
I also wouldn't mind finding an old VL108 or even possibly try the new less mid focused Wizzy 10.
Click to expand...

I just started using the Wizzy 10 and even with the stronger mids, I've gotten lots of positive comments about its sound from other players. Clarity in the bottom end seems to be valued by the players who are counting on the bass to keep the chord structure outlined during their solos.

It's so easy to haul around, too, and barely has a stage footprint.

Given how hard you're pushing the Doubler, the Wizzy 10's efficiency could be valuable for keeping adequate clean headroom.
 
#196
peterpalmieri said:
Again not utilizing any of the mic functions I do think that the new micro would certainly be a more efficient use of funds for my use. I also wouldn't mind finding an old VL108 or even possibly try the new less mid focused Wizzy 10.
Click to expand...

Peter,
I found an old spec sheet on the VL 108 and there are some significant differences between the two cabinets. Whether that's a plus or minus I really can't say since I'm not a techie. But for better or for worse here is a little comparison.

Wizzy 10/VL 108

45Hz to 5.5KHz/ 58HZ to 20 KHz

Size: 15.0H x 12.5W x 11.0D/ 14 5/8 H x 13 5/8 W X 10 1/2" D

Weight: 17 lbs/27 lbs

Configuration: 1 x 10/ 3way 8" Driver 5 1/4" Midrange 3 5/8" T

Woofer:Proprietary EA 10 Neodymium with Whizzer cone/ 8" Woofer

Sensitivity: 102dB @ 1m/ 95 dB @ 1m

Sound Pressure: 126dB @ 1m/ 121db @ 1m

Power Handling: 250 watts/ 200 watts

Impedance: 4 ohms/8 ohms
 
#197
I have both the Wizzy 10 (unmodded) and a VL108. The 108 sounds great for low volume gigs, but when it bottoms out, it's done. The Wizzy 10, OTOH, is more akin to a VL208 in terms of the power it can handle and the abuse it can take. Yes, the VL series is darker and a bit sweeter. If the VL208 wasn't about 3 times as heavy and twice as bulky as the Wizzy, I'd probably never have sold mine. As it is, I don't take the 108 out because if the gig gets louder than I expected, I like to have the headroom. YMMV.
 
#198
For me the the wizzy 10 was a little to different for me to really enjoy. That being said I'm not playing 3 DB gigs a week, if I was I might consider sacrificing some tone for convenience. I am real curious about the mod though. Chris are you using the original micro 300 still?
 
#200
Chris Fitzgerald said:
I have both the Wizzy 10 (unmodded) and a VL108. The 108 sounds great for low volume gigs, but when it bottoms out, it's done.
Click to expand...

+1
Just as Chris says. It's a beautiful cabinet for duo's and trios. I hope to try the modified Wizzy 10 eventually. The weight is probably the biggest drawback of the VL 208 as well, but man it sounds wonderful unless it's a very loud gig.
 

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