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SPECTOR® Club - Part 57

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Lee! I LOVE this!!! Ok...on my iPhone 5 & new Apple ear buds (awesome BTW) your bass came thru loud and clear! It's a different tone...a solid hard two three punch in da FACE type of tone bro! :eek: I love the cuts and then POW here I am, I didn't leave! Awesome track Lee, awesome! :bassist:

I just got to listen as well, good stuff indeed!!!:bassist:
 
ok ive got to speak up about something that has been bothering me, if the tonepump is so great and so close to the tone of the infamous US9V why do the american spectors that don't have the US circuits have tonepumps instead of the Aguilar circuits? Only the Euro branded basses get the Tonepumps. Is it because the Tonepumps are Czech made and in order to keep it a truely American bass you put the aggies in? Not trying to create drama, its just a question that has been on my mind.

No worries. It's a good question.

The OBP-3 is like the USA 18v circuit. It is both JFET and op-amp based. It is also 3-band.

Unlike the USA 9v circuit or the TonePump, the OBP-3 is a much cleaner circuit offering a little coloration of the tone, so you get a more accurate expression of the wood combinations working with the pups and circuit.

The TonePump is much more gritty and growly. And is supposed to sound like the USA 9v.

Since bolt-on models typically have a noticeable difference in tonal profile from neck-thru designs, Stuart told me that he wanted to USA Bolt-On models to offer a different range of tone than the neck-thru models.

This was for two reasons. First, the wood (mahogany and a top of maple or some other tone-wood) and the frequency and sustain differences inherent in the bolt-on design would make it more difficult to sound identical to the NS-2 anyway. So why try?

It also meant that there's another tonal range, more traditional sounding in tone but still offering some extra sustain (with the deep pocket neck joint) and the high quality of the woods used that he could offer musicians who may not want an aggressive bass.

To many of us the beauty of the NS is the body, the tone is a bonus. To Stuart, it's about the tone. But he saw that offering the NS body with a more traditional bolt-on design and sound would be appealing to a lot of bassists who wouldn't look twice at the neck thru NS.

I think the decision was to broaden the appeal of Spector basses by offering something with that hand-made quality and a great tone, but making it different enough to not sound JUST like the neck-thru models. I mean, if you like that tone then why not get a neck-thru?

Lastly, Aguilar has been very responsive to Spector regarding the refinement of their circuits and more recently, their pickups (used in the Coda). I've actually done some photography work for Aguilar and I use their amps. They are good people with the same passion for making the best quality equipment possible that Stuart and PJ share.

Plus like Stuart and PJ, Dave and Dave (Boonshoft and Avenius) are both musicians and they love other musicians.

TonePumps can be put into any USA if you request. Like Rex Brown. He prefers the TonePump over the USA circuits. He's mainly playing Euro4LX models right now, but has an RX-T or two and usually plays one or two songs during Kill Devil Hill's sets with them. But they all have the same circuit, the TonePump.

He grabbed the white Euro4LX-Limited Edition model off the wall at NAMM and played it... walked it over to me (PJ was talking to someone) and said, "I want this. This one. This one right here... it's perfect." I said, "No worries." and he handed me the bass. And when PJ was done, I walked it over (Rex had gone over and was talking with Stuart) and I said to PJ, "Rex wants this." And PJ laughed and said, "OK!"

The RX-T has the TonePump in it stock. That's a USA model with the TP in it.

With Stuart the purpose of just about everything he does has to do with tone. He's fanatical about the sound of anything he makes.

I hope this answers your question!
 
I know what to call it...awesome music! :D :bassist:

Thanks ICE! I really appreciate the compliment and the feedback.

Both singles are getting mastered soon and everyone in the band has been tasked with putting in their "2 cents". I really value all of your opinions. I mean, we have soooo many talented dudes in here....pro's, engineers, producers and just dudes with awesome ears. I value every bit of feedback I get.

Can't thank you guys enough for that and the support.:bassist:
 
No worries. It's a good question.

The OBP-3 is like the USA 18v circuit. It is both JFET and op-amp based. It is also 3-band.

