New mesa subway amps and cabs!

[DJ Bebop]

The cab emulation circuitry is there for headphones only. As I recall from the circuit flow diagram that cab sim circuitry comes much later in the signal path than where the pre or post DI signal is derived.

The DI is a studio quality output suitable for pro use and a cab sim wouldn't be appropriate for that.

Al refresh my memory on reading a block diagram. The flow of the signal in the diagram is what is happening despite where the knobs are on the front of the unit?

As an example, the knobs on the face of the WD, in the tone section are laid out as, Bass, Para Mids, Passive Mid, Treble. Yet the diagram seems to indicate the flow is Passive Mid, Bass, Treble, Para Mids.

The diagram is what's really goin' on? Not that is really matters

 

[Al Kraft]

Al refresh my memory on reading a block diagram. The flow of the signal in the diagram is what is happening despite where the knobs are on the front of the unit?

As an example, the knobs on the face of the WD, in the tone section are laid out as, Bass, Para Mids, Passive Mid, Treble. Yet the diagram seems to indicate the flow is Passive Mid, Bass, Treble, Para Mids.

The diagram is what's really goin' on? Not that is really matters

To the best of my knowledge in general practice unless indicated otherwise, the circuit flow diagram is how the signal actually flows from input to output points. While knob position on the front or back could be aligned exactly that way, there are internal (not user controllable) features, rear panel (user controllable) features and some engineering considerations that could make having the exact flow match the control layout different in some cases.

For example, in the WD case here the semi-parametric controls are located in the "mid section" (so intuitively the controls go from bass to mids to treble - left to right) but they can be bypassed completely with a footswitch. That and/or the designer's intent for how they shape tone in the circuit can influence when the signal will see that circuit element. It's also worth noting that the bass and treble controls are active type where the mid is a passive control (sort of passive-hybrid in my mind since it actually has make-up gain). Any or all of these things could impact where in the actual circuit flow a designer might want them impacting the signal.

@agedhorse would be the best person to answer this specifically for the WD, and MI amplifiers in general for that matter. However, generally in circuit design you process your signal in a way that you introduce the least amount of noise or alteration/distortion of the signal as you move through the circuitry. Your user interface is most frequently designed/laid out to easily support the operators use of the equipment. There are times in general design when it would be advantageous to have both the circuit signal flow and control layout match precisely.

 

[agedhorse]

No, the DI is straight off the various take-off points (ie. pre and post). Any eq or dynamics processing is expected to be provided by the connected console, or in the case of recording, through the use of the DAW and/or plugins and models. Placing simulation on this output would take away options for use other applications.

 

[DJ Bebop]

To the best of my knowledge in general practice unless indicated otherwise, the circuit flow diagram is how the signal actually flows from input to output points. While knob position on the front or back could be aligned exactly that way, there are internal (not user controllable) features, rear panel (user controllable) features and some engineering considerations that could make having the exact flow match the control layout different in some cases.

For example, in the WD case here the semi-parametric controls are located in the "mid section" (so intuitively the controls go from bass to mids to treble - left to right) but they can be bypassed completely with a footswitch. That and/or the designer's intent for how they shape tone in the circuit can influence when the signal will see that circuit element. It's also worth noting that the bass and treble controls are active type where the mid is a passive control (sort of passive-hybrid in my mind since it actually has make-up gain). Any or all of these things could impact where in the actual circuit flow a designer might want them impacting the signal.

@agedhorse would be the best person to answer this specifically for the WD, and MI amplifiers in general for that matter. However, generally in circuit design you process your signal in a way that you introduce the least amount of noise or alteration/distortion of the signal as you move through the circuitry. Your user interface is most frequently designed/laid out to easily support the operators use of the equipment. There are times in general design when it would be advantageous to have both the circuit signal flow and control layout match precisely.

To the best of my knowledge in general practice unless indicated otherwise, the circuit flow diagram is how the signal actually flows from input to output points. While knob position on the front or back could be aligned exactly that way, there are internal (not user controllable) features, rear panel (user controllable) features and some engineering considerations that could make having the exact flow match the control layout different in some cases.

For example, in the WD case here the semi-parametric controls are located in the "mid section" (so intuitively the controls go from bass to mids to treble - left to right) but they can be bypassed completely with a footswitch. That and/or the designer's intent for how they shape tone in the circuit can influence when the signal will see that circuit element. It's also worth noting that the bass and treble controls are active type where the mid is a passive control (sort of passive-hybrid in my mind since it actually has make-up gain). Any or all of these things could impact where in the actual circuit flow a designer might want them impacting the signal.

