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New Mike Adler TWELVE STRING BASS????
- Thread starter Jay Terrien
- Start date
I got a question about the octaves on these subcontra basses, the lowest note on my 88 key piano sounds(at least to my ear) an octave lower then my low B. To my knowledge a standard 6 string bass is B0 E1 A1 D2 G2 C3, now Ive seen posts saying the lowest piano note was A0 but it sounds to me like A00 based on how my low B is B0, and what is jauqo-III's low C# string? C#00? is gary's low Bb jauqo's C# string tuned down, someone please clear this up for me 
C#0Sandman1278 said:... what is jauqo-III's low C# string? C#00? is gary's low Bb jauqo's C# string tuned down, someone please clear this up for me
you can check this for further info:
http://www.contrabass.com/pages/frequency.html
great site!
from the lows,
Stew
nother question, people have said stuff about playing piano peices on these ERBs, playing something like beethovens fur else, or the charlie brown theme using tap tecneques i could see, but what about playing chords? something like taht would seem extremely dicult if not impossible to me.
Ben Lacy has a hold on the evolution of stringed instruments.
Type his name in google and check out the MOV. section from
a show at Apple. It's a six string guitar but it shows multiple parts at one time. He's amazing! Al
Type his name in google and check out the MOV. section from
a show at Apple. It's a six string guitar but it shows multiple parts at one time. He's amazing! Al
Sandman1278 said:I got a question about the octaves on these subcontra basses, the lowest note on my 88 key piano sounds(at least to my ear) an octave lower then my low B. To my knowledge a standard 6 string bass is B0 E1 A1 D2 G2 C3, now Ive seen posts saying the lowest piano note was A0 but it sounds to me like A00 based on how my low B is B0, and what is jauqo-III's low C# string? C#00? is gary's low Bb jauqo's C# string tuned down, someone please clear this up for me
My thoughts on your questions:
The Bosendorfer 97 note grand piano extends down to C0. I don't feel they would make a piano that had notes they felt could not be heard by the human ear and then sell it for $166,000.They explain that the piano was made because there are 5 or so compositions for piano that were written to incorporate the low C0. Bosendorfer also makes a piano that just extends down to the low F#0, the same as the .165 F# string.
Jauqo's string is the C#0 above that C0. The same note is the second lowest note on the Bosendorfer.
I do tune the .195 Jauqo III-X C#0 string down below the Bosendorfer's lowest note, C0, to a Bb00. This note is audible, and as with the Adler 11-string with the low C#0, the low Bb00 records well,plays well and is "clear as a bell". This allows me to have the Bb0 at the 12th fret, and the standard low B0 at the 13th fret, on the low Bb string which make playing piano pieces on this bass easier.
I see some musicians use C-1,C00 or C0 to mean the same note, depending on the school of thought. The most accepted name I've found for the lowest piano note at around 15.something hz seems to be C0. Jauqo's string is a 17.32 Hz, C#0.The 7th above this note is the open low B0 on most basses. Most 88 notes do have A0 as their lowest note.
This 12-string has 92 notes and as with piano literature, the extreme low and high notes are rarely used. For myself, I like having this range and having more places to place the same note. I will have some audio examples recorded soon.
Sandman1278 said:
One of the points in having 9+ strings is because it is easier to voice chords,especially6 and 7 note chords. You have the range and span to play piano and string section voicings. You can play standard A, B and C block voicings normally reserved for brass sections easily with these basses.I am amazed when I take a stack like, say G13(+11) and play it as I would on a piano or make "poly chords" like an Amaj over a G7 and stretch them out over 7 or 8 octaves.IMO, when you can play these kind of chords,you own them. I find it gives me a greater overview of music and better defines the role of a bass guitar in any given situation.
Thanks for your positive post.I am seeing that there is a need to keep focused on the end result of all this-the music made with the instrument. To keep reading about and seeing photos on a bass guitar "with all those strings" can get old without hearing a track with the guitar "maxed out".Working on it -Juneau said:
I have been doing test recordings ,12-string direct to my HHB 850 stand alone CD burner. The low Bb00 all the way up to the 36th fret F7 are crystal clear. Playing with two hand independence left hand on the lower 6 and right hand on the upper 6 , and lots of over- hand crossing as well in stereo, produces some very new, fresh sounding results. I played the track for some friends who refused to believe that there were no overdubs. I never use the "O" word (overdub),but in this case,the whole point of having lots of strings is to avoid overdubbing and to play everything live. Needless to say,there is a lot of practice time put in here. The end result should be musical.
