Skjold speaker cabinets ROCK!!

[alexclaber]

Front.
IMHO rear ports are too limiting because they don't work on large stages or outdoors.

Groan...

Alex

 

[tombowlus]

Tom B., I believe you know of this as well. It's only a matter of time before this builder makes this new line available.

The resemblance is beyond uncanny. It may very well be the exact same line of cabinets, and this same company is going to build them for Skjold.

A good attorney knows how to keep his mouth shut.

I am, however, authorized to say that Pete is not directly manufacturing these cabs, and they are being OEM'd by another company for Pete. I can also say that Pete was heavily involved in the design of the Skjold cabs, and that these cabs are specific to him and that the manufacturer will not offer identical cabs under a different brand name.

Tom.

 

[Vic]

A good attorney knows how to keep his mouth shut.

I am, however, authorized to say that Pete is not directly manufacturing these cabs, and they are being OEM'd by another company for Pete. I can also say that Pete was heavily involved in the design of the Skjold cabs, and that these cabs are specific to him and that the manufacturer will not offer identical cabs under a different brand name.

Tom.

I think it's also safe to "release" that at least some of the drivers Pete is using will be custom as well, so to maybe add a bit to Tom's comment, it's not just the enclosure that's unique to Pete, it's everything.

 

[tombowlus]

I think it's also safe to "release" that at least some of the drivers Pete is using will be custom as well, so to maybe add a bit to Tom's comment, it's not just the enclosure that's unique to Pete, it's everything.

Good point. That's what I was getting at.

 

[Vic]

IMHO rear ports are too limiting because they don't work on large stages or outdoors.

Groan...

????

Hey, just IMHO based on personal experience. I don't claim to know what everyone likes.

My big problem with rear ports are when you can't use the reflection the rear ports depend on (AFAIK, anyway). If there's too much open space, all you really hear at that point, besides the bass coming from the FOH (which is pretty much pure mud on stage), is the "direct" sound from the front of your cab(s), and if they're rear ported, IMHO, they sound thin in those cases as compared to front ported cabs.

FYI, I welcome differing opinions, and even correction if need be, but it sure seemed that way to me when I tried to use rear ported cabs...

 

[Vic]

Good point. That's what I was getting at.

Yeah, I hope it didn't sound like counterpoint, it was intended as just a little bit of an add-on.

 

[Blues Cat]

Front.
IMHO rear ports are too limiting because they don't work on large stages or outdoors.

Correct! Finally, someone who subscribes to my theory of rear porting.

People are still making rear ported cabs.

 

[j-raj]

A good attorney knows how to keep his mouth shut.

I am, however, authorized to say that Pete is not directly manufacturing these cabs, and they are being OEM'd by another company for Pete. I can also say that Pete was heavily involved in the design of the Skjold cabs, and that these cabs are specific to him and that the manufacturer will not offer identical cabs under a different brand name.

Tom.

hmmm... they still look like LDS cabs... there I said it, LDS!!

 

[Blues Cat]

????

Hey, just IMHO based on personal experience. I don't claim to know what everyone likes.

My big problem with rear ports are when you can't use the reflection the rear ports depend on (AFAIK, anyway). If there's too much open space, all you really hear at that point, besides the bass coming from the FOH (which is pretty much pure mud on stage), is the "direct" sound from the front of your cab(s), and if they're rear ported, IMHO, they sound thin in those cases as compared to front ported cabs.

FYI, I welcome differing opinions, and even correction if need be, but it sure seemed that way to me when I tried to use rear ported cabs...

When the the sound gets thin outdoors you tend to compensate by cranking the bass. If you're running a line out the soundman hates it & the musians behind & slightly to the side get hammered w/bass that you'll never hear.

I had a chance to test this theory last Christmas at an outdoor service w/a rear ported ampeg. The nearest wall was 80ft away. I had to crank the bass which sent to much to FOH. I had to set the amp to indoor EQ and get a 4 foot rack door to place behind it w/a blanket around it to keep it from rattleing. Couldn't wait for the gig to be over.

Vic, you must have some good ears. Tech guys will argue all day that bass is omni directional.

Yea, except for when it's fired backwards out of a port.

 

[tombowlus]

hmmm... they still look like LDS cabs... there I said it, LDS!!

Survey says!!!










XXX

Wrong answer!

 

[cheezewiz]

LOL! I know who's making the Skjold cabs, and it AIN'T LDS!

 

[j-raj]

Survey says!!!

XXX

Wrong answer!

Still looks like 'em, tho.

....OK, Berg + LDS= Skjold Cab?

 

[KJung]

Correct! Finally, someone who subscribes to my theory of rear porting.

People are still making rear ported cabs.

Zillions of posts on this.... no convergence on opinion.

My experience is that cabs with rear ports that are tuned very high (and hence have directional sound coming out of the port) like the Bag End small 115's seem to be much more 'room dependent' than other cabs, and sound absolutely terrible without something behind them, and also sound more boomy than traditionally ported cabs when lodged in a corner.

However, cabs like Acme's that are tuned very low and have those 'omnidirectional long waves' or whatever theyare coming out of the port, are much less problematic, and don't really behave differently than front mounted porting.

This is only from my experience owning these two cabs and other front ported cabs over a lot of gigs... I surely don't have the EE credentials to back this up, and I admit what I experienced with the Bag Ends could be due to something else (general poor cab design, the high roll-off of those cabs that needs a room to 'fill out', etc., etc.).