Unlike the USA 9v circuit or the TonePump, the OBP-3 is a much cleaner circuit offering a little coloration of the tone, so you get a more accurate expression of the wood combinations working with the pups and circuit.

The TonePump is much more gritty and growly. And is supposed to sound like the USA 9v.

Since bolt-on models typically have a noticeable difference in tonal profile from neck-thru designs, Stuart told me that he wanted to USA Bolt-On models to offer a different range of tone than the neck-thru models.

This was for two reasons. First, the wood (mahogany and a top of umaple or some other tone-wood) and the frequency and sustain differences inherent in the bolt-on design would make it more difficult to sound identical to the NS-2 anyway. So why try?

It also meant that there's another tonal range, more traditional sounding in tone but still offering some extra sustain (with the deep pocket neck joint) and the high quality of the woods used that he could offer musicians who may not want an aggressive bass.

To many of us the beauty of the NS is the body, the tone is a bonus. To Stuart, it's about the tone. But he saw that offering the NS body with a more traditional bolt-on design and sound would be appealing to a lot of bassists who wouldn't look twice at the neck thru NS.

I think the decision was to broaden the appeal of Spector basses by offering something with that hand-made quality and a great tone, but making it different enough to not sound JUST like the neck-thru models. I mean, if you like that tone then why not get a neck-thru?

Lastly, Aguilar has been very responsive to Spector regarding the refinement of their circuits and more recently, their pickups (used in the Coda). I've actually done some photography work for Aguilar and I use their amps. They are good people with the same passion for making the best quality equipment possible that Stuart and PJ share.

Plus like Stuart and PJ, Dave and Dave (Boonshoft and Avenius) are both musicians and they love other musicians.

TonePumps can be put into any USA if you request. Like Rex Brown. He prefers the TonePump over the USA circuits. He's mainly playing Euro4LX models right now, but has an RX-T or two and usually plays one or two songs during Kill Devil Hill's sets with them. But they all have the same circuit, the TonePump.

He grabbed the white Euro4LX-Limited Edition model off the wall at NAMM and played it... walked it over to me (PJ was talking to someone) and said, "I want this. This one. This one right here... it's perfect." I said, "No worries." and he handed me the bass. And when PJ was done, I walked it over (Rex had gone over and was talking with Stuart) and I said to PJ, "Rex wants this." And PJ laughed and said, "OK!"

The RX-T has the TonePump in it stock. That's a USA model with the TP in it.

With Stuart the purpose of just about everything he does has to do with tone. He's fanatical about the sound of anything he makes.

I hope this answers your question!

makes sense. I think of bolt on us spectors as kinda like a fodera and a Spector got it on and had a baby. so the cleaner sound makes sense. but that begs the question about the forte. it's got the obp2. why not the tone pump?
 
makes sense. I think of bolt on us spectors as kinda like a fodera and a Spector got it on and had a baby. so the cleaner sound makes sense. but that begs the question about the forte. it's got the obp2. why not the tone pump?

I would think for more variety. I know when I have talked to PJ, he has said over and over that they want variety, not the same tone in different packages. That was one of the reasons the euros went to the sandwich over all maple.
 
so the tone pump will give that classic growl (ala Eddie Jackson's Mindcrime tone?)

It can get you close but I believe Eddie ran one clean and one dirty channel to get that tone. Plus, there are rumors that one of the speakers were damaged which gave it that more of a distorted tone as well. Or was that for Empire?

If you listen to the isolated Jammit tracks, you can hear his tone much better and there is definitely something going on there. Here is a clip of one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2SYghg91jNA&feature=player_embedded

If you are contemplating changing out the OBP-2 in your Forte-X with a tonepump, I wouldn't just yet. You will be surprised how great the OBP-2 sounds in that bass. I believe Sam has recordings he made of his Forte 4 (which I now own) with both the OBP-2 and the 9V USA circuit and they both sound great.
 
No worries. It's a good question.

The OBP-3 is like the USA 18v circuit. It is both JFET and op-amp based. It is also 3-band.

Unlike the USA 9v circuit or the TonePump, the OBP-3 is a much cleaner circuit offering a little coloration of the tone, so you get a more accurate expression of the wood combinations working with the pups and circuit.

