Tips on playing fretless

[Erick Lam]

My teacher said if you play lined fretless to play exactly on the line is that right ?? If it is boy do I need to improve my left hand intonation

In theory, the string has to be free to vibrate at the fret so the finger has to be right behind it. It's mostly true in practice as well but people's fingers squish differently against the board and you're looking at most fret lines at an angle so some looks as though you're playing behind and others in front. The idea is to learn your bass well by ear using open strings and then look where is your finger when it's in tune. Never assume you're in-tune because your finger is at the right position, especially when you're starting.

The best tip I can impart is to try NOT to make it sound like a fretless.

That's the best advice I can think of. Separate the "normal playing" from "fretless playing". When learning a song, try to eliminate the fretless sound as much as possible.

 

[JTE]

I've been playing fretless pretty much exclusively for 35 years or so. The best tip I can impart is to try NOT to make it sound like a fretless. Once you can do that reliably everything else will fall right into place, IME.

BINGO!!!

The key is to be able to play in tune and move from note to note with intonation so accurate that people don't know you're playing fretless. Why? Because then you can apply the expression a fretless affords for MUSICAL reasons rather than due to technical limitations.

Another thing I've found with (at least my two) fretless basses is that WHERE you play on the string has a bigger impact on your sound than is apparent on fretted bass. Not just with your left hand, but also where you pluck. Work on playing passages in a lot of different locations of the neck, and attacking it with different locations of the string with your plucking hand.

Record yourself playing, especially if you're pretty confident of your intonation. Then LISTEN closely to that recording for an honest appraisal of your intonation. Like many others, I'd learned good technique on fretted so I was already fretting right at the fret wire. I adapted to fretless very quickly and thought my playing was in tune very early on. But recordings showed that while I was right on about 95+% of the time those few exceptions were grating and obvious only in context of the rest of the band on recordings.

Listen to great fretless players and not just the ones we all know (and most revere) like Jaco, Pino, Mannring, etc. One key influence on my fretless playing is Freebo. He's on the early Bonnie Raitt albums (early ones, WAY before Don Was and John Hiatt made her a "star"- I first heard her in 1973 and some of her finest work is on her second and third albums "Give It Up" and "Takin' My Time"). There are several track on those records which are just Freebo with Bonnie's acoustic guitar and voice. His sensitive attention to the SONG and the singer are framed by his fretless P bass. You only know he's playing fretless when he WANTS you to know it.

Another treasure to help you in this study is Dave Pomeroy's soulful playing in support of Trisha Yearwood's voice, especially on the album "Thinkin' About You". Dig how he places slides perfectly to express the longing in "You Can Sleep While I Drive" or the pain in "On A Bus To St. Cloud".

And my final bit of advice, is to NOT put limits on the fretless. Try it in different places, even where you (or others) might think it not appropriate. Sure, it's cool on blues tunes, and to emulate an upright on pseud-jazz things like "Moondance". It's even kinda obvious on Jack Bruce songs (btw, I LOVE playing fretless on "Badge" and "White Room"). But try it on "I Feel Good" or "Day Tripper", or "Can't Get Next To You", or even "I Want To Take You Higher". It may not work for you or your band. But it might be perfect, and unless you fearlessly try it, you won't know.

John

 

[JTE]

I have both a lined and an unlined fretless. Don't pay much attention to the lines, they're only suggestions. Instead of relying on the lines, rely on what it SOUNDS like. Of course, if the bass is set up correctly you'll wind up right at the lines most of the time anyway. But that's good technique in fretted too- you want to fret right at the fret, not in the middle of the fret space.

Being right at the fret means you have less pressure required to have good contact between the fret and the string (this facilitates both fast playing, and ease of playing without fatigue). It also means your intonation will be more accurate because you won't be stretching the string as much as when you fret well behind the fret.

John

 

[NickInMesa]

My teacher said if you play lined fretless to play exactly on the line is that right ?? If it is boy do I need to improve my left hand intonation

I don't think he is right. You'd be sharp. Use your tuner and find out...

When I use my ears, my fingers are right before the fret line.

Fret lines are currently my friends but they are a bit like training wheels if you see what I mean.

