Struck Down For Playing A Jamerson Line!

[pbassnut]

My band is learning "What Becomes Of The Broken Hearted" so I learned James Jamerson's part note for note. At rehearsal today our guitarist/vocalist said the bass line was throwing him off, lol. It is a strange line with a lot of 5ths and 3rds being played over the root chords. Just wondering if I should simplify it a bit and/or if anyone here has covered it and what they ended up playing?

The bass line seems pretty straightforward to me ... both rhythmically and harmonically. I can't understand what his problem with your part could be. Maybe he should independently work on his guitar and singing parts some more prior to the next stab at it.

 

[MultiScaleMale]

Play what fits. You're not Jamerson.

 

[bdplaid]

My band is learning "What Becomes Of The Broken Hearted" so I learned James Jamerson's part note for note. At rehearsal today our guitarist/vocalist said the bass line was throwing him off, lol. It is a strange line with a lot of 5ths and 3rds being played over the root chords. Just wondering if I should simplify it a bit and/or if anyone here has covered it and what they ended up playing?

There's nothing strange about that bass line. Your guitarist/vocalist is a piker. He needs to learn the fecking song.

 

[Guitalia]

This is one of the occasional TalkBass threads that make clear which posters I'd probably get along with in a band.

 

[Joe Nerve]

If they're paying me I'll play whatever they want. If they're not I'll play whatever I want.

And there are a few in betweens.

Happiness and the band sounding the best it could are really what should always be top priority.

 

[Bassy Davy]

I once was "Struck Down For Playing a Rainey Line."
Slightly different situation, we were trying to get a band together in the late 70s. We had a guitarist come in to audition and did Kid Charlemagne. I played the original bass line note for note. The guitarist sang lead and nailed all the Larry Carlton guitar parts. When we were done, the guitarist said to me "Busy bass, huh?". I said, "Would you say that to Chuck Rainey?".

If I were the OP, I would change the line to suit the instrumentation in the band. I've been in similar situations where the singer said that I "threw them off". I changed it to suit the singer. As always, YMMV.

Bon chance!

 

[turf3]

The bass line seems pretty straightforward to me ... both rhythmically and harmonically. I can't understand what his problem with your part could be. Maybe he should independently work on his guitar and singing parts some more prior to the next stab at it.

I'd more or less agree with this, but it isn't a bass line that's going to lead someone clearly through the chords.

To my ear it sounds like, if you have a stripped-down instrumentation, you'd probably do well to play the same rhythms (such as they are) but outline the chords more explicitly. We all know that the cats Jamerson was playing with would have nailed the tune if he'd come in playing like Ornette Coleman; but to make the tune sound good with the army you actually have, some modification is likely to be helpful.

I wouldn't consider this an "exotic" or "rare" tune, but I can see how the changes might need clear outlining for a vocalist.

You also don't know what kind of scratch track the vocalist on the recording was singing with. He may just as well have been hearing the piano playing a bunch of root position chords the whole way through.

I for one don't believe groups should be forbidden from performing tunes unless they can "do it like the record". "THEEEE RECOORRRRRD" was probably assembled over the course of an 8 hour session from multiple tracks, bringing musicians in and out for even a few bars as needed. There may very well have been 20 people on that one track, some even overdubbing themselves (like how you make a string orchestra out of one violin and one cello player). So now you take OP's four piece, guitar, bass, drums, keys, and say "play this tune". It's simply nutty to insist that they reproduce the recording. I played for many years in a five piece (guitar, bass, drums, sax, vocal) and we did tunes from the whole range of classic rock and R&B. If there was a whole brass section there, I had to do what I could to reproduce that feeling on one saxophone. If there were two guitars, the one guitarist had to do the best he could to reproduce that feeling with one guitar. Prominent keyboard part? We'd divide it up. I don't believe we EVER not once had an audience member, booker, or other say to us that we "weren't playing it like the record". We did get criticisms, mostly for things that were valid, but that was not one of them.

 

[LBS-bass]

I for one don't believe groups should be forbidden from performing tunes unless they can "do it like the record". "THEEEE RECOORRRRRD" was probably assembled over the course of an 8 hour session from multiple tracks, bringing musicians in and out for even a few bars as needed.

That's not how Motown sessions were recorded. They recorded live in the studio.

 

[funkinbottom]

Yes the line is weird, but its because the root line is weird. Jamerson sticks pretty close to the root line

Yeah, agree. I'm hearing more going on in the way of alt chords/voicing going on over the bass, not the other way around.

or if anyone here has covered it and what they ended up playing?

Joan Osborne, but it was with the Funk Brothers. Bob Babbit on bass.

 

[bobalu]

Guitar/vocalist people always have a problem with songs they didn’t choose. Always.

Totally agree here. And this is what sets professionals apart from amateurs. (I am a hack btw, but would have learned Jamerson's lines note for note as the OP did).

