Yea the instrumentation can make a big difference. He could be playing it right but since you don't have a full orchestra behind you it could sound weird or wrong.
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Struck Down For Playing A Jamerson Line!
- Thread starter PolkaHero
- Start date
I was playing with a new band at one point, and they were doing King of the Road (the old Roger Miller country tune). The great classic country bass player, Bob Moore, plays a really wonderful line on that song. You can hear it in the intro, because it's just him playing upright bass with some finger snaps to keep the time.
I played that line note for note for these guys, and was accused of being "too busy" as a bass player.
They were "bluegrass" guys. It became apparent pretty quickly that they really were looking for just 1-5 lines, regardless of what was on the original recording.
We agreed to part ways (amicably) shortly after that. Just one of those "it's not a great fit" situations.
I played that line note for note for these guys, and was accused of being "too busy" as a bass player.
They were "bluegrass" guys. It became apparent pretty quickly that they really were looking for just 1-5 lines, regardless of what was on the original recording.
We agreed to part ways (amicably) shortly after that. Just one of those "it's not a great fit" situations.
- Mar 19, 2013
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Yeah I’m not seeing an issue here….
I just went back and listened, tell this vocalist to listen more to the tempo of your notes rather than the actual note played. From what I’m listening to, the vocals are coming in right on a beat, and this is a much steadier pulsed rhythm than some Jameson lines!
I just went back and listened, tell this vocalist to listen more to the tempo of your notes rather than the actual note played. From what I’m listening to, the vocals are coming in right on a beat, and this is a much steadier pulsed rhythm than some Jameson lines!
Yes the line is weird, but its because the root line is weird. Jamerson sticks pretty close to the root line and the descending half step drops in the verses are probably whats throwing your guitar player off. if you listen to the bari-sax part, it rides along with the bassline. Is everyone in the band trying for the original arrangement?
Sounds like if they want to play that song, they may want to listen to it and learn it like you did. Several years ago I met a guitarist and a drummer who were interested in starting up a band. He gave me a short list of songs and I made sure I learned them as they were originally played. When we got together, he was not only in the wrong key, but wasn't even playing the right chord progression. He told me he had a few gigs set up and I need to learn the songs "correctly". I tried to explain that I did learn them correctly, but got nowhere. I told him I'd pass and never came back.
I think most of you are not understanding what is going on and why Jamerson is playing a 5 over a I chord. It’s not random, there is a historical context.
Playing a 5th over a I chord comes from church music and organ playing. Typically you’ll hear it after a IV chord which the bass note moves to the 5th over a I then the chord goes to a V. It’s literally everywhere in church organ music and also made its way into traditional country as well. There’s an endless amount of examples from country in the 50/60’s out of the Nashville A Team studio musicians.
I’m not really familiar with this song but after hearing that sound I immediately know that’s the sound they’re going for. It was probably discussed while tracking or someone played it in a demo and that’s just what they went with unspoken.
Playing a 5th over a I chord comes from church music and organ playing. Typically you’ll hear it after a IV chord which the bass note moves to the 5th over a I then the chord goes to a V. It’s literally everywhere in church organ music and also made its way into traditional country as well. There’s an endless amount of examples from country in the 50/60’s out of the Nashville A Team studio musicians.
I’m not really familiar with this song but after hearing that sound I immediately know that’s the sound they’re going for. It was probably discussed while tracking or someone played it in a demo and that’s just what they went with unspoken.
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Guitar players and singers like to make their lack of musical knowledge into someone else's shortcoming.
The audience doesn't care except for the rare few that do. Just make the best version of the song your band can make. If that means modifying the line, then do that.
A successful band performance is always the result of a successful negotiation.
What’s your goal ?
What’s your goal ?
drumvsbass
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- Aug 20, 2011
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Another example of someone who didn't 'hear' the bass line on the recording... sigh.
Jamerson > guitarist in a cover band
I mean. Come on. OP, you are right.
I mean. Come on. OP, you are right.
I’ve had a few conversations with others in the band where they question what I’m playing and/or wrongly assume that a tune “should be easy, there’s only three chords”. This is a thing that raises my hackles. It is a clear example of ignorance toward the instrument and musicianship.
I’ve been saying for years that “note for note” doesn’t always work, although that’s always where I think we should start. Exactly as @smeet said, there are a lot of other parts. If you aren’t covering all of them, then the original bass line may not work.
I don’t get people that don’t want to work as a team. If you refuse to work as a team and the song sucks, the only ones getting punished are the audience.
And yes, I’ve been there, spending hours on a part that I can’t use because it doesn’t fit in the band’s configuration.
I don’t get people that don’t want to work as a team. If you refuse to work as a team and the song sucks, the only ones getting punished are the audience.
And yes, I’ve been there, spending hours on a part that I can’t use because it doesn’t fit in the band’s configuration.
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I’m not hearing much other than the root in that bassline. But there are certainly some interesting and unexpected chords in the changes, mostly sounds like they’re there to build tension leading from one section to the next. I can see how they might mess with minds.
If the changes in that tune are too weird for everyone in the band to hear and groove to, maybe pick another one.
If the changes in that tune are too weird for everyone in the band to hear and groove to, maybe pick another one.
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My first music teacher (jazz, upright bass) said: “Copy someone for inspiration - not imitation.” Wise words. 
Never be unwilling to learn someone else’s basslines note for note. That’s called getting educated.
Never be afraid to make them your own or take them in completely different directions. That’s the key difference between ‘recital’ and ‘performance.’
Never be unwilling to learn someone else’s basslines note for note. That’s called getting educated.
Never be afraid to make them your own or take them in completely different directions. That’s the key difference between ‘recital’ and ‘performance.’
Good on you for learning the right bass line and trying to make it work. I would not assume someone else is lazy if the line doesn't support their singing/playing in the context of your band. As others have said, it may be a bit weird hanging out there by itself without all of the added production.
Now, do what needs to be done to make the song work with your band with your instrumentation. Don't keep trying to make every square peg fit the round holes.
Now, do what needs to be done to make the song work with your band with your instrumentation. Don't keep trying to make every square peg fit the round holes.
I agree with this, but I think that the bass line is often part of what keeps the song recognizable when other parts are missing. You can "jump out" of the main line sometimes to toss in a a turnaround that, say, emulates a missing horn part or something. In more rare instances, you might take on a keyboard bass line if that's more iconic to the song - something I and many bassists do when playing Stevie Wonder's Superstition, for example, since the clavinet in that song is so central to the motion of the song as a whole.
But that's not the read I got from the OP. The OP's situation sounds me like there's a vocalist/guitarist who isn't capable of working with the harmonic complexities of the bassline on the record. It's "throwing him off" was the quote, not "the song isn't working because the string parts aren't there" or something similar.
That song has a fairly complicated chord structure to begin with and it's not hard for me to imagine that some players might need to work with it a fair bit before they can understand the structure. I think it's likely that's what's happening here, and because the vocal/guitar player can't hear the structure of the song yet, he's letting the bass line distract him. He probably just needs to learn the song. You know, like the OP did.
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and then the next thing out of their mouth is "We play it our way"... My guitarist does this like clockwork, it's lack of interest and practice....Stay the course Mr. Bassman your doing it right! Let them catch-up.
Have them listen to it. If you’ve learned it note for note as others have said, they should learn their part.
