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Sealed Crossfiring 6x10 build

#121
Nope. I already went that same route experimenting with my berg. Im getting better results with the direction Im heading in now. Also, I can replace parts easier/cheaper. The only thing that makes me envious about that cab is the weight. I live too far away from most tb'er to come see me play but, if there are any locals that do want to, please come on down and check out my rig when it's done. Then they can tell me if I am missing the boat or not. Upstate NY, 13662. My band is called "10 Cent Green". There are a few clips of us on youtube somewhere but it was when i was going direct to the board and pretty well medicated. So, no rig to critique on the clips.
 
#123
kringle77 said:
Nope. I already went that same route experimenting with my berg. Im getting better results with the direction Im heading in now. Also, I can replace parts easier/cheaper. The only thing that makes me envious about that cab is the weight. I live too far away from most tb'er to come see me play but, if there are any locals that do want to, please come on down and check out my rig when it's done. Then they can tell me if I am missing the boat or not. Upstate NY, 13662. My band is called "10 Cent Green". There are a few clips of us on youtube somewhere but it was when i was going direct to the board and pretty well medicated. So, no rig to critique on the clips.
Click to expand...

You went that route with stock eminence crossovers dude. No comparison :)

Wish you luck with your build of course.
 
#124
Thanks for the well wished RP. I have to very respectfully disagree somewhat. It may not be anywhere the crossover that barefaced will use but, it was still in the same design ballpark and i did run experiments at home using the dsp in my crown power amp so, I have a really good idea what to expect from the 69er, if it ever is released. And I'll tell you, it wouldn't be worth 3 times the cost of what it would take me to have LDS build it for me either. Thats just my opinion of course. And, the dispersion still won't be as strong as this crossfired cab. I've used crossed over mid cabs live and I've crossfired cabs live as well. The crossfire had stronger mids of axis and the sound had more of the growl that I like because I got away with using one way speakers. I have proven my theories at actual live gigs many times over but I still get flack from some guys on here or other forums. Thats ok though, Im getting the results that I want while building a cab for a half to a third of the cost of some other cabs. I feel pretty good about it! :) I'll post more after getting the soft dome tweets.
 
#125
I didn't want to leave anyone hanging on my 15 driver experiments so here is a clip from my sealed 15/8 thread:

I just popped an eminence CA154 into my 15/8 cab and wow! I really like it! On top of gaining 3ds by going from 8 ohm to 4 ohm, the driver is also about 2db more sensitive to begin with. I have the mid turned all the way up now and it's perfect. I could actually play some of my gigs with this cab now. It has a cleaner sound sound than the delta 15lf but goes louder and lower. Really nice.

Im still going ahead with the sealed 6x10 crossfire as my gigging cab but this was a really great surprise.
 
#126
The Legend is a really nice driver and far better suited for that than the DeltaLF. I'd have to agree with RP on the stock crossovers. I'm not that great with passives yet, but I've wrestled with the 3-ways in my PA cabs, switching drivers countless times to get a match that plays well with them. The lowly Alpha6 turned out to be by far the best of the bunch, just needs a 3-4db lift in the eq to match the others. They serve the purpose as far as driver protection, but don't come close in tone to a well-done, purpose built XO.

I don't know what flack you're getting over some of this stuff, but if your ears are happy, who cares. Nice thing about DIY is you only have to please yourself.
 
#129
I've played four gigs in familiar rooms since putting my berg back into full stock mode and using an eq to get the top end right. I've found that it sounds good at home but just doesn't cut through with the ease that the cab did when I had the mod8 mounted as a mid. I basically just reminded myself why that combo worked so well and that I definitely need something along with the beta 10's for the top end. I could use a pair of mod8's and be done with it but, that will add too much more height to the cab, probably about 42" total. I'd like to go no taller than 40". I was playing around with the faital pro 6fe200 and the mod8 tonight with a sealed 15 and the sealed 6x10 berg. The mod worked so well with the berg because the 10's put out all the tone and growl but had the mod to add the top end projection. The 6fe200 sounded great fully crossed over to the 15. Im hoping that the soft dome tweets work well with the betas to accomplish the same thing but I have my doubts. If they don't work out, the 6fe200's could be stuffed into a cab with the betas for a total height of around 40". I'd probably hipass them at around 1khz and run the 10's full range. Although, since the faital mid has more of a full growly character than the mod8, maybe I would actually like the sound of a full crossover at around 1khz.
 
