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Sealed Crossfiring 6x10 build

#81
Ok, after several hours of comparing my cabs and Lomo's awsome fearful cab with varying amounts of eq, I've decided that the sealed 6x10 crossfire is a go! There are a few things that swayed me. 1)As good as the fearful is, and it is good, I always can hear the seperation between the woofer and mid. It actually sounds clearer but, it bugs my ear and Im always trying to fill that hole in un-successfully. Having a single woofer produce everything always sounds more cohesive and solid to me. 2)When I slap and pop a note on the G string, the betas naturally compress the note alittle where, the fearful will give you that "thwack!" sound which, is accurately producing what the bass is putting out. I like the compression of the 10" betas. 3)I prefer the slight growl/crunch/distortion you get from running a speaker full range. That character really helps cut through live. Thats also why so many like the sound of bag end and eden cabs. 4) There is one thing I can't explain. I've noticed that when playing through a single 15" speaker and walking around the room, there seems to be areas where low mids are more and less pronounced. With a multi-10 loaded cab, those frequencies are more even and solid everywhere in the room. This is about the 5th 15" loaded cab that I've noticed this with. That was a big deciding factor for this cab as well. Don says that he's about 5 weeks out from starting the cab so, I should have it by the beginning of June. I will probably shoot for a cab that is 22.5" wide, 35.5" tall and 16.5" deep. That should give me the proper tuning after subtracting the internal volume needed for the drivers to crossfire at a 135 degree angle.
 
#83
I whole heartedly agree with points 2 & 3. I haven't played the cabs you mention in point 1, so apart from the Berg NV215 -which I loved, can't really comment.
Also, probly agree with point 4 also, but haven't the range to test.
But I love the sound of my bass all coming outta the driver best too.

If I dared, I'd TRY taking the tweeter out of the equation in my Berg AE112's too. Coz I love my NV412 lots too.
Maybe someday.
 
#85
+1.
in my personal 'version' of a 1212/6, i eperimented ALOT massaging the XO so that the transition from the 3012LF's to the 6.5 was seamless. it basically sounds like a full range (45-6Khz) dual 12 cab that's capable of high SPL as well as having some real low end if it want it to. i've also tested it with an electric guitar with a deluxe reverb amp pushing it and it can sound like a regular 12x12 guitar cab too.
 
#86
Lomo, thanks so much for letting me borrow your cab and for the beer! Both good. :) When I plugged into your cab I was hit by the "oh yeah, now I remember" feeling. Awsome, clear, powerful sound. I thought to myself " what was it that I didn't like about these cabs?" I could have played a gig with it right then and been fine. But, it's kind of like you and the love you have for your walkabout amp. If you have something that always works for you and that you are most comfortable with, there probably is a good reason. A sealed multi-10 loaded cab is what I always prefer. So now I am going to have the best version of one that I can. For me of course.

About the crossover. Yes, at home with other cabs I've used dsp to get the sound seemless and it is awsome but, the other points still hold more weight with my decision.
 
#88
Pretty close. I used some mattress foam to block one of the ports as greenboy suggested in it worked fairly well. The feel isn't really the same. Sealed cabs just have some sort of springy, tight response that ported don't. Im not going to argue with anyone anymore about this point.
 
#90
kringle77 said:
Pretty close. I used some mattress foam to block one of the ports as greenboy suggested in it worked fairly well. The feel isn't really the same. Sealed cabs just have some sort of springy, tight response that ported don't. Im not going to argue with anyone anymore about this point.
Click to expand...

Try a transmission line for the sealed response you like and improved speed but the added bonus of bottom end re-enforcement (at least +6 dB at line resonance). Much better cone control in the bass too for improved power handling.
 
#91
I've owned some EA transmission line cabs. Good stuff but it still didn't have the same sound/feel as a sealed cab. I've settled on this design after spending thousands of dollars and years trying to get that sound with other types of cabs. Im not experimenting and going broke anymore. I know what works for me at this point. Thanks for the suggestion though. I plan to use the beta 10a drivers but, if either of the webers sound better to me, I may use them or mix an match. Three separate sealed compartments will allow me to get away with it.

