Rattle Can Refinish Club

[murphy]

So, long post.

I'd bought one of those super cheap Ray4 basses back in late 2021. Like the bass, hate the look. The MM pickguard really does look just like a toilet seat.

Plus the flat black finish was not overwhelming anyone with any sort of intrinsic awesomeness. It's a serviceable finish but that's really about it.

Let's see what we've got in the old paint crate. Oh look!

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A decade-old can of Rustoleum lacquer (not their enamel) and some spray nitro lacquer.

January 9: dismantle the bass and bag up the parts.

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Let it sit until February 12, because of laziness. February 12, get out the sander and body filler and go to town.

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You will note that there's some filler in places that aren't screw holes. I got this for cheap as it took a hard dive off the hanger in Guitar Center. No time like the present to fix those up.

Also a word about their factory finish: unlike most polyurethane, it's SUPER thin and fairly brittle. Not even sure it's poly TBH. Don't know what it is, but if it IS poly, they did a great job with it.

Put it on a stick, sprayed it red, sprayed on...not that much clear coat. Far thinner than normal. That will end up affecting how I treat it on the other side quite a bit.

I normally do a couple of coats a day for a week. I live very close to the beach so I've got to watch the humidity or I'll get blush. I spray outside, we don't have much in the way of bugs or blowing grit or anything like that. Then walk it into the open garage to outgas. I don't spray in the garage because we have a gas-fired water heater, I prefer not being blown up.

Cure for six or so weeks.

April 24, 2022: Rubout and buff time. Gonna do it all by hand so as not to go through my very, very thin nitro finish. Wet sanding:

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Rubbing compound. Oh, this will look nice.

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Also got rid of their hideous bridge and just popped in a cheap Fender-style bridge with brass saddles. New pickup as I want to run VVT, passive, parallel coils and not in series. Does it make bass-type noises?

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Yes it does. And voila:

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One MusicMan bass with no pickguard and a much improved finish. And my shop dog, of course. He supervised everything.

EDIT: a few notes.

1. Shooting old paint can be risky but this stuff was just fine.
2. VVT passive MM pickup has a great, beefy, clean tone that is not anything like a standard MM sound. Worth investigating if you like clean bass tone.
3. Yes, there is a third strap pin. I put it there as the bass tends to neck dive a bit otherwise.
4. I will be gigging this weekend after this one, so we'll see just how good the sound of this is in a real-world situation.

I'm gaga over your red Stingray...stunning creation.
Now change those hideous tuners to the proper sized and your work will be complete....

How did you get such an epic glass like finish..with no orange peel?
I always get my most satisfying finish only by sanding through the last coats ...usually exposing part of the wood again....

 

[arbiterusa]

How did you get such an epic glass like finish..with no orange peel?

The east (and correct answer) would be “work five years for a famous boutique acoustic builder as the sole finish guy” but I realize that’s not a terribly helpful answer for you, so I’ll type out the general procedure tomorrow.

SPOILER: it involves anywhere from “a lot” to “a mind-blowing amount” of sanding. A hard block is essential, a random orbit sander is incredibly helpful if you’re doing it on a regular basis. A mirror finish starts from the wood up. Or in this case, from the previous finish up.

 

[friskinator]

Like I said last I tried it

the black melted with the glitter FX clear coat View attachment 4673466View attachment 4673467

Use a basic color/clear combo if you try again. No glitter or special clear. Make sure that all the products are compatible.

 

[arbiterusa]

How did you get such an epic glass like finish..with no orange peel?

OK. The answer is always "a lot of prep". In this case, since it's a refinish and there was no compelling reason to strip the old finish (there rarely is on a solid color finish) prep involves filling the holes and then sanding everything dead flat with a block, down to about 400 grit. A couple of clear coats to seal, then color, then a minimum of 12 clear coats.

Not thin ones, either. Orange peel usually means that you're not spraying enough onto the surface. And yes, it is a VERY fine line between adequate and too much (runs!) and you don't ever want to have runs, so orange peel is the better alternative. My personal goal for spraying is to get enough lacquer onto the body so that the end I started with is still wet by the time I get to the other end. This minimizes orange peel. Practice helps. It took me several hundred instruments and a few months to get spraying down.

But no matter what you will not have a mirror surface when you're done spraying. That's why I do the wet sand (600/1000/1200 grit) then buff. The wet sand to finally completely level the surface, the buff makes it shiny.

--------------------

If you're starting with raw wood and not a refinish this gets harder. Wood sanded flat with block/random orbit sander down to 400 grit. That wood is the base of your "mirror". It's got to be flat and not have any sanding scratches.

Tape off of binding etc, anything you don't want dye or filler on. Then dyes if needed, let dry, then fill with wood grain filler.

I like paste filler but some of the younger guys here in Luthier's Corner are using epoxy with wonderful results. I'm gonna give that a shot one of these days. Either then run off the excess grain filler or (if epoxy) sand flat with a block.

Couple of coats to seal so that it won't get all crapped up by handling. And then you can just clear coat if it's a wood grain finish, or shoot a burst and then clear coat, or shoot color and then clear coat.

If you made it to the end of all this, you may note the one word I did not use is "primer". Primer is for cars, not wood.

 

[murphy]

OK. The answer is always "a lot of prep". In this case, since it's a refinish and there was no compelling reason to strip the old finish (there rarely is on a solid color finish) prep involves filling the holes and then sanding everything dead flat with a block, down to about 400 grit. A couple of clear coats to seal, then color, then a minimum of 12 clear coats.

