The Great Bass Preamp/DI Comparison

[SteveC]

It's all gone. I am committed to the simpler, smaller, digital life now. One person in my band notices a difference - if he's listening for it. Still have to decide which form - Stomp or XL. I can make a case for either. Until I decide and buy something, I'm using my son's Pod Go this weekend. I have a basic preset (SVTPro4) and 3 effects that I'll try.

 

[Zbysek]

New toy from Genzler:

MAGELLAN Preamp/DI Pedal - Genzler Amplification

 

[chadhargis]

Stomp or XL.

I decided to go with the HX Stomp over the XL because I don't use that many effects, so an external switch gives me more buttons if I need them, but if I want to go ultra portable I can. If you really need more buttons, a MIDI controller is always an option.

When it comes to bass preamps, I am starting to feel like the scene from the movie "Wargames" where they have the computer play itself until it figures out there is no way to win. I've tested lots of gear, played live going direct as well as with an amp. I've played different genres of music with different basses. At the end of the day, flexibility is the name of the game for me.

 

[MaxSpinrun]

Me too, incoming Genzler Magellan Pre. Full featured.

 

[Pedalnetics]

Dang, wish the Genzler had the drive channel on a footswitch like the 800 does.

 

[Lowendtech]

Dang, wish the Genzler had the drive channel on a footswitch like the 800 does.

That’s what the 4OTF and/or the Crash Box are for I reckon.

Interesting that the Subway Pre/DI’s are being discontinued and this pops up just in time. Kudos to Andy and Jeff.

 

[Uncle Walt]

Yeah, I haven’t used my REDDI for a while. No one really misses it. (I do love the Empress Compressor and the new Empress Para EQ Deluxe with the REDDI but it’s a lot of expensive stuff and lots of knobs.) I was thinking XL but I think I’d probably just go Stomp, put it on my Nano with my tuner, my Rolls for my IEM’s and be set. I think if I had a good basic preset (been using the SVTPro4) and 3 foot switches for 3 effects (more than I’ve used in years) I’d probably be set.

I’ll use my synth for synth (as you just can’t quite get the sustain thing of a keyboard with a bass) so I don’t feel like I’d need lots of presets per gig, like I said above.

And like you said, if you want to change it up, you easily can. If my REDDI would sell, I’d be all set.

I love modelers and I'm 100% in the camp that you can replace analog gear with digital gear in 2023.
However, while what you spelled out is a killer live rig, it's probably not fit for purpose in the studio. If you do a lot of session work or want to bring a "signature" sound to the studio, you will either need to keep the analog gear or step up your "modeler" to something like a Kemper or Quad Cortex. That said, most studios have decent pres and DIs so you don't need to bring your own stuff. I do still run into a lot of studios just using a Sansamp BDDI and I hate their synthetic-sounding high end so I always bring my own stuff.

TLDR; If you don't need to bring gear to the studio your plan seems on point but if you are ever gonna want to have your own studio gear hang on to the REDDI.

PS - I use my Kemper for session work all the time but I also keep a Broughton Studio One and a Sonic Farm 2DI4 together in a pelican case for studio gigs. They don't get a lot of use anymore because engineers are coming around to the Kemper and its re-amping capabilities.

 

[Uncle Walt]

As a rabid Broughton fanboi for a few years (and I still am), I swore up and down by my ginormous analog pedalboard. I didn't believe for a second that the Stomp could ever replace my analog setup. But it actually has replaced a great deal of it. It has not replaced many of the Broughtons, mind you, nor can it. But most of the other stuff and a handful of Broughtons have been replaced, which for me is quite a statement.

The Stomp wasn't terribly easy to dial in, and I'm still figuring it out. I have seriously aggravated my tinnitus from sitting and tweaking for hours on end. I have a few great core tones that I've dialed in, but there are so many options at times it is a bit overwhelming. I don't even want to think about all of the time I've spent trying to craft a good crossover distortion or fuzz patch.

I have not purchased any presets, but am still considering it. The factory presets are awful, IMHO. You will learn a great deal from downloading other people's patches and seeing how they create a patch, or watching videos on Youtube of how people create bass patches. The first thing I did was got presets from another Talkbass member to get me started. I didn't use any of his stuff as is, but many of them were a great starting point to help me learn how to dial things in. Dr. Tone also has some great free presets available which will cue you in on how to do some things. A lot of his stuff seems geared towards Billy Sheehan dual-pickup bass tones. I haven't really been able to get much out of it with my own setup. But again, it showed me how presets can be created. I can't really wrap my head around his stuff. A lot of his tone seems to come from compression and EQ's, as opposed to cab sims, for example. Which blows my mind. It's a whole other way of thinking of things. In his demo videos on his site, his stuff sounds awesome. But it does not sound like that with my bass and setup. But again, there were some great starting points in there, and they might work great for you as is. I also got some halfway decent tones from the Custom Tone community on the Line6 website. They have all required tweaking to be usable for me, but there are some great starting points out there.

