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No set list, I'm not playing.

#41
Another setlist fan.

Honesly I don't see how you keep the show from grinding to a halt without having some structure around it. We use a setlist that's built from two-three song groupings that we generally always play back to back. The BL though can call an audible if we've scheduled a "time to go get a beer" ballad at a point where people still seem to want to dance.
 
#43
pasta4lnch said:
Master song lists I can see, but the crowd dictates what you should play next. . .
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This. We have about 150 song master list and just call out songs based on crowd response and if people are dancing.

We are a variety cover band so this works well. We have been playing so long together we can feel what we are playing next and call it out about 20-30 seconds before the previous song ends.
 
#44
Gaius46 said:
Honesly I don't see how you keep the show from grinding to a halt without having some structure around it.
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True dat!

We can only hope that that particular so-called "band leader" doesn't decide to pursue a career as a surgeon, an airline pilot, or an explosives handler.

"So, Doctor Leader, what exactly will be the procedure for this operation?" Her response: "Pffft, procedure?? I'm just gonna do what I always do.....just slice open the patient and then.....then.....well, I dunno......I'll just do whatever I'm in the mood for at the spur of the moment, I guess."
 
#45
I love using set lists as our shows go at least 10x better every time we use one. That said, not having one doesn't handicap me so much that it ruins the gig for me. In a perfect world there would always be a set list, but this ain't a perfect world :D
 
#46
Me too for set lists. My last band was TIGHT, and we had some great intros, kicks, stops, and endings, that to me were like icing on a cake. We'd also start the next song right after the ending of the last one. No way I could duplicate that as a fill in, not knowing the songs well, or without a list. Having said that, my last 2 bands hosted a local blues jam for years. Talk about flying by the seat of your pants! Totally different than a normal gig,I know, but I sure learned a lot, especially how to listen and react quickly. We once backed up a b-list country star, w/no song list or rehearsal. Luckily it was pretty simple stuff, and we pulled the set off really well, considering. It was a lot of fun, but when we were done, I was mentally exhausted....I felt more like we had played 3 sets, rather than the one....LOL.
 
#47
Same here- a beach / R&B band wanted me to learn 3 full hours of material. I asked if the had a set list and charts, and the reply was "yes". I got the set list and the "Charts" It was two pieces of notebook paper with the name of the tune, followed by a series of letters and a diagonal slash, to indicate another part of the tune. Like this: GFGFDDGFGFD/GCDGCD/DDDF. There were maybe ten tunes on each piece of paper, front and back, some scribbled in at an angle, in pen, some in pencil. I decyphered the chords and made proper charts, set them up in order, then, when I got to the gig, they started off with a different tune without telling me, and skipped around the set list.
 
#48
jmattbassplaya said:
I love using set lists as our shows go at least 10x better every time we use one. That said, not having one doesn't handicap me so much that it ruins the gig for me. In a perfect world there would always be a set list, but this ain't a perfect world :D
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Right! Despite what I said previously about often not having a set list, I definitely prefer to have one.
I enjoy when our bandleader says he doesnt have time to write one and asks me to do it, not so much, though, when he asks our drummer.
 
#50
We've discovered that just playing our set list in order is the way to go. We try to have certain kinds of songs and a basic ebb and flow to things.

We used to change things up all the time and try to go with the crowd.

Now the crowd goes with us. It's just better for our band at this point.
 
#51
A lot of bandleaders have minimal ensemble experience outside of environments where the band is basically taking care of them, or the entire band is learning as a group. They don't know what it's like to be a sub, and may be ignorant of mysteries such as charts.

I've played in a band where the singer / bandleader, in addition to being minimally trained, was typically half-seas over, and really had no idea what was going on behind him to keep the gig going. We had no idea what key he'd start each tune in.

But at the gig, we're subs, so of course it's our job to take care of the band, make them sound good, and make the audience happy. We may even play just as well as their regular bassist. After a couple of songs, the bandleader is thinking, "This guy can do anything," and starts taking more and more risks, perhaps while getting slightly better lubricated as the night wears on.

tl;dr: Sometimes the only pro on stage is the sub.
 
