Sweetwater Scam

[MultiScaleMale]

The official "Engineer" body isn't thrilled with people being called engineers that haven't completed engineering training and devised their own "protected terms" of “Professional Engineer,” “Licensed Engineer,” and “Registered Engineer”. They discourage the use of "engineer" except when it meets their definitions, but that train left the station a long time ago. I wonder if they used to complain about "who drives a train"?

 

[llmontyll]

To me, an engineer is someone who applies appropriate scientific principles to solve real world problems. I have a hard time grasping what the scientific principles are behind a sales engineer.

I've been told by my sales engineer that there is complex math involved in whether or not they can offer any price concession or added service. I assume there must be scientific principles involved to negate the axiom "x% of something is better than 100% of nothing" when I ask for any, even very small concession that my other main vendors are more than happy to provide. Usually without me asking.

 

[MARVIN MECKLER]

I've been told by my sales engineer that there is complex math involved in whether or not they can offer any price concession or added service. I assume there must be scientific principles involved to negate the axiom "x% of something is better than 100% of nothing" when I ask for any, even very small concession that my other main vendors are more than happy to provide. Usually without me asking.

Tee hee hee chuckle chuckle

 

[mapleglo]

I don't think I ever got any kind of a discount from Sweetwater. Ever. That's one of the main reasons I started doing business with Musician's Friend about 5 or 6 years ago - not only did they almost always discount the price and ship 2nd day, but I also got points for each purchase. Unfortunately, I had an issue with them when I bought my Precision, which I why I started ordering from Sweetwater again. At this point, I think the only on-line retailer I've never had a problem with is AMS. Too bad their selection is not great.

 

[Jeff Scott]

To me, an engineer is someone who applies appropriate scientific principles to solve real world problems. I have a hard time grasping what the scientific principles are behind a sales engineer.

An old friend of mine from way back in the 1900s got his EE degree from Case then went on to work in the electronics parts industry (think, Arrow, Digikey, that sort of thing) as sales engineer. I am sure his having an engineering background helped him help his customers.

 

[5StringBlues]

My brother retired from the railroad last year.


He wasn't an engineer, but when asked what he did for a living, he'd reply, " I make the choo-choo go".

 

[pcake]

since i've never had any problems with returns or issues since ben became our rep, i ordered a set of strings from sweetwater last night. i'm not worried about it...

 

[Iridescentone]

since i've never had any problems with returns or issues since ben became our rep, i ordered a set of strings from sweetwater last night. i'm not worried about it...

You just jinx'd yourself. You know that, right?

 

[wvbass]

I don't get the "$600 means nothing to the company". That money has to come from somewhere. Also, they are shipping thousands of instruments. It's not just an isolated transaction for them. Every time they break a rule/policy, it sets a precedent, and people talk (they certainly do here). The worst thing they can do is not have rules, and not stick to them.

Since it was me that said that, I’ll take the bait.

This was imprecise wording on my part. What I really meant was 2 things.

1) Relativity applies. $600 is a lot more money to an entity with $50,000 of income than it is to an entity with $50,000,000 of income.
2) Time is a factor. Saving $600 means more to an individual, because they are more likely to need to focus on the short term. For a business, that $600 could be part of their long game. It may be money well spent if it preserves future revenues with a good customer or promotes a positive buzz on social media. Or if it prevents a negative buzz.

The “somewhere” that money has to come from is the next sale.

 

[DigitalMan]

As someone with an actual engineering degree, I've always thought there should be some rules about what kind of position can be called an "engineer"

That ship sailed a long time ago. There are countless engineer-named roles without degrees.

Imagine having a non-medical PhD and someone saying you're not a real doctor.

