The death of jamming

[NYJoe2013]

I have another (humorous) thread going about jam bands. On a more serious note, I've been running jams for years, and probably always will. I'm saddened that so many people have lost the spirit of true jamming- Improvisation, and spontaneity.
Every week I end up with a bunch of GREAT players who just want to play songs. Maybe add a second (third...fourth) guitar solo, but the jamming aspect is all but gone.
I try to push my guests boundries, and a FEW of them get it. Go to double time feel, or a modulation, or switch up a groove- reggae Zeppelin, or metal Peaches and Herb.
I try to keep it interesting, and push peoples boundries.
I often just hit a brick wall. If it ain't on the record, they don't want to try it.
Too many automatons, not enough free spirits.
Another Pride and Joy.......in the same key as the record.....
Rant over.

Fairpoint… But I think you hit it when you talked about the guitar solos. From where I sit, and playing with a few different bands, jamming, particularly in Rock settings equals extended guitar solos, which quite frankly are rarely worth the listen. Say it in a well executed chorus or two and move on. Life's too short and there's too much music to play.

Or, play in a more exclusively free environment. I saw a very good free jazz performance here in Boston couple of weeks ago w my son, an alto player who lives and breathes that. A 45 minute ballad at one point. Not my particular cuppa tea, and that's what makes the world go round. Diversity.

 

[BassGuyGG]

Open mics are very popular on Long Island, where I live. My experience has been that they are useful for networking and finding players/opportunities but they produce very little good music. It's great when top-shelf players are jamming but for the most part, second-tier (semi-pro) or third-tier (hobbyist) players come out. Mostly it's a way for real players to pick up a steady gig every week since live music venues are at a low ebb these days. The other guys in my band go to one or even two every week. Sometimes I'll go but I prefer to spend the time working on original tracks in my home studio.

 

[Napes]

I live for the jam.

Its not always easy, you really have to click with people musically for it to amount to anything. With a couple of my bands we were 4 friends who really clicked, we were all about the jam and most of our songs came from fumbling around with riffs and beats until something emerged. Thats my favorite part because theres a bunch of noise and all of sudden something in the air changes, it's like electricity or a spark and the riff in question takes the front seat with everyone playing that riff or around it.

You can ride on an inspired riff for a while, a lot of our jams ended up being in the 10 minute range where we played around with the mood of a certain riff/idea. That being said we were so accustomed to each other's playing that we would often make the same sort of changes when it felt like time to change parts.

It's that electricity in the air that drives me to keep making music and I've grown so used to it that it's pretty much the only way I want to write music. That band split but thankfully I restarted playing with one of the guitarists a few years back and it was like going home.

 

[Ron Laframboise]

I have another (humorous) thread going about jam bands. On a more serious note, I've been running jams for years, and probably always will. I'm saddened that so many people have lost the spirit of true jamming- Improvisation, and spontaneity.
Every week I end up with a bunch of GREAT players who just want to play songs. Maybe add a second (third...fourth) guitar solo, but the jamming aspect is all but gone.
I try to push my guests boundries, and a FEW of them get it. Go to double time feel, or a modulation, or switch up a groove- reggae Zeppelin, or metal Peaches and Herb.
I try to keep it interesting, and push peoples boundries.
I often just hit a brick wall. If it ain't on the record, they don't want to try it.
Too many automatons, not enough free spirits.
Another Pride and Joy.......in the same key as the record.....
Rant over.

Hey there...jamming is becoming a lost art. There are many responses here, some suggesting it is good, some say it isn't, for various reasons. My thoughts and experiences are: jamming is great for those with a bit more experience, and a basic knowledge of theory. Very basic knowledge is all that is needed. Those that are You Tube players are not really players. They are able to mimmick, but don't know how to really play...that is where having a real one-on-one teacher takes that player beyond being a simple clone player. When players get to "jam" with You Tube, they only hear perfected tracks. There is no spontaneous action to take the music in unexpected directions. Those that don't know the basics are left behind. That is where pushback comes from...if these clone players are not in their comfort zone, they'd rather not do it, for fear of sounding bad or making errors. i just recently had an experience with a blues/rock jam. The guitarist had a reputation for being a great blues player, so a "jam" was organized. It turned out that he could not actually play anything unless it was scripted. He had sold himself on social media as a very experienced player and teacher. When pushed to experiment at the jam, he was very adept at changing directions by suggesting the singer share a couple of original songs. We were given the structure, but no room to jam within them. All this being said, jamming does require some theory and basics. Not everyone is a natural at it. Social media has changed the concept of what real musicians are, and jamming is one of those things being set aside. The way I see it, those who learn proper theory and learn to jam, will rise to the top. The You Tube sensations will be hot for a while, and fade very quickly in the not-too-distant future. IMHO

 

[Miles_ONeal]

I've always viewed jamming as a waste of time...simply letting the guitar player play endless ideas over 1 to 3 chords is not my idea of having fun or being creative.