 

[j-raj]

LOL! I know who's making the Skjold cabs, and it AIN'T LDS!

ok... ok... Jorg is doing 'em, right?
(j/k Tom )

 

[Vic]

When the the sound gets thin outdoors you tend to compensate by cranking the bass. If you're running a line out the soundman hates it & the musians behind & slightly to the side get hammered w/bass that you'll never hear.

I had a chance to test this theory last Christmas at an outdoor service w/a rear ported ampeg. The nearest wall was 80ft away. I had to crank the bass which sent to much to FOH. I had to set the amp to indoor EQ and get a 4 foot rack door to place behind it w/a blanket around it to keep it from rattleing. Couldn't wait for the gig to be over.

Vic, you must have some good ears. Tech guys will argue all day that bass is omni directional.

Yea, except for when it's fired backwards out of a port.

IMHO, it's a cardinal sin to send a "wet" signal to FOH, and this is a perfect example why. This will never happen to me. My stage rig is STRICTLY for stage monitoring, and THAT'S ALL. I want to be able to control my stage sound w'out worrying about screwing up the production folks (I'm dead set against that). YMMV, IMHO.

 

[KJung]

ok... ok... Jorg is doing 'em, right?
(j/k Tom )

 

[alexclaber]

My big problem with rear ports are when you can't use the reflection the rear ports depend on

They're not dependent on any kind of reflection - the ports are tiny, the sound wave is huge, therefore the sound is omnidirectional.

Correct! Finally, someone who subscribes to my theory of rear porting.

A theory? One of those logical ones that says because air is blowing backwards, so too must the sound be blowing backwards only... Hmmm...

When the the sound gets thin outdoors you tend to compensate by cranking the bass. If you're running a line out the soundman hates it & the musians behind & slightly to the side get hammered w/bass that you'll never hear.

I had a chance to test this theory last Christmas at an outdoor service w/a rear ported ampeg. The nearest wall was 80ft away. I had to crank the bass which sent to much to FOH. I had to set the amp to indoor EQ and get a 4 foot rack door to place behind it w/a blanket around it to keep it from rattleing. Couldn't wait for the gig to be over.

Vic, you must have some good ears. Tech guys will argue all day that bass is omni directional.

Yea, except for when it's fired backwards out of a port.

Great test. I'm sure it would have made a whole lot of difference if you plugged the rear port and cut an identically sized port in the front baffle.

My experience is that cabs with rear ports that are tuned very high (and hence have directional sound coming out of the port) like the Bag End small 115's seem to be much more 'room dependent' than other cabs, and sound absolutely terrible without something behind them, and also sound more boomy than traditionally ported cabs when lodged in a corner.

However, cabs like Acme's that are tuned very low and have those 'omnidirectional long waves' or whatever theyare coming out of the port, are much less problematic, and don't really behave differently than front mounted porting.

This is only from my experience owning these two cabs and other front ported cabs over a lot of gigs... I surely don't have the EE credentials to back this up, and I admit what I experienced with the Bag Ends could be due to something else (general poor cab design, the high roll-off of those cabs that needs a room to 'fill out', etc., etc.).

I'm not sure of the tuning of those Bag Ends but I can't see it being high enough to cause directional port output. I think what you're seeing more of is a shortage of low bass, some mid-bass hump, and therefore a boom when the cab is in a corner and those inevitably boomy mid-bass frequencies are accentuated. But as always Ken, you make the point with clarity and open-mindedness.

However this kind of 'theory' and 'evidence' just isn't helpful - it spreads misinformation and prejudice. The fact of the matter is that ANY bass cab takes advantage of boundary reinforcement indoors - whether sealed, front or rear ported, horn or transmission line - and when you get outdoors you will really miss that boundary reinforcement. If you have rear ports, then you may blame it on them - but its not just them that's missing the boundary reinforcement, so too are the woofers. And the rear ports are still contributing to bass out front.

Acoustics really isn't that complicated - but it's not intuitive, so so-called 'logical' home-grown theories may make sense, and be supported by imprecise anecdotal evidence, but that doesn't mean these theories are correct.

Alex

 

[Blues Cat]

Zillions of posts on this.... no convergence on opinion.

My experience is that cabs with rear ports that are tuned very high (and hence have directional sound coming out of the port) like the Bag End small 115's seem to be much more 'room dependent' than other cabs, and sound absolutely terrible without something behind them, and also sound more boomy than traditionally ported cabs when lodged in a corner.

However, cabs like Acme's that are tuned very low and have those 'omnidirectional long waves' or whatever theyare coming out of the port, are much less problematic, and don't really behave differently than front mounted porting.

This is only from my experience owning these two cabs and other front ported cabs over a lot of gigs... I surely don't have the EE credentials to back this up, and I admit what I experienced with the Bag Ends could be due to something else (general poor cab design, the high roll-off of those cabs that needs a room to 'fill out', etc., etc.).

Congratulations, you now have convergence.

 

[Biker4Him]

ok... ok... Jorg is doing 'em, right?
(j/k Tom )

Really , and I thought they were being built by Madison.. and soon to be released the Skjold Hydra!!

 

[KJung]

I'm not sure of the tuning of those Bag Ends but I can't see it being high enough to cause directional port output. I think what you're seeing more of is a shortage of low bass, some mid-bass hump, and therefore a boom when the cab is in a corner and those inevitably boomy mid-bass frequencies are accentuated.

+1... and I meant it when I said I wasn't sure about this at all (and am less sure the more I learn about all this stuff on the site). It could be for a ton of other reasons other than the rear port, and your explanation makes a lot of sense. I also never felt that the rear ported Acme's I had behaved any differently than other cabs regarding position in the room, etc.