Not thin ones, either. Orange peel usually means that you're not spraying enough onto the surface. And yes, it is a VERY fine line between adequate and too much (runs!) and you don't ever want to have runs, so orange peel is the better alternative. My personal goal for spraying is to get enough lacquer onto the body so that the end I started with is still wet by the time I get to the other end. This minimizes orange peel. Practice helps. It took me several hundred instruments and a few months to get spraying down.

But no matter what you will not have a mirror surface when you're done spraying. That's why I do the wet sand (600/1000/1200 grit) then buff. The wet sand to finally completely level the surface, the buff makes it shiny.

--------------------

If you're starting with raw wood and not a refinish this gets harder. Wood sanded flat with block/random orbit sander down to 400 grit. That wood is the base of your "mirror". It's got to be flat and not have any sanding scratches.

Tape off of binding etc, anything you don't want dye or filler on. Then dyes if needed, let dry, then fill with wood grain filler.

I like paste filler but some of the younger guys here in Luthier's Corner are using epoxy with wonderful results. I'm gonna give that a shot one of these days. Either then run off the excess grain filler or (if epoxy) sand flat with a block.

Couple of coats to seal so that it won't get all crapped up by handling. And then you can just clear coat if it's a wood grain finish, or shoot a burst and then clear coat, or shoot color and then clear coat.

If you made it to the end of all this, you may note the one word I did not use is "primer". Primer is for cars, not wood.

You rock ...and very kind of you to write such a detailed instruction.
I agree with you in that I found a heavier coat leaves a nice deep shine...but yes..watch out for a drop too far that starts to run..

My fail comes with sanding through the last coats I did...as it always seems much thinner on the edges of the instrument...Good job I love the relic look.....But, not my intended results.......and then

Polishing and buffing...I bought an orbitol polisher..., but still never gets the brand new deep shine I want, but always ends with a hazy look

What am I doing wrong.....Wrong polishing compounds? They were recommended....

I try hand buffing and get better results, but never like you guys here....

 

[arbiterusa]

Polishing and buffing...I bought an orbitol polisher..., but still never gets the brand new deep shine I want, but always ends with a hazy look

I use Turtle Wax red rubbing compound, white rubbing compound, and polishing compound, with a final of just regular Turtle Wax. I used t shirts, one for each grade of compound, and a lot of elbow grease.

 

[murphy]

Anyone ever try a shell pink ?

There is this for sale

For Sale - American Professional Jazz Body

I may at some point sell my Flea Jazz body..

 

[PeaveyPlayer]

Is 2 oz of paint enough?
Through spraying with a compressor ?

 

[PeaveyPlayer]

Anyone ever try this?

 

[murphy]

Anyone ever try this?

Did you look at solo music link I sent you

There whole refinishing section has everything you need

And they are Canadian
I'm always ordering stuff from there

 

[PeaveyPlayer]

Did you look at solo music link I sent you

There whole refinishing section has everything you need

And they are Canadian
I'm always ordering stuff from there

Only thing is solo music is all nitro ? I don’t want it cracking lol
I have a nitro finish MJT body and all though it’s really nice for a vintage vibe. Id rather it not wear badly

 

[PeaveyPlayer]

Got some paint mixed local! Already reduced

 

[mercbass]

 

[Sub-hoo-fer]

The journey continues. I posted the “pre” pics of my first refinish a few pages ago. This is where it is now.

Question for the collective wisdom. The third pic shows a pretty bad flub. Is that a complete do over situation? If not, what would everyone recommend?

 

[Reedt2000]

The journey continues. I posted the “pre” pics of my first refinish a few pages ago. This is where it is now.

Question for the collective wisdom. The third pic shows a pretty bad flub. Is that a complete do over situation? If not, what would everyone recommend?

You might be able to lightly sand that back to flat and keep coating. Won't know till you try.

 

[Sub-hoo-fer]

You might be able to lightly sand that back to flat and keep coating. Won't know till you try.

what grit would you recommend? At this point I have gone out and bought just about every grit there is getting ready for this project.

 

[Reedt2000]

what grit would you recommend? At this point I have gone out and bought just about every grit there is getting ready for this project.

I'd probably start with 400 (dry) and a really flat sanding block. It will take some time, but any heavier grit and I'd be concerned about the size of the scratches left behind.

 

[friskinator]

View attachment 4692461 View attachment 4692462 View attachment 4692463 The journey continues. I posted the “pre” pics of my first refinish a few pages ago. This is where it is now.

Question for the collective wisdom. The third pic shows a pretty bad flub. Is that a complete do over situation? If not, what would everyone recommend?

If that's just paint accumulation, flat sanding is the best tactic. If it's under the paint, you'll always see it unless it's corrected.

 

[Sub-hoo-fer]

Thank you @Reedt2000 and @friskinator. The goof is in the paint. My PaintIt2000 Pro Paint Destination Detention Device (ie makeshift handle made out of a coat hanger) slipped and the wet paint hit cardboard

really appreciate the help!

 

[Sub-hoo-fer]

Thank you @Reedt2000 and @friskinator. The goof is in the paint. My PaintIt2000 Pro Paint Destination Detention Device (ie makeshift handle made out of a coat hanger) slipped and the wet paint hit cardboard

really appreciate the help!

i think I am back on track! I let it sit 5 days and hit it with 400. I was not really happy with the result so then I got after the high paint spots with 240. Then I went over the whole surface with 400 and shot it again. Depending on how it looks after this I may move on to clear. I am not aiming for perfect so anything minor may remain. Thanks for the help!