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Official Barefaced Bass Cab Club

#5,501
Pbassmanca said:
Is it conceivable , that with the appropriate amount of power at 8ohms, the BB2 is the ultimate single 12 cab solution for bass on the market right now? What I mean, is that if the cabinet will take up to 800 Watts at 8 ohms , will it deliver in terms of volume and low-end like a decent average 210 or 410 fed 300-500 watts?
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I'm using a R.A.D. Engineering ICE 1000-based amp into a Super Midget. At 8ohms, it produces 525 watts. There have been no issues. The SM definitely sounds "huge" with headroom compared to when I use a Euphonic Audio Micro 550 amp, which does (I believe) about 385 watts. Call it weight of the tone, heft, feel, headroom, whatever. It's distinct enough that I prefer more watts as compared to fewer watts.

The same difference occurred when I owned a BB2. At the time I was using a Reiner Studio 1200 amp, also based on the ICE 1000 power module.

In neither case was there ever a sense of pushing the cab too hard @ 525 watts. I definitely felt something was missing when I moved to a lower wattage amp, which is why I prefer using the ICE 1000.

I should note this is with electric bass. I do not find a similar benefit with my acoustic Taylor AB-1. Higher wattage / headroom tends to add distortion at volume.
 
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#5,502
HaphAsSard said:
The Barefaced 12" driver cannot take 800 watts continuous, nor do they state it can anywhere in their literature: they do say you can hook up an amp capable of delivering that much power continuously, if you like clean amp tones, and if you are able to use the volume knob judiciously.
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Actually that isn't our position. The recommended amp power ratings are not solely for clean tones or players able to use the volume knob judiciously. Use an 800W amp with a BB2 and push it as hard as you like and use as many FX as you like - the cab will make clear warning sounds (it goes from clean to obviously distorted and not in a pretty way) if you push it too hard. If you ignore those warnings then you might be unlucky enough to blow a driver but to do this generally requires abusive behaviour.

The voice coil in the 12XN can handle the best part of 600W continuously and to get this average level from a typical bass guitar signal you'd need getting on for 2000W of amp power, unless you're compressing it to death. 800W amps give you plenty of safety margin on a single 12XN. The 10CR cabs don't give as strong warning signs hence the more conservative power ratings and caveats about clean vs dirty tones but the flipside of that is they overdrive really nicely! :)
 
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#5,503
alexclaber said:
Actually that isn't our position. The recommended amp power ratings are not solely for clean tones or players able to use the volume knob judiciously. Use an 800W amp with a BB2 and push it as hard as you like and use as many FX as you like - the cab will make clear warning sounds (it goes from clean to obviously distorted and not in a pretty way) if you push it too hard. If you ignore those warnings then you might be unlucky enough to blow a driver but to do this generally requires abusive behaviour.

The voice coil in the 12XN can handle the best part of 600W continuously and to get this average level from a typical bass guitar signal you'd need getting on for 2000W of amp power, unless you're compressing it to death. 800W amps give you plenty of safety margin on a single 12XN. The 10CR cabs don't give as strong warning signs hence the more conservative power ratings and caveats about clean vs dirty tones but the flipside of that is they overdrive really nicely! :)
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I would love to hear in person, how loud and low a BB2 will go being before complaining whilst being fed a signal from an amp that is capable of doing 800 watts at 8ohms. Anyone own a BB2 and a high power 8ohm amp near Toronto Canada? :D
 
#5,504
I can attest that a single BB2 driven by a Quilter BB800 or a Bergantino B|Amp or a Sonic Farm/MAS Tantra can handle any of those amps at full power and be quite loud. That being said none of them are providing 800- 1000 watts into 8 ohms and since they are flat out they get a a little flabby ( the amps that is and power amp distortion into a speaker is neither pretty sounding or good for the speaker). When driven by a Crest ST-2000 in bridged mono mode (1200 watts at 8 ohms) the cabinet is a completely different animal. The added power and headroom allow it to open up and provide serious volume and still be dynamic, it will not flinch when accenting notes at loud levels. You wouldn't want to play non-stop 1/8 or 1/16 notes at an extreme volume ( you have to give the voice coil a break to cool down some) but in most situations it will handle anything you throw at it. Running two of the cabs at 2400 watts bridged mono (4 ohms) is just beastly - I know, my ears hurt for days after doing this. I also kinda wonder how loud you guys are playing at gigs because with two cabs outdoors I am not anywhere near pushing this kind of power, I have experimented a couple of times to see how they handle it but it is too loud, or maybe I'm too old:smug:.
 
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#5,506
Stu_Bass said:
I can attest that a single BB2 driven by a Quilter BB800 or a Bergantino B|Amp or a Sonic Farm/MAS Tantra can handle any of those amps at full power and be quite loud. That being said none of them are providing 800- 1000 watts into 8 ohms and since they are flat out they get a a little flabby. When driven by a Crest ST-200 in bridged mono mode at 8 ohms the cabinet is a completely different animal. The added power and headroom allow it to open up and provide serious volume and still be dynamic, it will not flinch when accenting notes at loud levels. You wouldn't want to play non-stop 1/8 or 1/16 notes at an extreme volume but in most situations it will handle anything you throw at it. Running two of the cabs at 2400 watts bridged mono (4 ohms) is just beastly - I know, my ears hurt for days after doing this.
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This just blows my mind.... (Is there an exploding head emoticon?)
 