But most people probably would not do what I have done. My three core tones are a Sunn, Fender, and Ampeg SVT CL. But I'm an Ampeg guy at heart, so each patch has a fairly similarly dialed in Ampeg SVT4-Pro feeding the other amp(s). It's unorthodox, to be sure, but I really love it. the SVT4-Pro is what has taken the place, mostly, of my Broughton SVPre, which was otherwise always on in my analog setup. And even that was feeding another SVT sim with a Mesa 8x10 cab sim at the end.

For the overwhelming majority of the time, most of the tones I've downloaded from others . . . not to mention the factory presets . . . did not sound very good in my setup and required at least some tweaking. But I take what they offer, and incorporate it into the sound I'm looking for, add some cab sims from Shift Line's bass IR pack, and I'm off and running. Now I'm down to just a handful of Broughtons and other things and the Stomp. And my lower back couldn't be happier.

That being said, I'm also not someone who incorporates a ton of different tones in any given set. I find one great core sound and stick with, then add some drive on occasion, maybe some octave, maybe both, maybe some chorus, or all of the above. And the Stomp has plenty of options for those things to keep you happy for a very long time.

I think everyone should be considering the jump to digital at this point and I get why the HX line is so attractive. I'd like to make a case for the Kemper, I know that a Kemper stage is double the price used of a new XL but IMHO it's worth the extra money.

I've profiled all that Broughton gear that you love and have the best of both worlds. The Kemper doesn't just use Impulse Response (IRs) it actually uses machine learning to capture profiles of the analog gear and then you can still add cabinet IRs on top of that if you'd like. On top of being a great piece of live gear, it is a legit piece of studio gear too. I can re-amp your recordings and has a built it strobe tuner. I can usually beat the "Pepsi challenge" A/Bing IRs vs real gear but I've yet to meet anyone that can reliably tell the difference between the Kemper and analog tube gear.

The Kemper is bigger, more expensive, doesn't have a built-it expression pedal and has a much steeper learning curve but the tone is SOOOO much better and the ability to copy all your favorite gear is worth every penny. IMHO. #My2Cents

 

[SteveC]

I love modelers and I'm 100% in the camp that you can replace analog gear with digital gear in 2023.

However, while what you spelled out is a killer live rig, it's probably not fit for purpose in the studio. If you do a lot of session work or want to bring a "signature" sound to the studio, you will either need to keep the analog gear or step up your "modeler" to something like a Kemper or Quad Cortex. That said, most studios have decent pres and DIs so you don't need to bring your own stuff. I do still run into a lot of studios just using a Sansamp BDDI and I hate their synthetic-sounding high end so I always bring my own stuff.

TLDR; If you don't need to bring gear to the studio your plan seems on point but if you are ever gonna want to have your own studio gear hang on to the REDDI.

Digital stuff is so much improved that yeah, I do feel it's the future. I didn't even 5 years ago.
I don't do session work so it's not a consideration right now.
I did consider the Quad Cortex, but for what I'm doing, the "Helix" stuff is fine.

I think everyone should be considering the jump to digital at this point and I get why the HX line is so attractive. I'd like to make a case for the Kemper, I know that a Kemper stage is double the price used of a new XL but IMHO it's worth the extra money.

I've profiled all that Broughton gear that you love and have the best of both worlds. The Kemper doesn't just use Impulse Response (IRs) it actually uses machine learning to capture profiles of the analog gear and then you can still add cabinet IRs on top of that if you'd like. On top of being a great piece of live gear, it is a legit piece of studio gear too. I can re-amp your recordings and has a built it strobe tuner. I can usually beat the "Pepsi challenge" A/Bing IRs vs real gear but I've yet to meet anyone that can reliably tell the difference between the Kemper and analog tube gear.

The Kemper is bigger, more expensive, doesn't have a built-it expression pedal and has a much steeper learning curve but the tone is SOOOO much better and the ability to copy all your favorite gear is worth every penny. IMHO. #My2Cents

Again, I agree but I have to balance the quality and cost and what I can live with. I think in a live mix, in armpit USA, the "Helix" stuff is a lot of bang for the buck. The Kemper and QC are awesome if you are recording or a touring pro or just need that ultra high level of stuff.

 

[jacoby75]

I think everyone should be considering the jump to digital at this point and I get why the HX line is so attractive. I'd like to make a case for the Kemper, I know that a Kemper stage is double the price used of a new XL but IMHO it's worth the extra money.

I've profiled all that Broughton gear that you love and have the best of both worlds. The Kemper doesn't just use Impulse Response (IRs) it actually uses machine learning to capture profiles of the analog gear and then you can still add cabinet IRs on top of that if you'd like. On top of being a great piece of live gear, it is a legit piece of studio gear too. I can re-amp your recordings and has a built it strobe tuner. I can usually beat the "Pepsi challenge" A/Bing IRs vs real gear but I've yet to meet anyone that can reliably tell the difference between the Kemper and analog tube gear.

