I don't know a single person (aside from our friend buzzbass) who eats enough protein, never mind too much. The unhealthy people I see are bombing themselves with saturated fat & simple carbs.
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Trying Vegetarianism for a week or so
- Thread starter kanonfodr
- Start date
As noted above, I wish you the best in your efforts to educate the world about the harm we do to our environment.
But that's not just a meat-eaters' issue, it is found in many industries. That is mankind in general. We need to wise up and find ways to go about our business without destroying the planet.
I happen to think we're smart enough to do it without simply shutting everything down or putting limits on our productivity.
Great point, I nearly brought this up.
If some people substituted a lean piece of meat for the 2,000+ calories in simple sugars they consume daily, then followed it up with some vegetable and a fresh piece of fruit, they would be doing themselves a huge favor health-wise.
Meat is not the enemy. People are their own worst enemies, and regulating or eliminating a perceived threat that some people use wisely and in a healthy way is like throwing the baby out with the bath water.
I readily agree it's not just a meat industry problem. Far from it.
Sadly, the bolded part will be the death of us all, I think.
Have you heard about what Mr. Obama and his administration have done lately in regards to health care?
Short of a miracle, it seems you most certainly will be helping to pay for those people's health care.
Strange how things come full circle, isn't it?
I think we can stop it from going that far.
The tide is turning, slowly, but it is turning.
I agree people should eat much more sanely that they do, myself included, but, instead of the lean meat, why not substute some legumes? Still get a good protein shot and avoid the baggage that the meat brings to the table?
I think it's awesome you like the taste of legumes. To you I say, eat away on your legumes with wild abandon if you so choose.
But I know some people who would puke at the sight of them. And I know still many others who just don't care for them all that much and would rather have something else on their plate.
Why can't you be as accepting as I was about your legumes for people who choose something else?
I check your study. Here is one of the conclusion.
Within the study population, total mortality was unrelated to avoidance of meat. However, vegetarians had a 30 % lower risk of dying from ischemic heart diseases compared to non-vegetarians.
Within the study population, total mortality was unrelated to avoidance of meat. However, vegetarians had a 30 % lower risk of dying from ischemic heart diseases compared to non-vegetarians. Although this finding failed to reach statistical significance, it may be truly attributed to abstinence from meat and is in line with the hypothesis that animal fat and a high cholesterol diet promote ischemic heart disease, commented Jenny Chang-Claude. Smoking turned out to have the strongest influence on mortality in this study population, despite the low prevalence of smoking among the study participants. Regular alcohol consumption was only found to be associated with risk of dying from cancer, while being overweight increased mortality from circulatory diseases. A moderate or high level of physical activity, on the other hand, turned out to have a strong protective effect against all causes of death, including deaths from cardiovascular diseases and cancer.
There was no difference in the mortality of vegetarians and health conscious non-vegetarians in the study population. But both groups lead a very health conscious lifestyle, which clearly differentiates them from the general population, epidemiologist Chang-Claude said. For vegetarians and non-vegetarians alike, the recommendations for a long healthy life are: no smoking, regular exercise, a diet rich in fruit and vegetables, moderate alcohol consumption and avoiding overweight.
Here is the link.
Invalid Link Removed
i demand the chicken in my fajitas. find me a suitable substitute and i'll give it a go. I've tried tofu taco's and they were ok.
Vegetarian diets, low-meat diets and health: a review.
McEvoy CT, Temple N, Woodside JV.
Source
1Centre for Public Health, Queen's University Belfast, Institute of Clinical Science B, 1st Floor, Grosvenor Road, Belfast BT12 6BJ, UK.
Abstract
OBJECTIVE:
To review the epidemiological evidence for vegetarian diets, low-meat dietary patterns and their association with health status in adults.
DESIGN:
Published literature review focusing primarily on prospective studies and meta-analyses examining the association between vegetarian diets and health outcomes.
RESULTS:
Both vegetarian diets and prudent diets allowing small amounts of red meat are associated with reduced risk of diseases, particularly CHD and type 2 diabetes. There is limited evidence of an association between vegetarian diets and cancer prevention. Evidence linking red meat intake, particularly processed meat, and increased risk of CHD, cancer and type 2 diabetes is convincing and provides indirect support for consumption of a plant-based diet.
CONCLUSIONS:
The health benefits of vegetarian diets are not unique. Prudent plant-based dietary patterns which also allow small intakes of red meat, fish and dairy products have demonstrated significant improvements in health status as well. At this time an optimal dietary intake for health status is unknown. Plant-based diets contain a host of food and nutrients known to have independent health benefits. While vegetarian diets have not shown any adverse effects on health, restrictive and monotonous vegetarian diets may result in nutrient deficiencies with deleterious effects on health. For this reason, appropriate advice is important to ensure a vegetarian diet is nutritionally adequate especially for vulnerable groups.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22717188
McEvoy CT, Temple N, Woodside JV.
Source
1Centre for Public Health, Queen's University Belfast, Institute of Clinical Science B, 1st Floor, Grosvenor Road, Belfast BT12 6BJ, UK.
Abstract
OBJECTIVE:
To review the epidemiological evidence for vegetarian diets, low-meat dietary patterns and their association with health status in adults.
