Powered subs-QSC vs EV

[dustybottoms]

Fwiw I tried the EV ELX series speakers because they were cheaper than the qsc. One of the speakers completely stopped working after 3 gigs and was being used in a very typical situation. I wouldn't even say they were being pushed hard. I returned them and got the qsc. It may have been some sort of strange defect with that particular speaker but that was my experience and enough to lose me as a customer.

 

[dskissel]

With the qsc subs it sounds like the kw181 are the way to go? I'm in a punk band and it sounds like the K subs don't cut it.

 

[nutdog]

Fwiw I tried the EV ELX series speakers because they were cheaper than the qsc. One of the speakers completely stopped working after 3 gigs and was being used in a very typical situation. I wouldn't even say they were being pushed hard. I returned them and got the qsc. It may have been some sort of strange defect with that particular speaker but that was my experience and enough to lose me as a customer.

Good point. I hope the sub holds up. There isn't much online for live sound, mostly dj. But of the reviews I've seen there's only one negative in regard to reliability. EV is a solid brand. The non-powered versions have been around a long time and these have been out now 3 or 4 years. But, yeah, I feel very comfortable with the qsc quality.

 

[Medford Bassman]

Even at 88lbs, the KW18 isn't bad to tote to gigs. The wheels are good quality

 

[Tunaman]

My seller for the Yamaha CW118Vs dropped out... now we have a pair of Mackie SRS1500 active subs. I'm not expecting exciting things

The people I bought these from said the JBL PRX 718s were WAY better they just upgraded too. Need a healthy input signal though.

 

[modulusman]

I had a pair of SRM1500 subs when they first came out. They didn't seam to have a lot of note definition just kind of mushy sounding. We upgraded to the SRM1501 subs when they came out and it sounded much better.

 

[drummer5359]

I'm a drummer who has always owned PA gear. I had big, heavy, old stuff for the most part. Playing in two acoustic trios I supplied the PA for one and we used the front man's Fender Passport 350 pro in the other one for vocals and acoustic guitar only. I hated the sound of the Fender, but he is comfortable with it and it saved me hauling the big stuff out of my practice room.

In December I got a call to sub on drums for a classic Rock/oldies band. They have a Presonus Studiolive digital board running through a QSC K-12s and a K-Sub. WOW! Someone mentioned at the beginning of this thread that the sound is high fidelity, that is a great description. When you add in the advantages of the light weight, the QSCs are tough to beat. I have looked at and listened to the competitors, some of them are getting close. But I still think that the QSCs are worth the money.

So...

I've been selling stuff that I don't use. (cymbals and guitar amps for the most part...) I am putting together a Presonus/QSC system of my own to use with my acoustic projects. I'm now a full member of the aforementioned classic rock/oldies band and I'm totally sold on the sound.

In service industries there is an old saying, "pick two".

You can get quality work done.
You can get work done fast.
You can get work done cheap.
You can't get all three together, pick two...


It struck me as I'm buying PA gear that a similar philosophy applies.

You can get PA gear that sounds great.
You can get PA gear that is lightweight.
You can get PA gear that is cheap.
You can't get all three together, pick two...

 

[GregT]

Lifting 50lb buckets in and out of my car is no problem. Lifting the 90lb mackie sub is doable but I have to psych myself up for it and I ain't getting no younger.

I'm planning on using the k10's for solo acoustic stuff and adding the subs for band in small rooms. We don't get super loud.

I sold 3 QSC K12s, 2 K8s, and a K Sub when Bose finally.....finally.... made the B2 sub. It goes down to 40Hz with ease and although it absolutely is not for everyone (yes we know), It has been the best PA move of my life. I have the L1 1s, not even the biggest model. I wouldn't be mentioning the Bose if I hadn't re-read the OP's original post. I use it for my one man band and it does great. It is also perfect for the solo acoustic stuff. I am not talking about the L1 Compact or the L1 Model II. I have the L1 1s with the B2 Sub.

 

[nutdog]

My seller for the Yamaha CW118Vs dropped out... now we have a pair of Mackie SRS1500 active subs. I'm not expecting exciting things

The people I bought these from said the JBL PRX 718s were WAY better they just upgraded too. Need a healthy input signal though.

I had a pair of SRM1500 subs when they first came out. They didn't seam to have a lot of note definition just kind of mushy sounding. We upgraded to the SRM1501 subs when they came out and it sounded much better.

The church has two mackie 15 subs. I'm not sure which models. They're not the same but look almost identical. One is in the sanctuary and one is not used. I've used one and both on gigs and thought they were nice for the kick but muddy on bass. Then we got mixers with HPF. High passing really cleaned up the bass. I like the mackies now but don't want to carry them.

You can get PA gear that sounds great.
You can get PA gear that is lightweight.
You can get PA gear that is cheap.
You can't get all three together, pick two...

Seems about right.

I sold 3 QSC K12s, 2 K8s, and a K Sub when Bose finally.....finally.... made the B2 sub. It goes down to 40Hz with ease and although it absolutely is not for everyone (yes we know), It has been the best PA move of my life. I have the L1 1s, not even the biggest model. I wouldn't be mentioning the Bose if I hadn't re-read the OP's original post. I use it for my one man band and it does great. It is also perfect for the solo acoustic stuff. I am not talking about the L1 Compact or the L1 Model II. I have the L1 1s with the B2 Sub.