 

[Passinwind]

Listen to great fretless players and not just the ones we all know (and most revere) like Jaco, Pino, Mannring, etc. One key influence on my fretless playing is Freebo. He's on the early Bonnie Raitt albums (early ones, WAY before Don Was and John Hiatt made her a "star"- I first heard her in 1973 and some of her finest work is on her second and third albums "Give It Up" and "Takin' My Time"). There are several track on those records which are just Freebo with Bonnie's acoustic guitar and voice. His sensitive attention to the SONG and the singer are framed by his fretless P bass. You only know he's playing fretless when he WANTS you to know it.

Freebo came in and played a set at one of our huge winery jams last fall. I had to leave for a gig and missed it, but he was a huge influence on me when those early Bonnie Raitt sides were released.

Lots of good stuff in your post John.

 

[SanDiegoHarry]

Line?

Feh to lines. I know, lotsa name guys have basses with lines... but I find that they just confuse me. The thing about fretless is that you REALLY need to woodshed it - you have to play and play and play and play to get the feel. It took me years to get decent at fretless, and I'm only decent. You have to invest time - there's no way around it.

 

[maxiegrant]

I just got a Squier VM FL.

It must be because I grew up playing poorly setup instruments that I learned to play with the finger right against the fret.

I found my marks very naturally and played in tuned right away, almost without looking at the fret lines.

I suppose this is a great first fretless. I enjoy playing it a lot and I'm surprise by the quality of this Squier.

Anyway, if anybody could give me some extra pointers, that would be nice. What types of techniques particular to fretless playing should I try to master?

To me, it does not get better than 80s Pino Palladino, especially all the Paul Young stuff

Not a lot of tips, but just to add that the Squier VM Jazz FL is the bomb. I had played a Univox Lectra years ago that I still have (short scale, NO dots or lines on neck), which sounded very boomy for its tiny size (it is shaped exactly like a Hofner) and loved it. I also played contrabass in college but unfortunately a move separated me from the bass I was renting and I never picked another one up.

But I hadn't really wanted to play fretless in years until I picked that Squier off the wall at Doo Wop in Louisville. I had tried MANY fretlesses, but that one just spoke to me. It said "get me RIGHT NOW, take me home, and learn to play half your songs on me." Which I promptly did. It sounds just wonderful and feels so natural in my hands. Until about a year ago I had never even TRIED a Jazz bass, but these Squier VM Jazzes are just the shizzle. Both my main instruments are now Squiers. 18 months ago it was a Rickenbacker 4001 (actual vintage 73) and a Spector.

Tips, tips: what everyone else said. I learned to play fretless on that Univox, as I said, and there are marks cut into the side of the fretboard but no lines or markings of any kind as I recall on the board itself. So I learned to listen to what I was doing. That said, the lines really help. I don't think they were what made Jaco a fabulous player but they are certainly useful. But the first rule is get your fingers in position and you will very rapidly figure out that you can't get away with being sloppy or you will sound like sh*t. Play that fretless a few months and you'll come back to the fretted bass a much more disciplined player.

 

[Chris K]

Line?

Feh to lines. I know, lotsa name guys have basses with lines... but I find that they just confuse me. The thing about fretless is that you REALLY need to woodshed it - you have to play and play and play and play to get the feel. It took me years to get decent at fretless, and I'm only decent. You have to invest time - there's no way around it.

+1

And lines on a fretless are sooooooooo UGLY.

 

[7StringBassist]

Here is my take on lines PERSONALLY I believe that they are good IMHO to take a visual where the note is coming from so now you not only can you hear say a C but see it as well now you have feel,sound and visual learning.

Also I do not have say the greatest ears im near mono tone deaf but It helps me a deal because I know what Im playing.

 

[DeepGroover]

Lots of good advice already.

After 7 years on fretless, I couldn't add much more. Just reitarate.