 

[Mechanical]

This assumes the music is being made good by not playing it correctly. I dunno about that. I think that developing a level of skill is pointless if you're continually held back by the others you're surrounded by. If that's ego, then so be it. Seems more like common sense to me. Why bother to get better as a player? Let's all just be really lazy and get by doing the least we can, since that's what we are willing to accept.

Interesting take. If a band is playing a song, such as the one above, and the crowd dances and enjoys it (and buys drinks!), that's literally what they are paid to do.

Why get better as a player? I would ask that of anyone who plays covers. A musician can practice daily and be very fluent on the instrument, but why get any better than you need to be to play "Mustang Sally" or "Brown Eyed Girl" note for note? What's the point? (In case people read this incorrectly, my tongue is planted firmly in my cheek)

If you're "held back" by your bandmates, then you are experiencing the bumpy ride.

ETA: There's a video of Anthony Wellington playing "Land Down Under" and what he's playing is the tip of the iceberg of his playing ability. And that's the way I like to be perceived as a bassist, although with 1/100th of his chops.

 

[Scarysharkface]

My band is learning "What Becomes Of The Broken Hearted" so I learned James Jamerson's part note for note. At rehearsal today our guitarist/vocalist said the bass line was throwing him off, lol. It is a strange line with a lot of 5ths and 3rds being played over the root chords. Just wondering if I should simplify it a bit and/or if anyone here has covered it and what they ended up playing?

I got fired from a band for being "too busy" when I was simply playing the original bass lines.

John

 

[g-dude]

My band is learning "What Becomes Of The Broken Hearted" so I learned James Jamerson's part note for note. At rehearsal today our guitarist/vocalist said the bass line was throwing him off, lol. It is a strange line with a lot of 5ths and 3rds being played over the root chords. Just wondering if I should simplify it a bit and/or if anyone here has covered it and what they ended up playing?

You should find a new guitarist and vocalist.

Fire the drummer for good measure.

 

[LBS-bass]

Interesting take. If a band is playing a song, such as the one above, and the crowd dances and enjoys it (and buys drinks!), that's literally what they are paid to do.

Why get better as a player? I would ask that of anyone who plays covers. A musician can practice daily and be very fluent on the instrument, but why get any better than you need to be to play "Mustang Sally" or "Brown Eyed Girl" note for note? What's the point? (In case people read this incorrectly, my tongue is planted firmly in my cheek)

If you're "held back" by your bandmates, then you are experiencing the bumpy ride.

I wouldn't know; I haven't played either of those songs in decades.

I think the point is that we can aspire to improve and work toward finding better opportunities with better players as we do so. Or we can accept the advice to let everyone around us be lazy and not work to get any better. As I said to someone else, sometimes it's a matter of what your goals are. Not everyone wants to do much beyond a party in the garage with a show or two for family and friends, and maybe that's ok. I'm not sure what the OPs situation is here, really, but I tend to assume people want to improve - I might be wrong about that.

 

[g-dude]

Keep in mind there are multiple recordings of the song, and maybe the guitarist and vocalist are used to a different version.

I can’t think of a single version of the song that comes close to the original. It’s almost one of those songs that shouldn’t be played, because it’ll never be done as well - so why bother?

 

[Mechanical]

I wouldn't know; I haven't played either of those songs in decades.

I think the point is that we can aspire to improve and work toward finding better opportunities with better players as we do so. Or we can accept the advice to let everyone around us be lazy and not work to get any better. As I said to someone else, sometimes it's a matter of what your goals are. Not everyone wants to do much beyond a party in the garage with a show or two for family and friends, and maybe that's ok. I'm not sure what the OPs situation is here, really, but I tend to assume people want to improve - I might be wrong about that.

All I'll say is that someone has to be the best musician in the group, and if it's you then that's a privilege, not a hinderance. YMMV.

 

[Nev375]

At rehearsal today our guitarist/vocalist said the bass line was throwing him off, lol.

Just say "I bet <insert name of guitarists hero> wouldn't be thrown off."

 

[g-dude]

No. Never dumb your stuff down if you know you're playing it correctly. Ask them why they haven't listened to the record.

I have left bands over people who wanted to micromanage my playing when I knew I was working hard to play things that were solidly supportive of the song and correct. Nobody gets to dictate to me what I play if they're the ones who are not hearing what they need to hear.

Yup.

Now, if everyone agreed to do it “their own way” it’s different.

 

[LBS-bass]

All I'll say is that someone has to be the best musician in the group, and if it's you then that's a privilege, not a hinderance. YMMV.

Yeah but if they don't understand that your parts are correct and theirs are not, that's just a problem. Sometimes it's an insurmountable problem, if they can't get past a poor ear.

My guess is that the OP's guy wouldn't play it right if he tried to play it solo right now. Like I said, the song has an unintuitive chord structure. Nobody's going to fix that by playing it differently. He just needs to learn it. But again, maybe I'm wrong.

 

[g-dude]

Just say "I bet <insert name of guitarists hero> wouldn't be thrown off."

Don’t even use a hero…use someone the guitarist thinks is horrible at the instrument.