The TonePump is much more gritty and growly. And is supposed to sound like the USA 9v.

Since bolt-on models typically have a noticeable difference in tonal profile from neck-thru designs, Stuart told me that he wanted to USA Bolt-On models to offer a different range of tone than the neck-thru models.

This was for two reasons. First, the wood (mahogany and a top of maple or some other tone-wood) and the frequency and sustain differences inherent in the bolt-on design would make it more difficult to sound identical to the NS-2 anyway. So why try?

It also meant that there's another tonal range, more traditional sounding in tone but still offering some extra sustain (with the deep pocket neck joint) and the high quality of the woods used that he could offer musicians who may not want an aggressive bass.

To many of us the beauty of the NS is the body, the tone is a bonus. To Stuart, it's about the tone. But he saw that offering the NS body with a more traditional bolt-on design and sound would be appealing to a lot of bassists who wouldn't look twice at the neck thru NS.

I think the decision was to broaden the appeal of Spector basses by offering something with that hand-made quality and a great tone, but making it different enough to not sound JUST like the neck-thru models. I mean, if you like that tone then why not get a neck-thru?

Lastly, Aguilar has been very responsive to Spector regarding the refinement of their circuits and more recently, their pickups (used in the Coda). I've actually done some photography work for Aguilar and I use their amps. They are good people with the same passion for making the best quality equipment possible that Stuart and PJ share.

Plus like Stuart and PJ, Dave and Dave (Boonshoft and Avenius) are both musicians and they love other musicians.

TonePumps can be put into any USA if you request. Like Rex Brown. He prefers the TonePump over the USA circuits. He's mainly playing Euro4LX models right now, but has an RX-T or two and usually plays one or two songs during Kill Devil Hill's sets with them. But they all have the same circuit, the TonePump.

He grabbed the white Euro4LX-Limited Edition model off the wall at NAMM and played it... walked it over to me (PJ was talking to someone) and said, "I want this. This one. This one right here... it's perfect." I said, "No worries." and he handed me the bass. And when PJ was done, I walked it over (Rex had gone over and was talking with Stuart) and I said to PJ, "Rex wants this." And PJ laughed and said, "OK!"

The RX-T has the TonePump in it stock. That's a USA model with the TP in it.

With Stuart the purpose of just about everything he does has to do with tone. He's fanatical about the sound of anything he makes.

I hope this answers your question!

Patrick,

I always enjoy your "insider's knowledge"!!! It is one of the things that separates this club from so many others. I enjoy this club and the Sadowsky club (where Roger often answers questions, shares info, etc.) more than all the others because of that. Having that direct connection is so cool in both cases! I never get tired of even the most obscure Spector facts! :bassist:

Rob
 
Patrick,

I always enjoy your "insider's knowledge"!!! It is one of the things that separates this club from so many others. I enjoy this club and the Sadowsky club (where Roger often answers questions, shares info, etc.) more than all the others because of that. Having that direct connection is so cool in both cases! I never get tired of even the most obscure Spector facts! :bassist:

Rob

+ 1
Good to see you posting more in here Patrick. It's funny, I checked the thread and noticed I was behind, and I thought to myself 'wow, the threads back to moving at its usual pace!' :D
 
He did. And when I first started posting here... back in late 2009, the nickname for that circuit was "ToneDump".

And everyone hated on it.

Ironically, very few that hated on it knew about the output trimpot.

So I started trying to get people to step back and look at what that circuit really was. And after the TonePump video I did, people started going, "Oh!" and I'm happy to say most people understand that circuit better now.

Sam has done comparisons that show with the right output setting you can get the TP very, very close to sounding identical to the USA 9v.

Which is what PJ wanted to do. Better tech, very similar sound.

It can get you close but I believe Eddie ran one clean and one dirty channel to get that tone. Plus, there are rumors that one of the speakers were damaged which gave it that more of a distorted tone as well. Or was that for Empire?

If you listen to the isolated Jammit tracks, you can hear his tone much better and there is definitely something going on there. Here is a clip of one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2SYghg91jNA&feature=player_embedded

If you are contemplating changing out the OBP-2 in your Forte-X with a tonepump, I wouldn't just yet. You will be surprised how great the OBP-2 sounds in that bass. I believe Sam has recordings he made of his Forte 4 (which I now own) with both the OBP-2 and the 9V USA circuit and they both sound great.