So, I played two gigs this week with the berg back in stock mode, using a 31 band graphic eq to get rid of clack and add some top end. It sounded good. I'd be lying if I said that didn't still slightly prefer the sound of the cab using that jensen 8" mid but, I did notice a slight improvement in low end and power handling. I expected that. My pair of sealed 1x10 cabs loaded with beta's seem to have a clearer sound than the berg but, there's no way to tell how much that has to do with cancellations from having 6 drivers all crammed together. Im going to stick with the stock drivers and most likely sell the berg when the new cab is done and stick with the new one until Im too physically broken to move it.
 
#92
I have to admit I am a fan of a large mid for pro sound. One of my cabs uses a 10" mid crossed over really low (1st order 250 Hz up to 3500Hz) which is enough to prevent fart outs and excessive intermodulation distortion but I know it will break up above 2 kHz before handing over to the tweeter. To my ears with bass guitar, I prefer the seemless lower to upper mid area with a single driver so I know where you are coming from. Using a smaller mid crossed over higher does tend to change the character of the sound as you go through the transition and for hi fi or anything else with a much cleaner mid to high frequency response, I think the smaller mids crossed over higher work well.

The EA boxes are compromised transmission lines (even mine are not true TL but hybrids). It is possible to minimise the reflex effect and maximise the TL effect by design which makes it seem to sound like a sealed of reflex with all the advantages of both and none of the disadvantages of each. The trouble is, you have probably never tried a true transmission line to compare with. These can also be built with multiple drivers.

I also suspect you have tried many flawed (some may say defective) reflex boxes which has put you off.
 
#94
This sealed 610 crossfire build is an interesting one and makes sense the way it addresses your tonal preference. Not to derail, but I'd like to throw this in because of the role your 8x8 played in one of your earlier builds. This 5.3 ohm, 135 degree crossfired 6x8 is front ported and improves the dispersion and placement issues of the 8x8. This size would also be pretty easy to handle. It probably wouldn't quite cop that sealed cab vibe but the Faital 8PR200 low end should be pretty tight and solid. It's frequency coverage seems very good for bass and the displacement-limited power handling is incredible.
RMH608CF.jpg
 
#96
While I am waiting for Don to start this cab I ordered a faital pro 6fe200 mid to try, just in case I wanted to use them in this cab. It would then be a 6x10/2x6. Im still also waiting for the webers to arrive. Im pretty sure that the cab will end up being 6 betas but, if the webers added a nice top end, I may use two of those. If not, I may add two mids. Fine tweeks going on while I wait.
 
#97
5StringPocket said:
This sealed 610 crossfire build is an interesting one and makes sense the way it addresses your tonal preference. Not to derail, but I'd like to throw this in because of the role your 8x8 played in one of your earlier builds. This 5.3 ohm, 135 degree crossfired 6x8 is front ported and improves the dispersion and placement issues of the 8x8. This size would also be pretty easy to handle. It probably wouldn't quite cop that sealed cab vibe but the Faital 8PR200 low end should be pretty tight and solid. It's frequency coverage seems very good for bass and the displacement-limited power handling is incredible.
RMH608CF.jpg
Click to expand...

See my Crazy 88 post - this saves me drawing this one out :-) looks like a barefaced version!
 
#99
Those Faital 8's are one of the best performing 8's you're going to find for bass guitar but they don't come cheap. Greenboy and Mike Aronpol (sp?, sorry Mike) are onto something good with their singles and doubles, get past that, and there are other cheaper/more effective ways of getting the sound and output without laying out the cash for 4/6/8 of them, IMO, although, a little double Crazy88 mini column would be quite the cool rig, but, they're still in the same ballpark as common 10's. If 4 isn't enough...4 just isn't enough.
 
#100
Those 8's do have a great tone and range but, for the money and output, 10's are working for me. For the last 5 years I've been trying to get my sound out of lighter and smaller gear but, I would have been happier and richer if I just would have stuck to what works for me. 10" drivers in a sealed cab. I may add a mid or extra eq to tweek things in perfectly but when you get right down to it, thats my sound. Im not fighting it anymore. Im going to sound good and just play. Im going to give my wallet a break too.
 

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