Enjoy the benefits of a premium membership!
Upgrade Account
-
TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
Join free Log in
Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.
solid state vs tube
- Thread starter jay43
- Start date
With hybrid amps, it all depends on the entire circuit. Some amps with a single preamp tube are gimmicky, and some, especially those with 2 or 3 12AX7's, (though not all), actually do provide a "tubey warmth". For certain, Mesa's Walkabout falls in that tubey camp, while their Carbine series, much less so.
Tubes are much more my thing. When I plug into an SVT or B-15, the world just seems right. However, I'm finding the lure of micros to be a bit too much to resist. I never liked lead sled SS and hybrid because I never thought it sounded or felt tube-like. Used to use them but never got along very well with them. But micros, especially Ampeg micros, while not quite the same as the real thing, have a lot more of what I like about tube amps.
Anyway, make up your own mind. I never picked an amp out by Talkbass consensus and I never will.
Anyway, make up your own mind. I never picked an amp out by Talkbass consensus and I never will.
For the past 3 years I was saying whatever, too. But once I got that Micro VR, and now the PF rig, I have to admit I'm not saying whatever as much as I once was. For me, the SVT and B-15 will always be king and nothing sounds better, and I certainly don't believe in compromising tone for schlep, but this new Ampeg micro stuff is so good that I'm having a hard time seeing exactly where I'm compromising. Sure, in a direct AB I could tell, but it's getting harder and harder.
Gaolee
Official leathers tester and crash dummy
I own several vintage Acoustic solid state amps. I like 'em and like the way they sound. Over the past few weeks, I have been able to play through several all tube rigs, and they sound good too. The tube amps were an older Ampeg, a Sunn, and a Marshal. They sound different, that's all. The old Acoustic 361 sounds great for what I do, and if anything, the tube amps were just a little harsher. The EB-2 sounds better through the old Acoustics and perhaps the P growls just a little better through tube amps, but I'm not completely convinced of that. It's just a little different.
It all comes down to what your ears like. My ears like tubes. I'm willing to suffer schlepping around heavy amps for that.
Whatever may work for you is fine. Find your place in the mix and get your groove on!
Whatever may work for you is fine. Find your place in the mix and get your groove on!
PART OF THE SOUND COMES FROM THE OUT PUT SECTION BEING TUBE AS WELL. BUT TUBE HEADS ARE A HASSLE TO SCHLEP. OTOH WITH A 100 WATT TUBE HEAD YOU CAN REPLACE A 300 WATT SOLID STATE HEAD. TUBES JUST SOUND/PUMP LOUDER.
Depending on the 100w tube head they can be a lot louder than 300w solid state or quieter. A Fender black face Showman relatively quite vs a Sound City or Marshal Super Bass which are super loud
It's all in the voicing. The Showman has the Fender tone stack which boosts bass and treble and cuts mids, and the Marshall doesn't have a lot of low end range, so it doesn't put as much wattage into the lows, which require more watts to amplify.
Er, that's true, but what's your point?
Anyway, tube, hybrid, solid state... none are really better, they're just different. There are a lot of really great amps of each type.
I think my D-180 sounds awesome, and is definitely a good amp for the sounds I'm going for, but even though it can get a wide range of tones... it's probably not going to sound like an 800RB... and even though the 800RB is a great amp, it's not going to sound like a D-180.
"Versus" is silly.
I have an SVT-VR 300watt all tube head, a Thunderfunk 420 solid state head, a 150 watt hybrid Musicman HD 150 with a ss-pre and full tube power section and recently got rid of a hybrid Aguilar DB750 with the tube pre and solid state power section. I think that covers about all the bases.
When I want to sound my best it's the SVT when I really don't care and am just in a hurry it's the thunderfunk, when I have to double up on the bass and guitar it's the Musicman (has a guitar channel and a bass channel). They all sound good and have a purpose but if I could only keep one it would be the SVT. In fact I did give up the Aguilar to get the SVT, never looked back.
When I want to sound my best it's the SVT when I really don't care and am just in a hurry it's the thunderfunk, when I have to double up on the bass and guitar it's the Musicman (has a guitar channel and a bass channel). They all sound good and have a purpose but if I could only keep one it would be the SVT. In fact I did give up the Aguilar to get the SVT, never looked back.
BurningSkies
CRAZY BALDHEAD
- Feb 20, 2005
- 27,956
- 20,350
- Disclosures
- Endorsing artist: Dingwall Guitars
Not just that, but at loud volumes, tube amps distort way more than solid state, which is why they appear to be so loud to everyone.