That's not jamming. That's wanking.

 

[Bass is base]

I have another (humorous) thread going about jam bands. On a more serious note, I've been running jams for years, and probably always will. I'm saddened that so many people have lost the spirit of true jamming- Improvisation, and spontaneity.
Every week I end up with a bunch of GREAT players who just want to play songs. Maybe add a second (third...fourth) guitar solo, but the jamming aspect is all but gone.
I try to push my guests boundries, and a FEW of them get it. Go to double time feel, or a modulation, or switch up a groove- reggae Zeppelin, or metal Peaches and Herb.
I try to keep it interesting, and push peoples boundries.
I often just hit a brick wall. If it ain't on the record, they don't want to try it.
Too many automatons, not enough free spirits.
Another Pride and Joy.......in the same key as the record.....
Rant over.

I was the bass player at Lee's Palace Blues Jam for three years and have been going to Blues Jams in Toronto for over thirty years. My motivation is a desire to learn and play Blues. I love the opportunity to play classic songs by Muddy Waters, the three Kings, John Lee Hooker, Otis Rush, Buddy Guy and Earl Hooker. A reasonable expectation of something advertised as a Blues jam. I have no interest in playing Pop or Reggae. If you want to have an improvisational, widely varied style jam, advertise and run it as such. Let participants make informed choices and know what to expect. Jam does not automatically mean improvisation. Because someone wants to learn particular songs or musical styles does not make them automatons. It doesn't make them more or less free spirits. It means they have different tastes and motivations than yours. I hope you can respect their right to have them.

 

[Miles_ONeal]

As a bass player I've never enjoyed jamming because you are just a backing track for guitarists (who think that the sun shines out of their truss rod access hole) to endlessly wank over, almost always a slow blues in A or E.

I play guitar myself but don't inflict my jamming on others, I prefer to do it in the privacy of my own home.

Last time I encountered one of these I asked "what key", he replied "whatever you like" so I chose Eb minor, "you could have chosen something a bit easier" was his response. I watched the soccer on the large screen TV while he mangled a few verses then threw in the towel. He hasn't asked me again.

You need to broaden your guitar player horizons. They're out there.

 

[roccobass]

I have another (humorous) thread going about jam bands. On a more serious note, I've been running jams for years, and probably always will. I'm saddened that so many people have lost the spirit of true jamming- Improvisation, and spontaneity.
Every week I end up with a bunch of GREAT players who just want to play songs. Maybe add a second (third...fourth) guitar solo, but the jamming aspect is all but gone.
I try to push my guests boundries, and a FEW of them get it. Go to double time feel, or a modulation, or switch up a groove- reggae Zeppelin, or metal Peaches and Herb.
I try to keep it interesting, and push peoples boundries.
I often just hit a brick wall. If it ain't on the record, they don't want to try it.
Too many automatons, not enough free spirits.
Another Pride and Joy.......in the same key as the record.....
Rant over.

I agree there is something lost in evolution of jamming. But I'm referring to jamming per style than per song. I was fortunate that I fell in with some older and well rounded players early on.The jams I started out with were multi genre, informal and not prone to endless noodling. It was a wonderful period of my development. The formal jams I have been to lately have been one style oriented and not as fun. Very few players want try and make it new again. Yes, The spirit of it has changed.

 

[Eddie Charles]

Personalities and like mindedness regarding the genre make all the difference. I started attending two different jams at a music center years ago...blues and bluegrass. They were large jams, well attended, and had a jam leader attempting to allow each attendee to choose a piece and start it...the rest would join in. They were interesting to say the least...you had a large spectrum of musical ability, beginners through accomplished. But the strange thing were people showing up wishing to to do Irving Berlin and Gilbert and Sullivan show tunes...mostly singers. They were very good, however, at a Blues or Bluegrass jam they sort of stuck out like sore thumbs. Between the odd choice of music and difficulty in parking due to the size of the groups both jam leaders let me know of another venue they were doing that was both smaller in members and more true to the type of music. It worked great! Most members were similar in level, music choices were more homogenized but still open to some interesting stretches into R&R or Jazz.
The Jam leaders are very good..accomplished and not only promoted letting individuals choose the next piece, but make suggestions as well as direct solos. The members get along nicely and enjoy each others company. The venue is a bar/restaurant and patrons quite often tip us....we decided all tips go to the wait staff...so they like to see us show up as well.
We have a core of 3 or 4 guys twice a month with enough interesting folk who show up from time to time to keep things interesting. We've been doing this for a number of years now. I'm aware that most jam groups don't last this long. So I think I've found something special. However the music in Bluegrass or Blues is rather basic and very conducive to jamming. If someone wants to get into jaming one of these two types of music is a great introduction.