- Learn to play as if you play on a fretted bass (+1000)
- Don't follow the lines, use them. Even on the best set-up bass, intonation changes. So, if a note is pitch perfect when played right on the second fret line, a note will usually be out of tune if played on the 15th.
- Learn to set up your bass according to your taste, and keep this set-up constant until you feel really comfortable (ie: you don't always look at your finger placement even after the "12th fret", you can groove without thinking about finger position, you don't slide around unless you want to, you control your "right hand tone" etc).
- Keep playing on a fretted bass, but remember that both instruments are quite different. It will contrast with your fretless playing and keep you thinking on how you play and what you could do better or just different.
- Mwah is cool, but use sparsely. Same with harmonics, harmonic sliding etc. That goes back to the first point.
- RECORD YOURSELF. Every time you practice. Figure out why you're out of tune and work on correcting that.
- Jam. Get used to having to play with good intonation.

 

[perfektspace6]

It's not terribly challenging if you have been playing for a while and have a decent ear. If you are new to the instrument I am not so sure. I did not pick up a fretless until about 5 years of playing.

Don't think about it too much. Play with your ear. Work on vibrato and playing in the upper register which can be tricky. You don't need a video or a book. Just listen to some of the greats and practice, practice, practice.

 

[deckard]

In addition to the many *good* suggestions made above,

don't get caught up in the "DON'T LOOK AT THE FINGERBOARD" macho crap so many fretless guys on TB espouse.

Of course you don't want to rely exclusively on a visual... that's a given: you want to train your ear to be the best it can be, natch.

But waaay too many guys on TB will attempt to draw you into their little macho world saying that you're a wimp if you have to look at the fingerboard: utter crap.

Plenty of superior fretless players look at the fingerboard and their hands all the time while playing:

Michael Manring, Gary Willis (who flat out says "Look at/watch your hands!"), Mark Egan, Jaco, Jack Bruce, etc., etc., etc.

It's about how you SOUND... and you don't get extra points for difficulty.

 

[Anonymatt]

On looking at the fingerboard:

I play fretless and am just beginning to read music. Can't look at the bass much, only glances here and there.

I look at the instrument when improvising alone (no one or nothing else to look at).

Otherwise, you want to be able to look at girls. Or you want to be able to play with your eyes closed, 'cause it looks cool.

But if I was Jaco I guess I'd want to check out my hands too, huh?

 

[Tom Howland]

I've been playing fretless pretty much exclusively for 35 years or so. The best tip I can impart is to try NOT to make it sound like a fretless. Once you can do that reliably everything else will fall right into place, IME.

I've been playing fretless for 25 years.
This is so true.
I have new bassplayers come up to me when I'm playing fretless.
And all they want to hear is crazy slide notes.
I tell them play in tune, and you get payed.

 

[FromTheBassMent]

Wow, this thread is chock-full of great advice! I'll reiterate a couple of points that have already been well stated, and add a couple of comments based on my 30 years of fretless playing.

Obviously, a fretless bass can do lots of things a fretted bass can't... that's why they're so fun! The temptation early on is to focus on glissandos, sliding double stops and harmonics, crazy wide vibrato and all of those other trademark fretless histrionics. Do 'em! Get that out of your system for a while, because it's fun and it will help you get to know your instrument. Then, as someone wisely pointed out, practice sounding like you're NOT playing a fretless! In a typical four-set gig, I'll play sliding double stops on two or three songs max, because they FIT. I've seen Robbie Shakespeare play fretless a couple of times, and you wouldn't have known he was playing a bass without frets unless you listened very carefully. And of course, he was freakin brilliant.

Intonation is the constant challenge. Try practicing plugged into a tuner. Don't stare at the tuner... just stop in your playing once in a while and see how close you are. If you're sharp or flat (you will be), LOOK AT YOUR FINGER POSITION. For all of this excellent advice about muscle memory, you WILL look at your hands, and if you're looking and thinking you're in tune but are NOT, you're teaching yourself to play out of tune. Adjust your finger to get the intonation spot on, and make a mental note of where that is on your bass (this is especially critical if your fingerboard is unlined).

+100 to the observation above that muting the strings you're not playing is critical. Both of your hands can assist in getting this right. I'm a big advocate of keeping your plucking hand floating rather than anchored no matter what kind of bass you're playing... that way you can use the heel of your hand and the big ol' fleshy thumb muscle for muting when you move to higher strings.

Sliding high on the neck is fun, but try sliding into low notes as well... this can be a tasteful accent if done sparingly.

Occasionally popping a note, especially a low note, can be a powerful accent on fretless, because it really stands out from the rest of your notes, more so than on a fretted bass. Again, we're talking ACCENT here (Tony Levin is a master at this).

