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Playing note for note.
- Thread starter Ric5
- Start date
This and the others are all great examples of how to own a cover song.
I think it comes down to two band mindsets:
1. We are playing to a specific audience who expects and appreciates hearing "the most popular version," or some reasonable facsimile, so we are as faithful as possible to that version, making allowances for "extended mixes," solos, segueys, medleys, etc. in the process.
2. Our audience comes to us; we have the chops and creative playing/arrangement skills to re-work and own a cover if we so desire in such an irresistably listenable way that most people who hear it will appreciate it.
The trouble is, IME, there are a lot of bands who are shooting for the wrong category, or really don't belong in either, and they just...sound...bad.
Meh, I don't know about that. Many, if not most, of these "top bands" were cover bands at one time themselves and their later recordings of covers once they made it were very likely covers they played their way prior to getting the contracts.
Aerosmith didn't write "Train Kept A-Rollin'", neither did the Yardbirds nor did Johnny Burnette and the Rock and Roll Trio. It was Tiny Bradshaw back in 1951. Covers of covers of covers. Ya know what I mean? Trivia: "Train Kept A-Rollin'" was the first song Led Zeppelin ever played together.
To me it goes like this :
1 - Cover band :
a) They cover the song like it was on the record.
b) They rearrange in different style that doesn't make sence like they do a cover in a salsa style then another in a rock style, while the song was a pop song ... they just doesn't have any direction at all. At least if they turned all their cover into rock, that would make more sense to me.
2 - Original band that throw a cover :
In that case it make sense to rearrange a song to fit their style. If they are a metal band and they do a cover of a stevie wonder song ... of course they will do it in a metal fashion ... they won,t be stupid enough to do a cover in a pop style while the reste of their songs are metal.
1 - Cover band :
a) They cover the song like it was on the record.
b) They rearrange in different style that doesn't make sence like they do a cover in a salsa style then another in a rock style, while the song was a pop song ... they just doesn't have any direction at all. At least if they turned all their cover into rock, that would make more sense to me.
2 - Original band that throw a cover :
In that case it make sense to rearrange a song to fit their style. If they are a metal band and they do a cover of a stevie wonder song ... of course they will do it in a metal fashion ... they won,t be stupid enough to do a cover in a pop style while the reste of their songs are metal.
If it were a "play it note-for-note" or "originals only" choice for life - I'd rather be one of those "pub-gig-silver-haired-but-definately-not-talented-just-doing-it-for-a-laugh" guys you see at some point in EVERY british pub that does music than play note for note, and part of me would rather die before that happened...capiche?
(i.e. I'd rather give up completely than do note-for-note covers)
(i.e. I'd rather give up completely than do note-for-note covers)
When a song becomes a standard, it doesn't really make sense to talk about it in terms of "cover" any more. Nobody in the jazz world worries about who first recorded any of the dozens of standards that any competent jazz combo would be able to play. Now obviously that's a very different world that the world of Friday night bar bands, but there are songs that have reached that same status, e.g., "Mustang Sally". Sticklers can argue over whether the preferred or proper version is Mack King or Wilson Pickett or the Commitments but for most people, that doesn't matter because "Mustang Sally" has become a standard.
Of course, there is no litmus test to tell when a song reaches that status, but when you get into "covers of covers of covers" you're probably close.
Of course, there is no litmus test to tell when a song reaches that status, but when you get into "covers of covers of covers" you're probably close.
So, I guess there is no veredict on this issue, is there?
I do agree with the one that said that it depends on the song, genre or whatnot.
Perhaps there is also creativity and talent involved. If someone can creatively and skillfully place some new chop/ riff within a popular song and no one notices, or almost everyone is cool with it... then I see no problem deviating from the note-to-note approach.
And maybe, when deviating from the original, maybe we should all keep it short (i.e. 90% faithful, 10% interpretation or something like that)... someone said this before too.
I do agree with the one that said that it depends on the song, genre or whatnot.
