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The host band ruined the jam.

Paulabass

Paulabass

Sep 18, 2017
5,435
21,954
#1
I went to a newish jam where the host band is also fronted by the venue owner.
The host band-not bad- tuned to E flat. Why? Because when they play by themselves that's what they do.
I got up and tuned down. Everybody else was out of tune all night, two piano players couldn't play at all because the band leader called all the keys wrong (When you're tuned down, it isn't E anymore moron) Everybody scrambled to get in tune.
I mentioned it in passing to the BL, but it wasn't my jam. Everybody left (bad sound didn't help things.)
When his jam dies, it will be nobody's fault but him.
 
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#5
I assume the "piano players" were playing an actual acoustic piano tuned standard A440; otherwise a "keyboard" is very easy to change the tuning. With that assumption...

Mistake #1: Tuning to Eb and playing along with a piano tuned standard. It practically begs for a clusterfudge.

This is why some bands/projects need a little thing called leadership.
 
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#7
I sometimes wonder if the bands tuning a half step down to accommodate a singer performing outside their range of ability ever bother at least trying the material in standard pitch...or the key the song was written/intended to be performed in. Of all the pervasive, lazy behaviors that exist in cover-band land, the half step down thing takes the cake.
 
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#9
petrus61 said:
I sometimes wonder if the bands tuning a half step down to accommodate a singer performing outside their range of ability ever bother at least trying the material in standard pitch...or the key the song was written/intended to be performed in. Of all the pervasive, lazy behaviors that exist in cover-band land, the half step down thing takes the cake.
Click to expand...
I think a lot more of it is- Stevie Ray Vaughn claimed all the tone in a guitar is in heavy string, but you have to tune down to bend them. Most of the downtuners I meet call 'Cold Shot' for the first song. It can't be coincidence.
 
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#11
Paulabass said:
I think a lot more of it is- Stevie Ray Vaughn claimed all the tone in a guitar is in heavy string, but you have to tune down to bend them. Most of the downtuners I meet call 'Cold Shot' for the first song. It can't be coincidence.
Click to expand...

I always figured SRV tuned down a half step to keep the damned harmonica players away
 
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#12
This topic comes up at least once a week.

Eb tuning is here to stay. Familiarity with this tuning is a must-have skill in a bassist's tool box. Especially in the blues genre! (SRV, Hendrix, etc.)

Understanding drop/alternate tunings is also a required skill for any pianist who wants to jam with guitarists.

PS to your "moron" comment, the guitarist was actually correct in this situation; it is common and accepted practice to call their bottom string "E" even though it is actually tuned to concert Eb.
 
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#13
Mushroo said:
This topic comes up at least once a week.

Eb tuning is here to stay. Familiarity with this tuning is a must-have skill in a bassist's tool box. Especially in the blues genre! (SRV, Hendrix, etc.)

Understanding drop/alternate tunings is also a required skill for any pianist who wants to jam with guitarists.

PS to your "moron" comment, the guitarist was actually correct in this situation; it is common and accepted practice to call their bottom string "E" even though it is actually tuned to concert Eb.
Click to expand...
+1

I don't know why people continue to get their panties in a knot over this.

And for the 100th time, it's not that a singer needs relief on one single song, it's the cumulative relief of singing an entire night down 1/2 step. I don't know why that's so hard to understand.

I don't go to open mics, but when I do an audition i ALWAYS ask if they tune down.
 
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#14
lfmn16 said:
And for the 100th time, it's not that a singer needs relief on one single song, it's the cumulative relief of singing an entire night down 1/2 step. I don't know why that's so hard to understand.
Click to expand...

I agree, and in fact, I'm going to go even further and make the observation that sometimes bands use altered tunings for instrumental songs without vocals! ;)
 
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#15
I have had this problem with the use of a capo. The guitarists puts it on the second fret and then does an E standard fingering... calling the chord E. No, it IS F# not E. I do not agree with any re-tuning being called anything other than the real note/chord. The bass does not use a capo and I still need to know the "real" key of the song... (BTW, I hate Eb, but then I am a fan of standard tuning on a 4 string...). In any case, I find this sort of attitude to be self-serving and rather amateur...
 
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#16
Mushroo said:
PS to your "moron" comment, the guitarist was actually correct in this situation; it is common and accepted practice to call their bottom string "E" even though it is actually tuned to concert Eb.
Click to expand...

:-/

If you decide to play a transposing instrument, you'd better damn well know your notes and chord in concert pitch and communicate them as such. Sure, that sax player is playing a "C", but he would be a moron if he knew his concert pitch was Bb and yet insisted on telling other musicians on the bandstand that he's playing a melody in C major. A complete shagin moron.
 
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#18
RoaDan said:
I have had this problem with the use of a capo. The guitarists puts it on the second fret and then does an E standard fingering... calling the chord E. No, it IS F# not E. I do not agree with any re-tuning being called anything other than the real note/chord. The bass does not use a capo and I still need to know the "real" key of the song... (BTW, I hate Eb, but then I am a fan of standard tuning on a 4 string...). In any case, I find this sort of attitude to be self-serving and rather amateur...
Click to expand...

The guitarist is "correct" to call that chord E instead of F#.

I take it you don't work much with horn players? When John Coltrane played Bb on his saxophone, he called it C. When Jimi Hendrix played Eb on his guitar, he called it E. Same difference.
 
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#19
Paulabass said:
I went to a newish jam where the host band is also fronted by the venue owner.
The host band-not bad- tuned to E flat. Why? Because when they play by themselves that's what they do.
I got up and tuned down. Everybody else was out of tune all night, two piano players couldn't play at all because the band leader called all the keys wrong (When you're tuned down, it isn't E anymore moron) Everybody scrambled to get in tune.
I mentioned it in passing to the BL, but it wasn't my jam. Everybody left (bad sound didn't help things.)
When his jam dies, it will be nobody's fault but him.
Click to expand...

You have frets … use them …

The keyboards have black keys … use them

I play 5 string basses so I can play Eb, D, Db, C, B … no problem

Maybe the house band should tune down to D standard … or drop C
 
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