DESIGN:
Published literature review focusing primarily on prospective studies and meta-analyses examining the association between vegetarian diets and health outcomes.
RESULTS:
Both vegetarian diets and prudent diets allowing small amounts of red meat are associated with reduced risk of diseases, particularly CHD and type 2 diabetes. There is limited evidence of an association between vegetarian diets and cancer prevention. Evidence linking red meat intake, particularly processed meat, and increased risk of CHD, cancer and type 2 diabetes is convincing and provides indirect support for consumption of a plant-based diet.
CONCLUSIONS:
The health benefits of vegetarian diets are not unique. Prudent plant-based dietary patterns which also allow small intakes of red meat, fish and dairy products have demonstrated significant improvements in health status as well. At this time an optimal dietary intake for health status is unknown. Plant-based diets contain a host of food and nutrients known to have independent health benefits. While vegetarian diets have not shown any adverse effects on health, restrictive and monotonous vegetarian diets may result in nutrient deficiencies with deleterious effects on health. For this reason, appropriate advice is important to ensure a vegetarian diet is nutritionally adequate especially for vulnerable groups.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22717188
Noone you know is going to puke at the sight of a bean, stop being dramatic.
I can't be as accepting because there are few, if any, environmental negatives with legume farming as opposed to factory farms.
they contain both, why can't they be considered a protien choice? you're still ingesting protein.
Actually, I believe quite a few do. For example, I am not aware of a single bodybuilder (myself included) who doesn't consume ~0.7g or more protein per pound of lean body mass per day.
A related, and perhaps more significant issue is that most people are not anywhere close to consuming the calorie balance they should be using of 40% carbohydrate calories, 30% protein calories, and 30% fat calories. I bet if everyone in this thread diligently checks the calorie content everything they eat for a week they will be shocked. (Except me. I've gone through this exercise and was already shocked long ago.
)You are correct in that many people may not be eating adequate protein. However, I do not think the cause is from "not eating enough protein," it is because most people don't realize that their "protein" source has a lot more fat or carbohydrate calories than they thought.
The following are generalizations. Different brands and so forth affect the results.
1. Obvious example: a hot dog. 80% of your calories come from fat.
2. Obvious example: combo meals at McDonalds, Burger King, Wendy's, etc. have huge amounts of fat and carbohydrates (and sugars/high fructose corn syrup) that you didn't think you were getting.
3. Less obvious example: yogurt. Most of the calories are carbohyrdate.
4. Less obvious example 2: cheese. Most of the calories are fat.
5. Less obvious example 3: "lean hamburger." About half of the calories are fat.
As a result, people using these as protein sources are fooling themselves in a number of ways. (Food marketing and sales also has to take at least partial blame for this as well.)
I think most people are trying to consume adequate protein, but not too surprisingly fat is cheap and protein is expensive. Most people's diets are driven by their wallets and convenience. This is one of the things that started me towards eating vegetarian. The "veggie burgers" (not very tasty in years gone by) were just as good a source of protein as the animal ones and had a lot less fat.
Sure, plenty of sources can provide the information for one to educate themselves, but education of any matter is always the individuals responsibility.
Seems a rather odd point to try and counter. Who was responsible for your education?
I dont think anyone here is making this argument but you.
Actually, I believe quite a few do. For example, I am not aware of a single bodybuilder (myself included) who doesn't consume ~0.7g or more protein per pound of lean body mass per day.
A related, and perhaps more significant issue is that most people are not anywhere close to consuming the calorie balance they should be using of 40% carbohydrate calories, 30% protein calories, and 30% fat calories. I bet if everyone in this thread diligently checks the calorie content everything they eat for a week they will be shocked. (Except me. I've gone through this exercise and was already shocked long ago.
You are correct in that many people may not be eating adequate protein. However, I do not think the cause is from "not eating enough protein," it is because most people don't realize that their "protein" source has a lot more fat or carbohydrate calories than they thought.
The following are generalizations. Different brands and so forth affect the results.
1. Obvious example: a hot dog. 80% of your calories come from fat.
2. Obvious example: combo meals at McDonalds, Burger King, Wendy's, etc. have huge amounts of fat and carbohydrates (and sugars/high fructose corn syrup) that you didn't think you were getting.
3. Less obvious example: yogurt. Most of the calories are carbohyrdate.
4. Less obvious example 2: cheese. Most of the calories are fat.
5. Less obvious example 3: "lean hamburger." About half of the calories are fat.
As a result, people using these as protein sources are fooling themselves in a number of ways. (Food marketing and sales also has to take at least partial blame for this as well.)
I think most people are trying to consume adequate protein, but not too surprisingly fat is cheap and protein is expensive. Most people's diets are driven by their wallets and convenience. This is one of the things that started me towards eating vegetarian. The "veggie burgers" (not very tasty in years gone by) were just as good a source of protein as the animal ones and had a lot less fat.
Hey boynamedsuse, I have a question. And this is totally serious and not contnentious.
Where is the information found on how much protein a person needs? A lot of people are concerned with getting enough protein, but I've not run across any guidelines that say you should have X grams of protein a day and here's why.
I'm well aware of what protein does, but how much does a person actuall need? You, as an example, need0.7 g/lb of body weight because you're actively trying to add muscle mass. What about the average Joe or Jane that's just looking at a moderate amount of physical exertion?
