Stoner/Doom Bassists Thread, Part 90: Maxed Out

[The_Janitor]

I want a cheap reverb pedal, trying to avoid grabbing a behringer one from work. Any suggestions? Looking at the digiverb, cuz I use the Hell out of my digidelay. Not looking for the best one ever, just want something for basement noodling on guitar.

 

[kleinenenten]

You can build that. I can build that for you. Boosts are super simple circuits. I have no ideas for a production boost though because I've never looked into one.

Maybe you can make it. I'm at the noodling on a soldering iron stage.

 

[kleinenenten]

I want a cheap reverb pedal, trying to avoid grabbing a behringer one from work. Any suggestions? Looking at the digiverb, cuz I use the Hell out of my digidelay. Not looking for the best one ever, just want something for basement noodling on guitar.

Digiverb does fine for my simple stuff. Not an expert on reverb, though.

 

[Korladis]

I want a cheap reverb pedal, trying to avoid grabbing a behringer one from work. Any suggestions? Looking at the digiverb, cuz I use the Hell out of my digidelay. Not looking for the best one ever, just want something for basement noodling on guitar.

I have the digiverb, but I'm considering getting the tiny EHX holy grail or whatever it's called, because the digiverb is really more complex than I need or want.

Basically, I don't like "tone" knobs on pedals (the one on the digiverb is called "EQ"). I want my reverb pedal to not affect my tone except to make it reverby.

The one thing in the digiverb's favor is that it has a bunch of different types of reverb sounds to choose from (though I've used number 4, which is "church" forever).

 

[mbelue]

I used a Holy Grail a long time. Did the job.
I'd call it a grainy kinda reverb. Not distorted but not the pristine shimmer you get from digital reverb. Just a workingmans reverb. Does the job. I like the reverb in my BP8 better.

Sounded great in the effects loop of a buddie's crate guitar combo.
At least it was miles better than the built in reverb the combo had.

 

[Korladis]

I used a Holy Grail a long time. Did the job.
I'd call it a grainy kinda reverb. Not distorted but not the pristine shimmer you get from digital reverb. Just a workingmans reverb. Does the job. I like the reverb in my BP8 better.

Sounded great in the effects loop of a buddie's crate guitar combo.
At least it was miles better than the built in reverb the combo had.

Yeah. I'm mainly thinking of for live use. When recording, we just apply reverb afterwards, mostly, rather than bother with pedals.

I'm considering the Holy Grail because it's simpler than the Digiverb, probably more reliable (my Digiverb has had issues with the stomping part of the pedal making the internal connection before and so either not coming on, or staying on when I want it to switch off), and there's no "tone" or "EQ" knob, so not as easy to mess up.

 

[Blank_0101]

I want a cheap reverb pedal, trying to avoid grabbing a behringer one from work. Any suggestions? Looking at the digiverb, cuz I use the Hell out of my digidelay. Not looking for the best one ever, just want something for basement noodling on guitar.

The behringer is quite a lot of fun though if you go that way.

 

[Turkeypills]

Maybe you can make it. I'm at the noodling on a soldering iron stage.

You can do it to. I'm basically still noodling. I just noodle with a bit more focus and direction than I did when I started. Every new project is a set of new experiences.

 

[Turkeypills]

I had band practice the other night and have come to a few potential realizations. The dually(s) is/are incapable of fulfilling my needs. Class D heads are incredibly quiet given their wattage ratings. I am in a string of bad luck with both pieces of gear and just flat out have defective equipment.

My lead player was using a 5150 on the high gain channel with pregain between 3-4 and master around 5. I could keep up with my rig but I was absolutely tapped out. Any more bumps to either gain, bass or volume and the power amp started to clip like crazy. On top of that, I had some low lows but nowhere near what I can get out of almost every other rig I have had.
I understand that Duallies are not subs but I think the small form factor is incredibly limiting with bass response. On paper that may be different, but in my hands on experience I have to say that with or without my HPF the bass response is about the same. I could be doing something wrong, but I can't afford to buy another dually if it is not going to get where I want. I am abandoning ship on that idea. I'll probably look for another used 810 and put everything to rest.
I tried all of the ideas that you guys offered and I do indeed have much more potential volume from the preamp, but I'll be blowing speakers like party poppers. After additional rig swapping I have also concluded that my 2000s/215s is substantially louder and deeper than 2000s/dually. It just is. On paper that shouldn't be, but IRL it is.

This isn't to say I am dissatisfied with my dually. I love the cab. It sounds great and I think for any other application I will be set up with more than what I need. It just isn't enough for loud, down-tuned metal. Julian was right. I should have just saved for a 1515/66.

I am not really sure what if anything is defective because at low to moderate volumes everything sounds great.

The prolite is only marginally louder than the Sunn beta when I would take that to practice. I know that the betas are stupid loud for their power rating. I just don't understand why I feel like the prolite is so quiet. Both of my tube amps are also far louder.

The speakers sound incredible. But I am giving them enough juice to potentially fry them and they still aren't getting me to where I need them to.

This is why I think these cabs and class D just aren't right for me.

I think I am going to sell my rack and a few cabs, pedals and maybe a few basses and buy an SVT or a Super Bassman if I can swing it without my GF castrating me.

I'm keeping the dually for my home rig and to take to much quieter jam sessions. I may still use it for practice with my metal band and will still use it live until I can wrangle another 810.

I'm feeling pretty frustrated by the situation.

 

[dukeorock]

Maybe, especially if you want to go real low. Tonally, it's a different animal

 

[mbelue]

Shame you spent so much money on a custom cabinet that doesn't perform as you expect. I hate to hear about your continued problems.