Some Sound Clips.
Keep in mind with the 9V USA vs the Tonepump clips.
I had to add mid range in on the Euro4LX with the Tonepump to get it to sound similar.

The Treble Freq adjust on the Tonepump is at a higher/more harsh Freq on the Tonepump then on the 9V USA.

The Bass Freq adjust on the Tonepump is at a lower freqency then on the 9V USA.

IMHO the 18V version of the TonePump sounds a bit closer to the 9V USA, as the 18Vs is cleaning up and giving the EMG's more headroom so the the Tonepump sounds less griitty.

Forte with 9V USA Circuit
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

Euro4LX wired at 18V
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]
Euro4LX wired at 9V
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]


Here is another clip of the OBP-2 Vs the 9V USA
Forte 1st part of clip with OBP-2 then with 9V USA
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]
 
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makes sense. I think of bolt on us spectors as kinda like a fodera and a Spector got it on and had a baby. so the cleaner sound makes sense. but that begs the question about the forte. it's got the obp2. why not the tone pump?

Honestly I don't know.

I love the guys at Aguilar, but like many of you I'm a tone chaser. And the tone I fell in love with was the NS-2. And although the OBP-2 and OBP-3 are great circuits, they are too clean for my taste.

I'd prefer a Forte with the 9v USA and that wasn't an option, the TP would be my second choice. But again, that's just me.

Other than to set it apart from the Euro... and keep the components USA made...

That's something PJ could answer. The Forte was PJ's brain-child. He's been instrumental in many, many of the new models, new features, etc...
 
It can get you close but I believe Eddie ran one clean and one dirty channel to get that tone. Plus, there are rumors that one of the speakers were damaged which gave it that more of a distorted tone as well. Or was that for Empire?

If you listen to the isolated Jammit tracks, you can hear his tone much better and there is definitely something going on there. Here is a clip of one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2SYghg91jNA&feature=player_embedded

If you are contemplating changing out the OBP-2 in your Forte-X with a tonepump, I wouldn't just yet. You will be surprised how great the OBP-2 sounds in that bass. I believe Sam has recordings he made of his Forte 4 (which I now own) with both the OBP-2 and the 9V USA circuit and they both sound great.

Comparing the tone between my NS-2's with the older 9v circuits. Each one is a little different. The two newer 9v circuits I have sound pretty much the same. The Euro I had with the trim TP was totally different than the rest. Only way I could get the two close was to use an external eq and add some mids and roll back the treble. The treble knobs are totally different between the two. The treble on the 9v sweeps to the high mids and I can never really get a harsh sound out of them. I saw KDH in North Carolina over the summer and I know Rex prefers the TP but his tone live to me was very harsh and agressive at that show. I agree with John on the OBP-2 and 9v, that both sound different from each other but are great pre's that don't require you to work your ass off or add external eq's to find great tones. Some guys can get the TP to work for them and sound great. The bass on Donny's cd sounds great and Rex's tone on the KDH album is killer also. The Euro's do offer a different sound and did not sound that great with the 9v in it when I tried it, but the OBP-2 is the one that I like the best in it, even over the BQC that I just took out.
 
I would think for more variety. I know when I have talked to PJ, he has said over and over that they want variety, not the same tone in different packages. That was one of the reasons the euros went to the sandwich over all maple.

Actually with grunge rock in the 1990's there was a sort of "anything 1980's sucks" backlash...

According to PJ a lot of bassists he was talking to as potential Spector Artists were saying they didn't like the "all Maple sound" because it was "too 1980's"

The other problem was that is was very expensive to send USA Maple over to Europe. So the maple being used in Europe was European Maple. And there's a difference in the density and very much a difference in the quality/variation of the quilting or flame.

Because of these differences, sometimes from batch to batch the there were tonal and finish differences. Stuart wanted a more consistent tonal output.

PJ saw it as an opportunity to add another new tonal profile to the arsenal when he was approaching artists.
 
so the tone pump will give that classic growl (ala Eddie Jackson's Mindcrime tone?)