I am happy to see all the ERB being available in the market. I started out as a self-taught 5-string bass player so i do not feel confined of the "traditional" role of bass playing. When Larry Graham, Jaco Pastorius, Adrian Davison, Michael Manring (amongst countless other bass players) surpassed the limits of "conventional" and created within their new spaces, not everyone liked or loved what they did (or what peers here are doing). It takes a daring and "open" mind, a "good" technique, a "musical" thought and great ears to provide a "valid" statement (all words in quotes are very very subjective). I would love to hear the expanded horizons that are becoming available with these instruments. Taste is very subjective but the result is nevertheless objective.
Let's keep the flame alive and open our minds and ears for what's coming (not necessarily through 15string instruments, but from fresh approaches and ideas).
Let's keep the flame alive and open our minds and ears for what's coming (not necessarily through 15string instruments, but from fresh approaches and ideas).
fullrangebass said:
+1
If we (as human beings) didn't push the envelope... we'd all be cellists right now playing something that someone else composed.
Garry Goodman said:
The extra keys are added primarily for increased resonance; that is, they vibrate sympathetically with other strings whenever the damper pedal is depressed and thus give a fuller tone. Only a very small number of works composed for piano actually use these notes.
I have been tuning C0-G4 lately. This allows me to keep the Bosendorfer's C0 and have G7 at the 36th fret on the high G string.The new G4 string is very strong,and doesn't break easily as the earlier version did.
This is an important breakthrough because it works on the 34"-32" scale.This tuning only has a span of 7-1/2 octaves,but I can finger Ab7-C8 on the pickup cover.I rarley use these 5 notes,and I don't miss Bb and B00.
Direct to CD test recordings are proving to be very interesting.
This is an important breakthrough because it works on the 34"-32" scale.This tuning only has a span of 7-1/2 octaves,but I can finger Ab7-C8 on the pickup cover.I rarley use these 5 notes,and I don't miss Bb and B00.
Direct to CD test recordings are proving to be very interesting.
Garry Goodman said:
ah... nice tuning. C0 seems a good place to start, plus that 195 will sound so much better. what gauge string are you using for the G4?
i would love to tune a 9 string in fifths starting on C0:
C G D A E B F# C# G#
that top G# will need a pretty short scale to work though, and a very thin string. perhaps 35 to 30 inch scales would manage it
i see that jean baudin's future 12 string JP bass will be 34 to 29 inches, C# to Ab i assume
ixlramp said:
You have brought up some interesting points.
I am not sure I can determine that C0 "sounds" better than Bb00,but the bass sounds brighter to me with the C0-G4 tuning.
The G4(392hz) string is .005 .It's more stable than the .004 I had been using.It doesn't break, and it bends nicely.If I keep the tuning in 4ths,starting with C#0, I loose the C0.So a half step lower keeps the low C , and the highest string is G,with Ab4(415.00hz) at the first fret.
This 34"-32" fan is easy to play. I can't imagine playing 34"-29".Why do you think a G#4(415.00 hz) would need a pretty short scale to work?My .005 works great at 32", but is really stretching 35-1/2" from bridge to tuner.
im sorry but i have to put a stop to all this BS. it seems like a lot of people are afraid to come out and say what they really think about this "bass". here - i'll start the ball rolling:
i think its incerdibly ugly, looks like its about as playable as a piece of wet cardboard, and it isnt a bass - its a bass and guitar and then some all-in-one!!!!
im not going to bother with any of that ((IMO)) crap because who elses opinion would i be giving? i just think this is ridiculous. why not have a double neck if you want a twelve string "bass"? thats right - six on one and six on the other!!! no problems with string spacing then and it would actually look playable! obviously it would reduce the chording possibilities but you would still have your oh-so-precious ER.
and what is going on with the "fanned fretts" what is that all about?
i think its incerdibly ugly, looks like its about as playable as a piece of wet cardboard, and it isnt a bass - its a bass and guitar and then some all-in-one!!!!
im not going to bother with any of that ((IMO)) crap because who elses opinion would i be giving? i just think this is ridiculous. why not have a double neck if you want a twelve string "bass"? thats right - six on one and six on the other!!! no problems with string spacing then and it would actually look playable! obviously it would reduce the chording possibilities but you would still have your oh-so-precious ER.
and what is going on with the "fanned fretts" what is that all about?