#130
I am so stupid. I had both of my mod8 mids out and experimenting when I realized that one of them, the one that I've done all my exeriments with is actually a C8R !!!!!!!!! Parts express sent me the wrong one way back when so I had lds use it in my 15/8. I thought something was off. So, it's rhe C8R that I really like. I knew that the frequency response chart wasn't jiving with my ear on this one.
 
#131
between experiments with 15's and 10's

have you ever tried 12's?
more sensitivity would be found with a 12. But its still possible to cram em inside a crossfire box.

plus im guessing you would only need 4 instead of 6.
and if your content with a 40" tall cabinet.

Why not have a crossfire 4x12 somewhere in the 26 to 34" tall zone.
and then plop a PA Audio PH-4530 or PH4525 horn on top of it.
with a suitable driver. for highend.

likewise if your going to cross over high with 10's, use a smaller horn. spend money on a better driver than buying something like 8 or 10 softdomes.

should be pretty much a SUNN 610L with a tweeter.
not much different than 6x10 with a tweet.
just a crossfire layout instead.

Old designs upgraded with a tweeter....simple
I like simple but at least your content with using so much EQ
and level matching.
 
#132
The very last driver that I will be testing out is the jensen C10R. A pair of them would be run in series and hi passed at 500hz. That would match up really nicely with the sensitivity of six beta's and add the perfect amount of top end. That would be in a 44" tall 8x10.

The three cabs that Im deciding between is
-6x10 with two soft dome tweets
-8x10 using six betas and two C10R's
-2x15/2x6 using a pair of eminence CB158's and two 6fe200's (thats just a wild card choice, great sound but seems to be missing the fullness of multiple 10's)

If I had to bet money on it, I'd say that the 8x10 is going to sound the best but be more than I really want to move.
 
#133
Update. Got to try the soft dome tweets. The most beautiful top end that I've ever heard but, they are nowhere near sensitive enough so, I'll be doing the 8x10. As long as the jensen C10R drivers sound right I will be using them in very small, sealed, crossfired chambers, hi-passed at around 500hz. Now, if I crossfire everthing I will have enough internal volume to match my NV610's tuning. If I only crossfire the top pair of 10's and leave the six bets straight, I will gain enough internal volume to make the cab tune pretty much flat without changing external dimensions. Will there be any advantage to crossfiring all drivers or, would I be gaining more by adding internal volume? This is pretty much my last decision
 
#135
Yes. It will also make more internal volume for the other woofers. Instead of having 4 separate chambers, the top two tens would be in a very small chamber and the six betas would share the internal volume. Instead of having four separate chambers, each internal brace would come 2/3 of the across the width of the cab and there would be room behind the mid chambers to add to that. So, not would I be adding top end, vastly improving dispersion but I would have enough available internal volume to flatten out the wide 0.9db hump centered at 150hz down to about 0.2. It would also lower the f3 about 5hz and extend the lows slightly. All good accomplishments I think.

So, any advice on crossfiring all 8 drivers vs. only the top two?
 
#136
If you're running mids/top through the beta's, crossfire the whole cab. If you're lowpassing them at 500, then horizontal, straight forward would be ok.

I wouldn't worry about some tenths of a db rise, you won't hear it. If the rise is under 2db, it'll sound smooth.
 
#137
I plan to run the betas full range, but POSSIBLY low pass them at 2khz to get rid of any clack. The betas peak hard between 2k and 3k. So, when you boost the treble, you get is but also a mega amount 2-3k. So, If I just low passed the betas at 2k, it would still be better to crossfire?
 
#139
kringle77 said:
I plan to run the betas full range, but POSSIBLY low pass them at 2khz to get rid of any clack. The betas peak hard between 2k and 3k. So, when you boost the treble, you get is but also a mega amount 2-3k. So, If I just low passed the betas at 2k, it would still be better to crossfire?
Click to expand...

Yes. Side by side, they'd start beaming similair to a 20-22" driver. Good idea to filter the clack off the top, your guitar drivers would likely sound better up there.
 

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