@agedhorse would be the best person to answer this specifically for the WD, and MI amplifiers in general for that matter. However, generally in circuit design you process your signal in a way that you introduce the least amount of noise or alteration/distortion of the signal as you move through the circuitry. Your user interface is most frequently designed/laid out to easily support the operators use of the equipment. There are times in general design when it would be advantageous to have both the circuit signal flow and control layout match precisely.

I dig
It seems to me based on nothing That the diagram is the flow. It seems that's how it interacts with itself.
Like the Passive mids seem to set up what happens down the line as far as how rest of the tone controls react.
@agedhorse?

 

[Al Kraft]

I dig
It seems to me based on nothing That the diagram is the flow. It seems that's how it interacts with itself.
Like the Passive mids seem to set up what happens down the line as far as how rest of the tone controls react.
@agedhorse?

There will likely be some proprietary design techniques and methods that Andy will not want to disclose associated with the specifics of the WD circuit design. However, I'm sure he can educate us using some generic concepts and considerations.

 

[DJ Bebop]

A simple yes or no would suffice
I get it though, the secret sauce is what makes it a special amp.

 

[agedhorse]

The signal flow on the block diagram is pretty accurate, though obviously simplified so that it makes sense to the majority of players.

Yes, there are a lot of elements that occur in each of the blocks but the details are not shown because they aren't as important as the basic signal flow in the block diagram.

 

[DJ Bebop]

The signal flow on the block diagram is pretty accurate, though obviously simplified so that it makes sense to the majority of players.

Yes, there are a lot of elements that occur in each of the blocks but the details are not shown because they aren't as important as the basic signal flow in the block diagram.

Thank, man!
I thought I was going nuts.
Not that you cured me

It just seems that the passive mids were affecting stuff earlier in the chain than where the knob was located on the face. Why I think that, IDK. It just 'felt' that way to me. I like it, whatever is goin' on.

As far as the intricate details occurring in each of the blocks. I didn't want the secret sauce recipe

 

[agedhorse]

The passive mids shouldn't affect anything earlier.

 

[DJ Bebop]

The passive mids shouldn't affect anything earlier.

OK, I was wrong.

I thought the passive mids seem to interact or affect how the other tone controls reacted, not in a bad way. I was thinking that the passive mid was affecting or in the signal chain before the rest of the tone controls, as in the block diagram.

Maybe it's just the general responsiveness of the amp.

I'll go back under my bridge now...

 

[agedhorse]

Because of the signal flow, each control will have a contribution on what happens earlier and later in the amplification process.

 

[DJ Bebop]

Because of the signal flow, each control will have a contribution on what happens earlier and later in the amplification process.

 

[DJ Bebop]

The passive mids shouldn't affect anything earlier.

I meant to say that the block diagram seems to indicates that the Passive mids appear in the signal flow before or earlier than the baxandall treble bass controls and the para mids. Whereas the Passive mid control knob on the face of the amp is placed in the logical place for ease of comprehensive adjustment.

Do you get what I'm trying to say?

 

[JOME77]

I’m telling you. Nothing sounds bad through this gig!
I purchased a $179 Squire P/J for my 11 year old grandson to learn on and even it kills through this rig!

Pure magic!

 

[IvanBassist]

I’m telling you. Nothing sounds bad through this gig!
I purchased a $179 Squire P/J for my 11 year old grandson to learn on and even it kills through this rig!

Pure magic!

View attachment 3981444 View attachment 3981443

Nice rig!
That’s a reason why I usually suggest to my students to upgrade their amp first instead of the bass. Unless the instrument can’t be setup properly somehow

Even a beginner bass will sound pretty good through a fine rig, but a $10,000 fodera won’t sound that inspiring through a 30watt combo amp

 

[agedhorse]

I meant to say that the block diagram seems to indicates that the Passive mids appear in the signal flow before or earlier than the baxandall treble bass controls and the para mids. Whereas the Passive mid control knob on the face of the amp is placed in the logical place for ease of comprehensive adjustment.

Do you get what I'm trying to say?

Oh, the block diagram is the actual signal path.

 

[DJ Bebop]

Oh, the block diagram is the actual signal path.

 

[nofrets5]

I’d love to hear from anyone who is lucky enough to own/run this great head through Mesa 10s Vs 12s, your thoughts pro/con on them. Currently I run it through 2 TC RS 2x10s.

Thanks

 

[Diegombass]

No, the DI is straight off the various take-off points (ie. pre and post). Any eq or dynamics processing is expected to be provided by the connected console, or in the case of recording, through the use of the DAW and/or plugins and models. Placing simulation on this output would take away options for use other applications.

Could be cabinet emulation be bypassed through headphones?

 

[agedhorse]

Could be cabinet emulation be bypassed through headphones?

No, but it's fairly mild.