• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Sealed Crossfiring 6x10 build

#101
kringle77 said:
Those 8's do have a great tone and range but, for the money and output, 10's are working for me. For the last 5 years I've been trying to get my sound out of lighter and smaller gear but, I would have been happier and richer if I just would have stuck to what works for me. 10" drivers in a sealed cab. I may add a mid or extra eq to tweek things in perfectly but when you get right down to it, thats my sound. Im not fighting it anymore. Im going to sound good and just play. Im going to give my wallet a break too.
Click to expand...

Smart man.

I haven't followed your whole "saga" step by step, but thinking about it, you have gone through an incredible amount of stuff. I remember the 8x8 that was sold shortly after, etc.

+1 to giving your wallet a break and just liking what you like, man. I still think your little sealed 15/8 is a cool rig, man. I could double that up and do any gig I do with it.
 
#102
I also think you're onto something with this crossfire sealed cab. It makes me wonder a wee bit if I shouldn't have gone through with the 810 Ampeg clone version but I looked at the cash outlay, and more cab than I needed, and just said....nope. It wouldn't have been for me and I don't think I could've sold enough people on the dispersion benefits to make it worthwhile. Most guys who are into that seemed to be for the most part into just loud "RAWK" and not too concerned with finer details like that.

+1 to this build and here's hoping it's the one.
 
#103
thanks will. Yeah, I still love my sealed 15/8. No complaints. A pair would probably do most gigs for me ok but, I really like having the extra headroom. I would LOVE to have a pair of sealed 1515/8 cabs to run. Tone and output like crazy. You could run a pair of the 4 ohm eminence 15's in series for an 8 ohm cab. Alright, lets stop right here before I have a pair of those built!:)
 
#104
Out of curriosity I modelled the CA154 in a 46 liter sealed box(same as my 15/8) and compared it to a beta 10a in a 24.4 liter sealed box(same as my new cab/berg nv610) and the tuning plots lay almost exactly on top of each other. Pretty cool. I was thinking about replacing the delta 15lf with a ca154 to get a 4 ohm load anyway. I may really do it now.
 
#105
Ok, my curiosity got the better of me. I ordered a CA154 to try in my 15/8 cab and will be trying out a faital pro 6fe200 as a mid. Im wondering if the faital pro or an eminence alpha could keep up with a pair of CA154 drivers wired in series for an 8 ohm load? The specs say that the mid would be about 2db less sensitive but, that may not bother me since I have the jensen mid in my cab dial down halfway. Im going to try crossing over at 1khz where an alpha would pair up better and maybe let the woofer growl alittle bit. My webers should arrive at the end up the week or early next week. After comparing all the different drivers I will be able to make a confident decision on this cab. The sealed 15/8 does have a clearer sound with less eq than the beta 1o loaded cab but they both have alittle bit of their own magic going on. An 8ohm sealed 1515/6 may be a really great cab for me and cheap to build. I'd then have the option to run a pair of them at loud gigs or outdoors. Probably be around 75lbs each.
 
#107
The CA154 is has a sensitivity of around 97db all the way to the 1khz crossover point. If I ran two of these in series, would I be correct to assume that the cab would still be 97db? And therefore a single 95db mid could be run wide open with good results. Im thinking that an eminence alpha could keep up with a pair of the CA154's with a crossover at 1khz? On my 15/8 and the other Nfearful cabs I've tried, I've always had the mid attenuator no higher than halfway.
 
#108
The pair would run 100db whether in series or parallel, all you're changing is the impedance shown the amp and crossover. IMO a mid that runs 97ish db from about 1khz - 5khz would be a good match for that to my ear and wouldn't need to be padded back in the crossover network.
 
#109
I thought that going from 4 ohms to 8ohms I would lose 3db but gain 3 db since there would be two drivers in close proximity, therefore give you a relative 97db to a mid. ??? I thought thats how billfitzmaurice described it to me before?
 