 

[James Wavrin]

I have another (humorous) thread going about jam bands. On a more serious note, I've been running jams for years, and probably always will. I'm saddened that so many people have lost the spirit of true jamming- Improvisation, and spontaneity.
Every week I end up with a bunch of GREAT players who just want to play songs. Maybe add a second (third...fourth) guitar solo, but the jamming aspect is all but gone.
I try to push my guests boundries, and a FEW of them get it. Go to double time feel, or a modulation, or switch up a groove- reggae Zeppelin, or metal Peaches and Herb.
I try to keep it interesting, and push peoples boundries.
I often just hit a brick wall. If it ain't on the record, they don't want to try it.
Too many automatons, not enough free spirits.
Another Pride and Joy.......in the same key as the record.....
Rant over.

I wish I could find some people to jam with, just get together a couple of days a week, play, share some food, beer, etc. Work on some original material etc. Anyone in Springfield, or. Just wanna play at the hobby level?. Jimmy at 541-214-8210. I have been playing for 15 months after a 40 year hiatus and playing solo is getting old

 

[cosmicevan]

As someone who lives and dies by the jam, I find it really disturbing how many musicians cannot or will not jam. To me it shows not only a lack of confidence but also an inability to jam tells me that you are not in fact a musician, but rather just a drummer or just a guitarist or whatever instrument you play. A true musician can make music with anything in my opinion...not to mention that jamming is how you really find out who you vibe with and it really is how you can grow as a musician. Spending hours woodshedding to learn a written part is just building muscle memory and flexing your memorization ability. Jamming is understanding music at a conceptual level and can be performed with any level of musical ability.

I consider myself a musician who just happens to play bass.

 

[cosmicevan]

Open mics are very popular on Long Island, where I live. My experience has been that they are useful for networking and finding players/opportunities but they produce very little good music. It's great when top-shelf players are jamming but for the most part, second-tier (semi-pro) or third-tier (hobbyist) players come out. Mostly it's a way for real players to pick up a steady gig every week since live music venues are at a low ebb these days. The other guys in my band go to one or even two every week. Sometimes I'll go but I prefer to spend the time working on original tracks in my home studio.

Have you found open jams on LI that encourage actual jamming? I've tried to go to one or two and it's always a situation where the band leader asks what song do I want to jam on and I say no song, just jam and they say that's not what this is. If there is in fact an open jam on LI where people actually jam, let me know...I'd be there every week (I live on LI too)

 

[Miles_ONeal]

@Paulabass I really get your point. "Jamming" does not simply mean "longer guitar solos", but rather an interplay between all the musicians that includes close listening, with the ability to take things to different musical places - put different spins on the music at different times.
I love me some of that.

And ideally, at different points, everyone gets a chance to lead.

 

[Dalmasn]

I think some of the nicest grooves comes from jamming together in the rehearsal space. I think why so many people are not up for jamming is the lack of musical theory. Just learn the damn penta scale and you can jam to basically anything, just stick to the key and your fine =) The second thing I think puts people off is the fear of playing sour notes on stage, but come on, it's called a jam for a reason.
Exploring new ideas, getting the feel for where the guitar/drummer is going (I'm a bassist) and catching up on that or leading into slower/faster territory is so fun and nice when it falls into place, for sure, a lot of times it doesn't. The better you know each others playing the better the jam!
Most of our original songs are offsprings from "lets jam on A" or something like that, so keep on jamming! =)

 

[lowendfriend]

It's the advent of YouTube musicians. A lot of people are learning note for note from there. I lose a lot of students because I teach practical theory. The ones who get it become monsters. They are learning Nashville Number System first lesson and are playing (without fills) the first lesson. They are trained to use their ear and apply the things that they learn in every lessons.

Their friends may learn songs, but within 3 months, my guys are playing circles around the other teachers students... and they actually tend to stick with the instrument.