 

[pcake]

You just jinx'd yourself. You know that, right?

hopefully not

 

[FearNoEvil65]

I've realized from this thread I could never deal with the general Music instrument/equipment buying public, holy crap the amount of ridiculous is incredible.
I've bought 2 basses and a lot of different equipment, strings etc. from SW through the years, and 2 times I had issues it was really easy to deal with.
One time I had bought a Guitar stand and the one fold down foot on it was was bent, the rep told me to keep it and sent me a better one for free.
I'm going to have to buy something from SW and apologize to my rep for all the difficult people he has to deal with, wowsa.

 

[buldog5151bass]

Relativity applies.

The “somewhere” that money has to come from is the next sale.

Tough to do. Everyone is price matching, and most buyers only care about price. Sweetwater already does more than anyone else (posting photos of actual instrument, showing weights). Other than the $$$ end, no one cares.

Relativity. The average buyer purchases one instrument every xx years, big retailers sell thousands of instruments per year. Since we all know these disputes happen regularly, I'd say 1 incident of $500 to a buyer is equivalent to tens of thousands for the seller. And as I said, each "exception" sets a precedent the seller has to follow.

Basically, you expect the seller to profit in "exposure bucks". Remember that the next time a venue owner tries to stiff of shortchange you.

Sorry, your argument doesn't work IMO.

Peace.

 

[gln1955]

Tough to do. Everyone is price matching, and most buyers only care about price. Sweetwater already does more than anyone else (posting photos of actual instrument, showing weights). Other than the $$$ end, no one cares.

Relativity. The average buyer purchases one instrument every xx years, big retailers sell thousands of instruments per year. Since we all know these disputes happen regularly, I'd say 1 incident of $500 to a buyer is equivalent to tens of thousands for the seller. And as I said, each "exception" sets a precedent the seller has to follow.

Basically, you expect the seller to profit in "exposure bucks". Remember that the next time a venue owner tries to stiff of shortchange you.

Sorry, your argument doesn't work IMO.

Peace.

The old adage " The customer is always right" doesn't work in a world rife with people who game the system.

The idea that a baseless gift to a problem customer just comes from the next sale only means everyone else is paying for these gifts with higher prices.

 

[Bass Viking]

I've realized from this thread I could never deal with the general Music instrument/equipment buying public, holy crap the amount of ridiculous is incredible.

And this whole situation escalated over a very minor thing, bridge saddle screws. I think the OP jumped the gun on returning the bass. He loved the bass otherwise.

 

[creaturegods]

The old adage " The customer is always right" doesn't work in a world rife with people who game the system.

Funnily enough, the original phrase was "The customer is always right, in matters of taste."
The fact that it has been popularly shortened to simply "the customer is always right" is itself a result of someone gaming the system.

 

[llmontyll]

I think the OP jumped the gun on returning the bass. He loved the bass otherwise.

The OP explained that SW couldn't/wouldn't resolve the screws issue and only gave him the choice to return the bass...

 

[Bass Viking]

The OP explained that SW couldn't/wouldn't resolve the screws issue and only gave him the choice to return the bass...

They gave him the option to wait until the screws were in stock, not that they wouldn’t resolve the issue.

 

[elgranluis]

I feel the same way about any position embracing “logistics”.

Riis

Google “logistics”.. You’ll definitely stop feeling that way.

 

[elgranluis]

For those that don’t understand how sweetwater works (this has been covered in other threads, feel free to search ):

1.- free shipping doesn’t exist (THIS IS THE KEY TO UNDERSTANDING THE THREAD). Ups and FedEx are not Charity.
2.- every customer gets “free shipping“. How ?
3.- shipping cost is deducted from the sales engineer’s commissions. That’s why you shouldn’t order a small item as you’d be “costing” them money. The commission they make is not enough to cover your shipping.

So what happened here , is that The sales engineer wasn’t willing to eat up the cost of buyers remorse. It’s great that SW offers their sales engineers a resource when something like this happens, instead of a policy where “the customer’s always right”.

Sure , some people could argue that the sales engineer could have tampered with the returned bass ( fixing the bridge screws?) by himself or by convincing other employees to risk their jobs by doing so. Does this seem like a likely scenario at all ?