Perhaps there is also creativity and talent involved. If someone can creatively and skillfully place some new chop/ riff within a popular song and no one notices, or almost everyone is cool with it... then I see no problem deviating from the note-to-note approach.
And maybe, when deviating from the original, maybe we should all keep it short (i.e. 90% faithful, 10% interpretation or something like that)... someone said this before too.
There never was going to be a "verdict." Opinions on both sides of the issue are equally valid. The appropriateness of a band's solution is situational. For some venues/crowds/bands either approach is a possibility.
Was not aware we were speaking specifically about basslines here. I shall make sure that I adhere to the unmentioned parameters of a thread the next time I post.
BTW: The bass line is definitely not note-for-note regarding the original recording:
This sort of sums it for me, although I am not silver haired
Respect to those who are disciplined and dedicated enough to play note for note and respect to those who just like playing live recognisable music in their own way, if it keeps the audience and yourself happy then job done
I like to play things "my way", except for those rare cases where there's a riff that's so recognizable to the average casual listener that they'd notice if it was missing or played "wrong".
There are plenty of songs that I learn note-for-note, though, even if I never actually play them that way. I find it a bit of a challenge sometimes, plus I can pick up some little things all the time that I can use somewhere else later. Sometimes, when I first learn something, I'll learn it note-for-note, get that down, & work from there.
There are plenty of songs that I learn note-for-note, though, even if I never actually play them that way. I find it a bit of a challenge sometimes, plus I can pick up some little things all the time that I can use somewhere else later. Sometimes, when I first learn something, I'll learn it note-for-note, get that down, & work from there.
the Beatles got their start doing covers. Playing 6 to 8 hours a night in Hamburg, 7 nights a week, means you do a LOT of covers. They didn't have that many original songs in those days. Listen to the BBC recordings, the Decca audition recordings, their recordings with Tony Sheridan. They are known for being the ultimate "originals" band, but they were also a great cover band. They adapted the cover songs they played to their lineup, and instrumentation. They learned things from those covers; Case in point: Paul admitting that the bass line to "I Saw Her Standing There" (Original title, Seventeen) was nearly note for note from an old Chuck Berry tune, or that "I'm Down" is musically almost identical to Ray Charles' " Baby What I Say".
For myself, learning a bass line note for note allows me to get inside the head of the guy (or gal) who recorded it originally. I don't have to continue to play it note for note, unless I want to. Learning not just the notes, but the phrasing, the subtleties and nuances of the notes played, can be quite educational. I can and do incorporate that information into other lines. Sometimes, a bass line is just so good as it is, it shouldn't be messed with. Other times, there is a lot of room to interpret it differently. Whether it is better or not is for others to judge.
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For myself, learning a bass line note for note allows me to get inside the head of the guy (or gal) who recorded it originally. I don't have to continue to play it note for note, unless I want to. Learning not just the notes, but the phrasing, the subtleties and nuances of the notes played, can be quite educational. I can and do incorporate that information into other lines. Sometimes, a bass line is just so good as it is, it shouldn't be messed with. Other times, there is a lot of room to interpret it differently. Whether it is better or not is for others to judge.
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+1.
It's an education in itself, style, feel, tone, harmony, ear training, positioning, note choice approaches. You can evolve the lines yourself later if you choose to.
There is a time and place for everything, but doing the hard work pays off in a lot of ways imo/ime.
Given a cover song, some bands counldn't sound close to note-for-note on their best day, practice or not.
In orchestra practice or performance, we opened the pages, and played it as written-unless we miss a note, or three. Same idea, some people don't want to play cover songs, or make excuses for playing it their way instead of like the original version.
I've spent the past decade playing country (old, new, alt, etc) in a 3-piece and a 3+1 setting. Long story short, many of these songs were originally recorded with a full set of studio cats and a top-notch engineer tying it all together. Basically it is impossible to play the original arrangements and/or the original bassline without the whole thing falling apart. The trick is coming up with a new arrangement/bassline that gives the vibe of the original tune. Or, you can just do like the Kentucky Headhunters and just turn 'er way up!