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#5,508
alexclaber said:
Actually that isn't our position. The recommended amp power ratings are not solely for clean tones or players able to use the volume knob judiciously. Use an 800W amp with a BB2 and push it as hard as you like and use as many FX as you like - the cab will make clear warning sounds (it goes from clean to obviously distorted and not in a pretty way) if you push it too hard. If you ignore those warnings then you might be unlucky enough to blow a driver but to do this generally requires abusive behaviour.

The voice coil in the 12XN can handle the best part of 600W continuously and to get this average level from a typical bass guitar signal you'd need getting on for 2000W of amp power, unless you're compressing it to death. 800W amps give you plenty of safety margin on a single 12XN. The 10CR cabs don't give as strong warning signs hence the more conservative power ratings and caveats about clean vs dirty tones but the flipside of that is they overdrive really nicely! :)
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I stand corrected and will edit my post. I remembered reading the clean tone warning but also, wrongly, extended it to both series in my mind.
 
#5,509
So, a bit of a departure from the discussion from the last few pages. I'm thinking of purchasing my second Barefaced cab (I already have a One 10 and it is fantastic for small venues and practicing.) and I'm trying to decide which way to go.

Background: I have been playing intermittently with small groups and doing the odd gig but nothing too loud or too serious so the One 10 was perfect. Recently I have run into a great group of musicians that wants to start playing seriously and adding some gigs. The styles will include Rock (prog, classic, alternative types of things), Country (classic and modern), and other Americana (blues, bluegrass, etc.). The drummer will have an electronic set and the guitarists will be rocking ss 212 amps at hopefully reasonable volumes. Drummer and vox will be through a small PA but the rest will be on our own.

Since the venues won't be huge and the small PA will determine the volume, would I be better off buying a matching One 10; a 12Ω Two 10 to go along with the one 10 I already have; or going with a bigger, cheaper, non-barefaced rig? I would go BB2 and just get it over with but I ain't got the euros.

I will also ask this question of Alex but I figured I'd start here and go from there.

Thanks for any insight you may have.
 
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#5,510
Some thoughts, with pros and cons:

BB2 - Pros: You think you can get by with one, outstanding sound quality, very high overall volume capability in a one cabinet solution, can handle any amount of power it sounds like you might throw at it; Cons: sounds like the price is a lot higher than you can or want to spend

12 ohm Two 10 - Pros: Less expensive than a BB2, the sound is similar to your existing One 10, can be combined with your existing One10 to make a modular rig (One10, Two10, or One10 + Two10); Cons: Hmmmm, not sure if there are any.

Another One10 - Pros: Modular rig combined with your current One10 and VERY light weight, there are several people in this thread who use a pair of One10s and their reports have been extremely positive; Cons: Less overall volume than the Two10 + One10 combination if you need extra volume.

Putting it that way, it looks to me like a Two10 looks like the best choice considering modularity, flexibility, and cost, and getting a second One10 would be a close second. It looks like a BB2 comes in last in this particular case, but only because of the cost rather than anything to do with sound quality or performance, which are off the charts!

I'm sure others would offer other opinions with different rationale, but this is at least one way to look at it. The good news is that you really can't go wrong! :D
 
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#5,511
dave64o said:
The good news is that you really can't go wrong!
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That is the truth. Thanks for putting the rest of it the way you did. I'm just worried that the 210 plus 110 will not be enough (I want it to be though). Another upside to a pair of 110s is that they are both small enough to be airplane carry-ons for when I move on the the next posting...the 210, not so much.
 
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#5,514
I wish I had the money for a new amp too but what I've got is what I've got. Just realized that I was calculating the ohms backwards and the One 10 would be getting way more power than each speaker in the Two 10...<insert expletive here>! So I guess it's either One 10 or one of the "super" cabs. I wanted to keep the cabs matching and avoid doing that but what the heck. As it stands, my amp is only a 250 watt anyway...
 
#5,515
The biggest problem with going to a Two10/One10 stack is that you are not really increasing your volume that much. I think it's a 3db gain each time you double the surface area (1 driver to 2, 2 to 4, etc.) I posed the same question to Alex a while back and he said that it was probably not going to give the results I was hoping for.

As many of you know, I have a pair of One10's that I dearly love, but I have been hankerin' for bottom end, more thump, than those great little cabs can deliver (or was even designed to give) so I am now on the hunt for the 12XN550 of my dreams. Narrowing it down to an SC (which I could double if needed), an ST or a BBII.

These are great dilemmas to have!
 
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#5,517
Cowboy in Latvia said:
Unless, like me, you have only about 500-800 euros a year to spend on musical gear and need volume now...this might mean that I'm out of the Barefaced game for a few years. I love the sound of my One 10 but it seems it's not made with modular use in mind.
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I don't understand? A pair of One10s will go way louder than a single One10 - they're absolutely designed for modular use. I don't know the statistics but a lot of One10 owners have a pair of them.
 
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#5,518
alexclaber said:
I don't understand? A pair of One10s will go way louder than a single One10 - they're absolutely designed for modular use. I don't know the statistics but a lot of One10 owners have a pair of them.
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Absolutely. The most modular solution around. You can even have four One10s to stack to get 2 Ohm rig or use just one or two of them.
 
#5,519
If I'm looking for a sonic match, I have a coice of exactly one cab. Yes, that's technically modular but if it is being discouraged for other users, it doesn't make it modular in a useful way like the rest of the range is. I mean no offense because I limited myself and have nobody else to blame. I will also continue to buy barefaced in a few years. For now though, it is not looking like a useful solution.
 

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