Tune your bass obsessively! Nothing honks up visual cues or muscle memory like an out-of-tune string.

Practice as much as you can. I've been wrestling with fretless for a long time and I still kinda suck, but my bandmates love the sound and I sure do love playing on a fretless, so I keep at it relentlessly. I'll practice unplugged while the missus and I watch a movie. Just having the instrument in your hands makes you better.

Have fun, accept the inevitable frustrations, and recognize that you are on a journey that will make you a better musician! I personally believe fretless can work for ANY musical style... I know a guy who plays a Pentabuzz in a hardcore metal band (fingerstyle!), and it sounds awesome because he is awesome.

Enjoy!

 

[FromTheBassMent]

Sorry, one other thing:

Mick Karn. He played with the 80's arty new-wave band Japan, did a one-off recording with Peter Murphy in a band called Dali's Car, and has since done a bunch of solo stuff. I don't always like his compositions, but he has been a huge influence on my playing. That's not to say I play like him (he's brilliant, I'm not), but struggling with note-for-noting some of his grooves really opened my eyes (see "His Box" from Dali's Car).

 

[Rojo Grande]

Left hand placement can be affected by how well and where the bass is intonated. Since it's a glissando instrument, the intonation can be set slightly in front of, right on, or slightly behind the line. Having this figured out ahead of time will help on boomy dark stages. You can minutely correct out of tune notes by rolling your fingertip forward or back (before kicking in the vibrato) as well. When in doubt, check yourself against a freshly tuned open string. Also, practice playing intervals, especially fourths. Check out Kai Eckhardt's work on "Live at the Royal Festival Hall" by John McLaughlin, and "More Mr. Nice Guy" by Garaj Mahal. And definitely anything with/by Gary Willis. He does some really cool palm mute solos with wicked pinch harmonics down on the low B.

 

[PilbaraBass]

DB players do it all the time...and good fretless players do it, too...

what is that? you ask...why it's playing a lot of open notes in your lines...

open notes set your "reference" on your ear, whether you are using that as a root, 3rd, 5th, or 7th...it doesn't really matter...but by using open notes, you "centre" your playing and it helps TREMENDOUSLY in keeping your lines in tune.

and yes, by all means...learn to make your fretless sound like a fretted instrument...nothing worse than a fretless player playing "slippy slidy" all over the neck...sounds like hooey...


And also, it's fun to practice playing fretless lines against vocal tracks...this will literally help your fretless voice to "sing"...
Pick your favourite crooners and go for it... I recommend sticking with a particular singer for a few weeks and then changing...don't go swapping from voice to voice until you've found "yours"...

 

[Chris K]

what is that? you ask...why it's playing a lot of open notes in your lines...

open notes set your "reference" on your ear, whether you are using that as a root, 3rd, 5th, or 7th...it doesn't really matter...but by using open notes, you "centre" your playing and it helps TREMENDOUSLY in keeping your lines in tune.

To learn intonation I found the frequent use of open strings open strings to be a very good idea.
Later on, I discovered I used open strings less and less. On one hand because I learned proper intonation, on the other because on fretless the difference in sound between open and fingered is bigger, compared to a fretted bass.

 

[Chris K]

In addition to the many *good* suggestions made above,

don't get caught up in the "DON'T LOOK AT THE FINGERBOARD" macho crap so many fretless guys on TB espouse.

Of course you don't want to rely exclusively on a visual... that's a given: you want to train your ear to be the best it can be, natch.

But waaay too many guys on TB will attempt to draw you into their little macho world saying that you're a wimp if you have to look at the fingerboard: utter crap.

Plenty of superior fretless players look at the fingerboard and their hands all the time while playing:

Michael Manring, Gary Willis (who flat out says "Look at/watch your hands!"), Mark Egan, Jaco, Jack Bruce, etc., etc., etc.

It's about how you SOUND... and you don't get extra points for difficulty.

All players watch their hands every once in a while, especially when they play solo, but the real point is: when learning to play fretless, rely on your ears, not your eyes.

I play fretless exclusively and I need to be able to play from sheet on sight. And in tune, of course. So it's not about being macho (though I'm proud I can).