#53
We're doing an afternoon/night double header tomorrow and my BL wants to "just wing it" for both gigs. They're both going to be 3+ hours. I told him I'm okay with it as long as we know what we're going into next. I don't want to stand around between songs trying to figure it out, killing the whole mood.
 
#56
Ben Wilkie said:
If that's what they want then they should just get a juke box.
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I respectfully disagree. . .well at least I'll say, I disagree if I want to get paid ;). Keeping the crowd happy, keeps them buying drinks, which keeps the venue happy, which gets us hired again . . .


actually, money aside, I really get off on keeping the crowd stoked. If they wanna dance, we'll play a dance tune. If they request a song, we're playing it (especially if it's an original!) If our current set is full of modern tunes and the crowd is older, we're pulling classics. I've always felt I was there for them, not the other way around . . .
 
#57
TRichardsbass said:
...
Is it me or do musicians today have no clue...
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I'm with you for the most part. I won't take it quite so far as to refuse to play - but that's part of why I charge a premium for sub work! The premium is usually bigger for those who don't use a set list or are otherwise a pain to deal with in some way.

The "spontaneity" argument is all BS. Most people who use it don't know the difference between spontaneous & sloppy. Build opportunities for spontaneity into the set (list), just like you do in your song arrangements. In fact, a set list is to a whole set of music what an arrangement is to one song. Who plays a song without any plan for where it's going to go? A set works the same way.

That said, I've known some guys who do very well off-the-cuff, & in fact that's a big part of their whole show. Gotta' be very well-versed in the "standards" (a more palatable term to some people than "covers") of the genre(s) played & it sure keeps you on your toes! It only works with a very strong leader, who can make the call instantly, & followers who trust the leader completely, pay close attention at all times, & really know their stuff!
 
#58
I have played in a 3 piece without set lists. It worked and songs were selected by the singer guitarist. Many songs have guitar intro anyway and we finished each set with 1 of 3 medley's which were designed to fit a time segment.
 
#59
I agree Ben Wilkie.

As for cover bands, I don't understand why your set list would NOT be 99.99% dance tunes period. When I read guys saying " go with the crowd and if they want to dance" i am flummoxed. If you are playing a bar you should be playing things that make them dance and thirsty, so they drink more and dance more. Why would you play anything that isn't fun? You are not paid to entertain yourself, you are paid to entertain the crowd.

As for filling in, anyone who has ever had an original band knows how hard it can be to hire a fill in for a gig, let alone be a fill in. Set lists are a must. Otherwise you cannot be an effective member of the band. When was the last time you went to a show where you paid $80 or more for your seats and the artist just called out songs at random? Doesn't happen. Because the choreography of the SHOW is critical.
 
#60
Several people have said "my regular band doesn't use a set list", and I think that's fine. You all know the material and can probably transition from one song to the next fairly quickly. To me, that's the key: keep the energy up, keep entertaining the audience.

I do a lot of sub gigs with jazz bands, and it seems like no one ever wants to commit to a set list. "It's a spontaneous, improvised art form, man". OK, I get that. But this is what bugs me: we finish a song, then we look at each other and start discussing how we all did.
"I started to play the Basie ending, but then I heard what you were doing, so I tried to follow that..."
"I thought you were going to play the high harmony note, so I played ..."

After a minute or two of this, the selection of the next tune starts.

"How about Straight No Chaser?"
"No, we just did a blues, how about a latin tune? Girl From Ipanema?"
"OK, yeah. (starts flipping through Real Book) Wait, how about Triste?"
"Triste, yeah. Is that in Book 1 or Book 2?" (more flipping through books)

Now five minutes have gone by and we're still not playing yet.

If I'm ever a band leader, there will be a set list, all players will have it a week in advance, and all players will be expected to have their charts printed out, in order, at the start of the gig. Otherwise you are not getting your share of the $23 we made in tips. Wait, maybe that's the problem right there...
 

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