I have a hard time believing your Sunn215 is deeper/louder. My suspicion is your preference relates to a different cabinet alignment. Most vintage bass cabs have an upper bass/low mid emphasis that sounds more bassy than cabs without it. At least they do to me. Even if they don't have near as much bass/subbass. Playing through my Fearful i have to eq the poopie out of every amp to sound like vintage cabs.


Is your Sunn cab the one with the scoops?
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I wonder if your drivers are out of polarity. Or your amp isn't bridging right. My mind would go to: something is wrong. You aren't working with behringer crap. You've got good quality amps and preamps.

Sucks its all failing you.

 

[The_Janitor]

Polarity could be the issue, I'd do the battery test on the dually if you haven't already.

Are you bridging the power amp or running dual mono/using one side?

If you're bridging, does it require a differently-wired speak on cable? A lot of power amps do.

 

[Turkeypills]

Shame you spent so much money on a custom cabinet that doesn't perform as you expect. I hate to hear about your continued problems.

I have a hard time believing your Sunn215 is deeper/louder. My suspicion is your preference relates to a different cabinet alignment. Most vintage bass cabs have an upper bass/low mid emphasis that sounds more bassy than cabs without it. At least they do to me. Even if they don't have near as much bass/subbass. Playing through my Fearful i have to eq the poopie out of every amp to sound like vintage cabs.


Is your Sunn cab the one with the scoops?
Like this:Invalid Link Removed


I wonder if your drivers are out of polarity. Or your amp isn't bridging right. My mind would go to: something is wrong. You aren't working with behringer crap. You've got good quality amps and preamps.

Sucks its all failing you.

My sunn cab is different. Its the 215s and I have it loaded with K140s. It has similar ports but the speaker baffle is not slanted. Crazy thing is, The speakers aren't even fitting in the baffle all the way. Which is another situation that baffles me, excuse the pun. As crazy as it may sound, it totally does put out more low lows.

My power amp isn't bridged. I'm not sending 3kW to a single dually. Speaker polarity is an issue I had not considered and do not really understand. Wouldn't it fry the driver if I installed it with the the wires going to the wrong terminals?

The issue isn't that anything sounds bad. It all sounds marvelous. I just think I had expectations that outweighed the reality of the cabs capabilities. I'm only disappointed because I thought it would be a final solution to my volume issues with my band. I still have invested in an absolutely killer cabinet that will fulfill my needs in any other situation, so I am not too butt hurt about dropping big coin on a custom. If anything I am glad that I am realizing this now instead of after buying a second dually.

 

[Turkeypills]

Next week I'm going to take a tube amp to practice. Maybe it's simply an issue of me and the power amp not meshing.

Maybe loading my peavey 215s with 3015s is a solution, and maybe I just need more drivers than 4x15s.

 

[mbelue]

Speaker polarity is an issue I had not considered and do not really understand. Wouldn't it fry the driver if I installed it with the the wires going to the wrong terminals?

No. What would happen if the drivers are out of polarity is: less volume, less bass out put.

You installed one of those drivers?

 

[The_Janitor]

My sunn cab is different. Its the 215s and I have it loaded with K140s. It has similar ports but the speaker baffle is not slanted. Crazy thing is, The speakers aren't even fitting in the baffle all the way. Which is another situation that baffles me, excuse the pun. As crazy as it may sound, it totally does put out more low lows.

My power amp isn't bridged. I'm not sending 3kW to a single dually. Speaker polarity is an issue I had not considered and do not really understand. Wouldn't it fry the driver if I installed it with the the wires going to the wrong terminals?

The issue isn't that anything sounds bad. It all sounds marvelous. I just think I had expectations that outweighed the reality of the cabs capabilities. I'm only disappointed because I thought it would be a final solution to my volume issues with my band. I still have invested in an absolutely killer cabinet that will fulfill my needs in any other situation, so I am not too butt hurt about dropping big coin on a custom. If anything I am glad that I am realizing this now instead of after buying a second dually.

Speakers don't care which way you wire them, but if there's a set of them they all need to be wired the same way. If your Dually has one driver wired one way and the other driver wired the opposite it'll still work, but the signal coming out of the two drivers will be out of phase, which will cause cancellation and greatly reduce volume. It's entirely possible for it to still sound good, but just not have the volume output that it should.

So plug in a speaker cable with a 1/4" end and touch the TRS plug to the terminals of a 9V battery, with one terminal touching the tip and one touching the sleeve. The speakers will make a pop sound and jump outward. If they're in phase, they both push outward. If they're out of phase, one will push outward and the other will pull inward. If that happens, it's a simple matter of swapping the leads on the one of the drivers.

It's an easy enough thing to check and could be causing your issue.

Not to keep piling on, or second-guess your conclusions (you ARE dealing with a stupid amount of guitar amp volume after all), but I'd try the battery test and see what happens.

 

[dozicusmaximus]

Maybe your practice room is screwing you and the positioning of your guitarists rig? Or is this the same at shows?

 

[Turkeypills]

No. What would happen if the drivers are out of polarity is: less volume, less bass out put.

You installed one of those drivers?

Yup. Dually came with a defective Faital. I guess I'll have to pull it and double check it with the other. It had a black wire I connected to negative and either a white or red to positive. Thanks for the suggestion.

 

[Corey Y]

If it sounds good it is good, no rules.

Sometimes you've got to give yourself permission to move on from purchases you think you SHOULD be happy with, but aren't. Not every piece of gear is a good fit for everyone.

 

[Turkeypills]

Maybe your practice room is screwing you and the positioning of your guitarists rig? Or is this the same at shows?

Dually has only seen one show and was disappointingly quiet.