The Kemper is bigger, more expensive, doesn't have a built-it expression pedal and has a much steeper learning curve but the tone is SOOOO much better and the ability to copy all your favorite gear is worth every penny. IMHO. #My2Cents

Yes, if money were no object, the Kemper would have definitely been on my radar. It looks amazing. But alas, money is an object. An object I have very little of. I think the Stomp is an excellent entry into the digital world for people looking to go that route. It's not overly complicated unless you want it to be, and it sounds great. But I'm sure the Kemper would smoke it.

 

[TheArchitect]

I would buy a Nobel before I bought a Kemper for bass

 

[scubaduba]

I would buy a Nobel before I bought a Kemper for bass

I'd buy a Quad Cortex over the Noble or Kemper for bass.
Oh wait.... I did.

 

[odarellmc]

I think everyone should be considering the jump to digital at this point and I get why the HX line is so attractive. I'd like to make a case for the Kemper, I know that a Kemper stage is double the price used of a new XL but IMHO it's worth the extra money.

I've profiled all that Broughton gear that you love and have the best of both worlds. The Kemper doesn't just use Impulse Response (IRs) it actually uses machine learning to capture profiles of the analog gear and then you can still add cabinet IRs on top of that if you'd like. On top of being a great piece of live gear, it is a legit piece of studio gear too. I can re-amp your recordings and has a built it strobe tuner. I can usually beat the "Pepsi challenge" A/Bing IRs vs real gear but I've yet to meet anyone that can reliably tell the difference between the Kemper and analog tube gear.

The Kemper is bigger, more expensive, doesn't have a built-it expression pedal and has a much steeper learning curve but the tone is SOOOO much better and the ability to copy all your favorite gear is worth every penny. IMHO. #My2Cents

Given how much I've spent on pedals and the accessories, the Kemper is definitely doable. Wish I new they existed, but I'm in too deep now

 

[Yamarc]

I think everyone should be considering the jump to digital at this point and I get why the HX line is so attractive. I'd like to make a case for the Kemper, I know that a Kemper stage is double the price used of a new XL but IMHO it's worth the extra money.

I've profiled all that Broughton gear that you love and have the best of both worlds. The Kemper doesn't just use Impulse Response (IRs) it actually uses machine learning to capture profiles of the analog gear and then you can still add cabinet IRs on top of that if you'd like. On top of being a great piece of live gear, it is a legit piece of studio gear too. I can re-amp your recordings and has a built it strobe tuner. I can usually beat the "Pepsi challenge" A/Bing IRs vs real gear but I've yet to meet anyone that can reliably tell the difference between the Kemper and analog tube gear.

The Kemper is bigger, more expensive, doesn't have a built-it expression pedal and has a much steeper learning curve but the tone is SOOOO much better and the ability to copy all your favorite gear is worth every penny. IMHO. #My2Cents

Can a person purchase or swap files of popular pedals / gear on the Kemper? Or does one have to personally purchase each piece of gear and load files that way?

 

[scubaduba]

How it works with the Quad Cortext is you connect your device to wifi and use a mobile app to find any of the many, many captures that have been uploaded by users to the Neural Cloud. Star the ones you want and they are downloaded to your Quad Cortex. Easy as that. Anything from Ampeg, to Fender to Mesa gear is up on the cloud. Fuzz, Dirt, amps, cabs.... preamps..... I've personally captured several devices and uploaded to the Neural Cloud. On my Quand Cortex I have captures of Noble, Gorilla, REDDI, Alembic FX1, Emperor, Demeter, Jule preamps.... and many other devices.

Easy to use, with touch screen and all.

 

[SteveC]

The QC did tempt me for a while. The “iPad” like touch screen. Not needing a computer to do editing or make it easier. The captures - I would t do them but I suppose I’d use them. It’s all cool. But I just can’t do &1,800. The Stomp - while no QC - sounds pretty good and does a lot for $600. If I were more pro or did higher profile stuff maybe. But I live and gig in North Dakota/NW Minnesota. I just don’t need all thy power for the street dance. And I’m kind of in a reduce phase. Trying to sell a bass and get down to two. Minimize my “board” and reduce the carry.

 

[chadhargis]

I'd buy a Quad Cortex over the Noble or Kemper for bass.
Oh wait.... I did.

I’d love to have a Quad Cortex. I figure in 5 years things will be even better. By that time, Line 6 may have ended support on the HX Stomp and I’ll need to upgrade.

 

[Yamarc]

If anyone has any sound samples that compares the QC to the real deal preamp/pedal (e.g., Noble, REDDI, Doom 2, etc), I’d love to hear that!

 

[SteveC]

I’d love to have a Quad Cortex. I figure in 5 years things will be even better. By that time, Line 6 may have ended support on the HX Stomp and I’ll need to upgrade.

As someone buying a Stomp this weekend, I hope they go for 5 years.

 

[chadhargis]

As someone buying a Stomp this weekend, I hope they go for 5 years.

I'm just guessing. They may support them for much longer.

But being a technology professional, I have seen some of the latest and greatest technology become yesterdays news in short order far too many times.

Of course the HX Stomp won't quit working, but perhaps they don't release any more updates and they don't update the editor for new versions of OSes.

What I'm really hoping for is that they eventually support a bluetooth USB dongle so you can edit patches on a phone or tablet.