I like the harmonic richness of tubes but I don't like the distortion that comes through in tube amps when loud (the conceit there is that 'harmonic richness is another way to say 'pleasant harmonic distortion", which to me is different from power section distortion that you get when pushing a full tube amp at loud volume). the tube amp that people name check for clean and loud is the Mesa 400+, which I could never get as clean as I wanted it.
Also, at loud volumes tubes compress, which is great if that's what you want, but I look for high crest factor and low compression.
Had a Mesa 400+ all tube amp (ahhh, try $1,400!!!) and I never was satisfied with the sound. Too much mid range and I was never able to EQ it my liking. It did sound pretty good with a Stingray Bass for that "bark" kind of bass sound with heavy mids.
After 5 years with the Mesa, I went solid state. IMHO, solid state works very well with bass.
In reality, the Mesa was a 350 watt amp, 50 pounds and a pain in the ass! Try buyng 12matched power tubes..........YIKES!!!!! Expensive!
Tubes amps are very expensive, heavy, delicate, lower powered and finicky!!!!!!
I don't think an all tube bass amp exsists that has more than 400 watts. For high power amps, there is only solid state.
There are some bass amps with both a 12AX7 tube in the preamp and a solid state preamp too and a switch to use one or the other. That's pretty cool!
Tubes fail very slowly and it is difficult to hear the sound quality go down hill until it gets really bad. Tubes are very impractical!
Tubes are the BEST in amplification, guitar and stereo but for bass...............man!...........solid state works and sounds the best for me.
After 5 years with the Mesa, I went solid state. IMHO, solid state works very well with bass.
In reality, the Mesa was a 350 watt amp, 50 pounds and a pain in the ass! Try buyng 12matched power tubes..........YIKES!!!!! Expensive!
Tubes amps are very expensive, heavy, delicate, lower powered and finicky!!!!!!
I don't think an all tube bass amp exsists that has more than 400 watts. For high power amps, there is only solid state.
There are some bass amps with both a 12AX7 tube in the preamp and a solid state preamp too and a switch to use one or the other. That's pretty cool!
Tubes fail very slowly and it is difficult to hear the sound quality go down hill until it gets really bad. Tubes are very impractical!
Tubes are the BEST in amplification, guitar and stereo but for bass...............man!...........solid state works and sounds the best for me.
BurningSkies
CRAZY BALDHEAD
- Feb 20, 2005
- 27,956
- 20,350
- Disclosures
- Endorsing artist: Dingwall Guitars
In reality, the Mesa 400+ was sub-300w. Depending on the tubes and how well you biased, you're getting around 280w on a good day. Another company that likes to lie with their power ratings.
If you are looking for "clean and loud", you need to be talking to different people than the ones that pointed you to the Mesa. It's a nice amp, cops that syrupy Mesa thing well but by comparison to a lot of other all tube amps, "clean and loud" it ain't. IMO one of the more tonally colored and compressed "big" tube amps out there.
It can get some decent cleans at relatively low volumes though; how long did you own it before you gave up on it?
It sounds to me like you just prefer transistors, however if the tube amp you are basing your opinion of tube amps on is the 400+, you should probably try something that is a little less "flavored".
I'm not slamming the Mesa; it is what it is, and I personally like the tone it delivers and I'm certainly not the only one who does, but if you prefer a big dynamic, lots of loud and squeaky clean tone, try something that delivers those attributes.
BurningSkies
CRAZY BALDHEAD
- Feb 20, 2005
- 27,956
- 20,350
- Disclosures
- Endorsing artist: Dingwall Guitars
If you are looking for "clean and loud", you need to be talking to different people than the ones that pointed you to the Mesa. It's a nice amp, cops that syrupy Mesa thing well but by comparison to a lot of other all tube amps, "clean and loud" it ain't. IMO one of the more tonally colored and compressed "big" tube amps out there.
It can get some decent cleans at relatively low volumes though; how long did you own it before you gave up on it?
It sounds to me like you just prefer transistors, however if the tube amp you are basing your opinion of tube amps on is the 400+, you should probably try something that is a little less "flavored".
I'm not slamming the Mesa; it is what it is, and I personally like the tone it delivers and I'm certainly not the only one who does, but if you prefer a big dynamic, lots of loud and squeaky clean tone, try something that delivers those attributes.
I owned the Mesa for a number of years...I'm basing my opinion of tube amps based on the dozen or so I've owned over the years.