Not quite. Like many have said, it'll get you part of the way there and then you have to tinker to get the rest.

It's an aggressive circuit... and the old Brooklyn and early Kramer models had aggressive USA 9v circuits.

Eddie has always done some intense experimentation with sound. He told me at NAMM last year (2012) that he always wanted to make what he was doing in Queensryche be part of the song's structure, but stand out on its own and be sonically unique. He also said he'd try pretty much anything as an experiment to come up with something cool sounding.

Rex Brown likes the TP because it's so aggressive and he can make it harsh sounding. Which is something he's into.

Finding your own space in a band with a lot of guitar and really strong soaring vocals without being mistaken for part of the drum kit is what a lot of bassists look for.

Truly for that classic 1980's Eddie Jackson sound you're best bet is to find a classic 1980's NS-2 with its original circuit.

The modern NS-2 9v circuits are great, but they are not exactly the same as the older vintage ones are.
 
Patrick,

I always enjoy your "insider's knowledge"!!! It is one of the things that separates this club from so many others. I enjoy this club and the Sadowsky club (where Roger often answers questions, shares info, etc.) more than all the others because of that. Having that direct connection is so cool in both cases! I never get tired of even the most obscure Spector facts! :bassist:

Rob

Thanks!
It's nice that I can share this stuff with people who actually want to hear it.
I think my wife wants to beat me to death with one of my Spectors after I get back from the NAMM Show and all I can do for 2 weeks is talk about what this artist said or what Stuart said or PJ or Jimmy Eppard.
LOL.
 
cool i actually like growl of the 18v tone pump. The obp 2 sounded muted compared to the other 2 selections. That is good to know, I might have been very disappointed in the bass based on what I hear from aggie, if that clip is representative of the sound, and I usually ditch basses that don't do what I expected they would.

So should i go with a Haz then you think? I want that slightly overdriven signal to light up the tubes in the vba.
 
Not quite. Like many have said, it'll get you part of the way there and then you have to tinker to get the rest.

It's an aggressive circuit... and the old Brooklyn and early Kramer models had aggressive USA 9v circuits.

Eddie has always done some intense experimentation with sound. He told me at NAMM last year (2012) that he always wanted to make what he was doing in Queensryche be part of the song's structure, but stand out on its own and be sonically unique. He also said he'd try pretty much anything as an experiment to come up with something cool sounding.

Rex Brown likes the TP because it's so aggressive and he can make it harsh sounding. Which is something he's into.

Finding your own space in a band with a lot of guitar and really strong soaring vocals without being mistaken for part of the drum kit is what a lot of bassists look for.

Truly for that classic 1980's Eddie Jackson sound you're best bet is to find a classic 1980's NS-2 with its original circuit.

The modern NS-2 9v circuits are great, but they are not exactly the same as the older vintage ones are.

Thanks for the response. I was looking at putting 35tw's in the bird, so i can get that single coil sound option. Tone pump or Haz do you think? Going for gritty, growling tone.
 
Comparing the tone between my NS-2's with the older 9v circuits. Each one is a little different. The two newer 9v circuits I have sound pretty much the same. The Euro I had with the trim TP was totally different than the rest. Only way I could get the two close was to use an external eq and add some mids and roll back the treble. The treble knobs are totally different between the two. The treble on the 9v sweeps to the high mids and I can never really get a harsh sound out of them. I saw KDH in North Carolina over the summer and I know Rex prefers the TP but his tone live to me was very harsh and agressive at that show. I agree with John on the OBP-2 and 9v, that both sound different from each other but are great pre's that don't require you to work your ass off or add external eq's to find great tones. Some guys can get the TP to work for them and sound great. The bass on Donny's cd sounds great and Rex's tone on the KDH album is killer also. The Euro's do offer a different sound and did not sound that great with the 9v in it when I tried it, but the OBP-2 is the one that I like the best in it, even over the BQC that I just took out.

I was reading a recent interview with Rex and he mentioned he is using the new MXR Blowtorch now which would explain his aggressive tone. Me, I just use my B3K and that is all I need for my tone :)
 
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