You nailed the three types, but left off what I refer to as pedal monsters.... The guys that sail off into a stratosphere of mushy notes and runs and generally bring a jam to a halt.

I'm of the structure persuasion. Generally jam crowds are so diverse as to their types that there has to be some basis for sharing the stage. The structure common approach allows experts to solo with fair freedom and us okay guys to play with them without a complete train wreck. Structure can even accommodate the note for note guys as they likely also adhere to structure. In my mind, best way to accommodate the widest range of off the street players. I think it's kind of a darwinian methodology for jams unless you have a senior citizen that knows the skill level of all the players and can manage a jam firmly.

 

[DGXR]

I've always viewed jamming as a waste of time...simply letting the guitar player play endless ideas over 1 to 3 chords is not my idea of having fun or being creative.

Add to this, the other "musicians" you're jamming with are still trying to learn the basics... jamming quickly becomes tiresome. I continue to reach out for more opportunities with other musicians but for now these are the guys who are able to get together. I have suggested that we each take a turn doing the "solo" stuff while the other people just play a basic tune/chorus, but they always forget what we are doing and they go off into their own thing. Humans can be frustrating.

 

[AshokanKid]

I often just hit a brick wall. If it ain't on the record, they don't want to try it.
Too many automatons, not enough free spirits.
.....
Rant over.

This really hit home for me, AND is a huge part of the reason why I am NOW exploring playing BASS~! (So-called "jam sessions" where there are 10 guitarists waiting in line to show off their ummm.... "creative" chops, on a "song" that someone ELSE wrote!)

I started playing (electric) guitar in the late '60's with Jimi Hendrix, Zappa, Clapton (Cream), Jerry & The Grateful Dead, Bartok, Stravinsky, (Wes Mongomery, Kenny Burrell) etc.,etc., etc. as my musical mentors / heroes.
Our basement / garage get togethers were JAMS in that we rarely if ever played an entire "song" and yet would play for hours and LOVE our time together (think; Spoonful by Cream). (Judgement Rant Coming; Who gives a ratzazz about copying what someone ELSE wrote and plays over and over and over and over. Creativity? That is NOT! Cover Band Practice? Sure, quite valid itinerary.)

Fast forward some 40 years and those are STILL some of my most fun memories playing. Now,that being said, as I picked up the bass for the very first time EVER to play before an audience (off-Broadway Cabaret in Manhattan), we played four Beatles songs and I had a BLAST.
That bass-ically showed ME how much fun I could have playing bass (ala, almost note for note Paul McCartney!) and not trying to noodle my way to heaven on six string electric guitar.

At the same time, at least to me, a jam is NOT a practice session for playing "songs" (goodness, we are SO lost without STRUCTURE these days!). I've read other comments that disagree, but to me at least, a jam is a free spirited EXPLORATION of something entirely NEW. Perhaps one guest (drummer, bassist, keyboardist, guitarist or even singer) shouts out an idea or a groove, and then the room runs with it, EXPLORING the possibility and enjoying the NEWNESS of something NEVER before played.

I prefer a jam to be something new. Perhaps the possibility of something that could become a "song" or piece of NEW music. THAT is Creativity. Granted, I do realize that this may not be everyone's cup of tea and I'll have to strongly disagree that this type of jamming takes a Very Special Musician in order to make it work & be fun. Consider that the very first Jams were likely someone banging a stick on a log and then someone else joining in, singing, chanting, humming, whistling or whatever.

Music = FUN
When did this all get so serious?!?!? ;-)
Even Classical Musicians love to let their hair down (at least once in a Blue Moon).

Thanks for posting this thread!

 

[Oci-One Kanubi]

I have another (humorous) thread going about jam bands. ... Too many automatons, not enough free spirits.
Another Pride and Joy.......in the same key as the record.....
Rant over.

If its in the same key as the record, then you're hanging out with too many %$#@#$&# de-tuners!

 

[candiehappy]

Personally, I don't enjoy jamming at all. I noodle enough on my own. I don't need a group of other people doing it at the same time.

"jamming" is not equal to "noodleing'

 

[Donzer]

I love to jam. At least my opinion of what it is. To try something different, to hit something that maybe doesn't sound right at first, but is INTERESTING. Alas, I've fallen by the wayside in the scene, and haven't done it for years.
It really does need people who are prepared to throw caution to the winds, and not want to reproduce something note for note.
I love to put my own spin on well known bass lines - Money, but kind of slapped for example. I don't like to go for a straight copy of anything.