#110
kringle77 said:
I thought that going from 4 ohms to 8ohms I would lose 3db but gain 3 db since there would be two drivers in close proximity, therefore give you a relative 97db to a mid. ??? I thought thats how billfitzmaurice described it to me before?
Click to expand...

Going from 4 to 8 would reduce SS amp power, meaning it might play 2-3db quieter at the same volume setting, but the pair would still make a 100db sensitivity speaker system. Bump the volume slightly with the 8ohm load and you're back to where you were with the 4ohm load. It might be noticable at lower volumes. Playing louder, you'd be hard pressed to hear a difference.
 
#111
You might want a parallel connection in there if you're running a tube amp, just for a margin of safety in case you blow a woofer, the other one would still be there to show the amp some sort of load until you can get things shut down. With a pair in series, when one goes, the circuit is open and you'd essentially be cranking the amp with no load on it, that can smoke them. With SS, it's a non-issue. May be over worrying a littke there, I can't even remember the last time I blew a speaker.

I think the series connection also makes the voice coil inductance additive or something, might roll off a bit of high treble but I think that would happen higher than the driver can play anyway so likely a non-issue there as well.
 
#112
I looked it up again and you lose 3db going from 4 ohms to 8ohms, but you gain 3db by having them next to eachother so, a pair of ca154 drivers in series would still be about 97db. A pair of them in parallel would gain 3db when going to 2ohms and gain 3db more being near eachother. I guess thats why two mids are used on the 151566 cabs.
 
#113
I've been playing around with different cabs for a few days and Im 100% sure that I'll using beta 10 drivers in a sealed crossfiring cab. The webers finally arrived and I compared them. The 10fl is definitely THE vintage ampeg 8x10 replacement driver. Good top end, better power handling than the jensen equivalent. The 10fh is heavier duty and sounds a bit like the beta. It has more top end and a similar mid and low range. It probably handles more power than a beta as well. A really good sounding bass driver. It actually sounds a bit like an eminence b810 with better midrange and tighter lows. I like it anyway. An 8x10 with 4 of each would sound pretty damn good. But, I like the betas because they sit in the middle of the two and are very easy to get in short notice in case of a breakdown. So, it's alittle bit of the sound and alittle bit of the commoness of the betas that I like. My last experiment will be to try a pair of morel soft dome tweets with the betas. I would like to get just a bit of top end clarity without boosting the eq too much. It's kind of the difference between changing your stings or being able to get one or two more gigs out of them before you change them. If they don't do it for me I'll go ahead with 6 betas or maybe get stupid and go for an 8x10. :hiding:
 
#114
And the saga continues....:)

You got the Webers there, follow your ears. Can't predict anything about them from this end. I don't know about the soft-dome tweets, but you have a really good point about beta's. IE:, easily obtainable/replacable/common, and getting you most of the way there.

It's possible you're getting into little nuances here that will change from room to room, gig to gig. May want to find a "middle ground" and go with that......nuances are cool.:cool:
 
#115
Im definitely getting into the fine details here. The betas sound great and get me 95% of the way there. The best live sound I have ever consistantly had was running 5 betas full range with a hi-passed jensen mod8. The 8 was barely on but added a nice clarity and sense of excitement to the sound without being brittle. It made a pretty big difference live and in every room. Im trying to replicate that but don't really want to add a pair of 8's to the new cab. If I wanted a cab that big, I'd just suck it up and run 8 betas. If the dome tweets can get me there, great. If they sound good I wouldn't have to have an attenator because a pair would only be about 93db. Six betas would be around 100db. It may be just enough extra air up top. The crossfiring thing is going to be a big step forward for this cab. If you are starting from scratch, why not explore all the possibilities? I really don't want to have a large cab built and then later wonder "what if I had just......."
 
#118
Tweets forward firing at the top of the baffle, or crossfired as well? Forward firing would be "proper" as far as combing, etc., but it seems mounting them towards the inside of the angled baffles would better match the dispersion pattern of the rest of the cab. Another nuance.
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back