Looks like the B2 and the zxa1sub are about the same size. When I looked at the bose stuff my impression was it would get very expensive to outfit an entire band.

I had a 20% coupon that expires today so I took the plunge and ordered a second EV.

 

[nutdog]

After the second gig I'm sold on this system for our purposes. It obviously wouldn't do for purple dub death metal or a drug infused rave. Well, maybe a small drug infused rave.

The load:

This time I had the power cable crate, mic/cable bag, extra bass and extra guitar.

The venue:

Very swanky place. I've got a thing going on with the owner's daughter, which is how we got the gig.

Nice stage and lcd light setup. View from mic:

After sound check:

I did most of the setup without assistance since the other guys couldn't leave work early. I arrived at 4:15 and finished at 5:15 which included some social interaction and briefing on how to operate the light system. Sound check was over at 5:30 and we started playing at 6.

I was initially concerned it wouldn't cut it because of the four industrial fans blowing from above. They provided a high ambient white noise level to overcome. However, my concerns were unmerited. We were told to turn down during sound check and during a raucous smooth jazz version of Boston's "Smokin".

We received many compliments and a bonus, which is always nice. Even some dancing which I didn't expect from a Tuesday night gig. I credit the open bar.

We finished playing at 9 and by 9:20 everything was ready to go in the car. The next day I asked my kids to help unload the car and a 14 year old boy carried the sub in by himself.

 

[Tunaman]

nice

 

[Marley's Ghost]

We will be running a pair of the ZXa1 12' mains and subs at our next gig. First time with a powered front line. I can't wait. One XLR cable to rule them all.

 

[nutdog]

I'll be interested to hear your report. I still think the little subs are great. We had an outdoor event at church with a bonfire in front of us and games behind us. I set the two subs with a top facing toward the fire and the other right next to it facing us as a monitor. It did way, way better than I expected. I like not having to deal with room reflections.

 

[4Mal]

I like the K sub a lot. I have a single K and a pair of 181's. not too mention 4 PAS TOC 1x18's for reggae Fest ;-). There are some places where monster overstated bass doesn't work . The K sub seems very musical to me. Yes it rolls off a little early but it does so in a nice, polite way... It's still going at 40, just not full tilt.

 

[musicman7722]

Just sold my 2 K12 subs and bought a KW181, should be here soon.

 

[kringle77]

I use a single JBL prx618xlf and only the kick goes through it. Sounds great, not bad to move with two people but, sometimes I'd rather have a pair of the EVzxa1's instead. They probably wouldn't put out as much as the one JBL but, I know they would sound good. A friend has 4 of them.

 

[nutdog]

There are some places where monster overstated bass doesn't work .

YES!

Just sold my 2 K12 subs and bought a KW181, should be here soon.

I still like the KW181.

I use a single JBL prx618xlf and only the kick goes through it. Sounds great, not bad to move with two people but, sometimes I'd rather have a pair of the EVzxa1's instead. They probably wouldn't put out as much as the one JBL but, I know they would sound good. A friend has 4 of them.

To me it's the same principle as a modular bass rig. We can do one small sub, two small subs or one big sub, depending on the gig. One thing worth mentioning is that the subs crossover at 100hz. The tops are really doing a lot of the work for bass. The K10's work well but IMO the k12's handle the bass guitar significantly better.

If anyone wants to hear what a mediocre weekend warrior band sounds like through kw vs ev here are a couple of clips using a zoom q3hd. No bass rig, everything through the PA and monitors except the fill in lead guitar player heard "outdoor gig" and insisted on bringing his 412.

KW181 + K12's at pool party:



zxa1's and k10's inside:




Both subs do their jobs well, I think.

 

[4Mal]

Oh yeah. I had a single 181 and a pair of K12's wound up a few weeks back. Avg of 100 with peaks at 103 + at the board. It was freakin' loud down by the band. The KSub would not have hung nearly as well. The 181 is a bone crusher if necessary.

 

[Marley's Ghost]

One thing worth mentioning is that the subs crossover at 100hz. The tops are really doing a lot of the work for bass.

Couple questions.

1) Where would you see the ideal xover freq in this setup? 100 or less is usually where the bass and kick would go if you are using a stage rig with mixer and external xover.
2) I'm considering patching the kick and bass into the subs and using the 100hz low cut on the mains - not daisy chaining them together. As opposed to using the EV xover. Seem legit?

 

[4Mal]

In the QSc setup, I would use the internal crossover but drive the sub from an AUX. Kick and bass are in the AUX as well as in the main. In the K series stuff the lpf is in the sub and the hpf is in the top. Not sure how the EV is designed. The PRX line I believe has the full x-over I the sub. Inherently less flexible and to do aux fed subs requires an external crossover from what I see. (At least that is how my PRX 612's worked.)

If the hpf is built into your tops box then it sounds like you can use a similar approach to mine. In reality you are using the crossover...