Venting: Potential big gig ends up being a freebie

[craigie]

This is what free gets you

Doubly funny as we did that in my last band. Anybody actually get through this?

If I did the speedway gig every song would be an original that I wrote right then:
They’re too cheap to pay us!
Hey you, give us tips!
We play for free, don’t steal our gear!
Hey you little kid: tell your mommy or daddy to give us money so our kids can eat too.
Give us $20 and we’ll slag off whoever you want in a song!

Actually the best thing would be to say “hell yeah!” (If you’re not booked)
Show up with the rinky-dinkiest PA. Wear a weird disguise outfit so nobody will recognize you afterwards. Pirates! Yar! Then Tom green the poopie out of that place. Make sure you have a bunch of band members that are really bikers.

 

[gumtown]

Good on you for being "diplomatic",
but I think the venue organiser should really know most of what has been posted here.

Let him know that he is getting paid generously for his organisation providing entertainment,
is it fair to ask someone else to provide entertainment for his venue for free? (I would let him know that - diplomacy is optional)

 

[Turbo Sparky]

...didn't even offer bug repellent, lean-to, or camp stove, private box raceday, Hot Pockets with Solo cups of liquid refreshment?
Yeah, bail.
Diaper wipes? Swag bag?

 

[gln1955]

I get and understand that perspective....however that approach works to drive down the market price for other musicians and bands that do care about the money. Imagine going around and doing contactor work for zero labor costs....you would put good people out of work.

All the guys in my current band are doing it for fun. We don't need the money, but we won't play for less than the going rate. Ever. If a bar or event is making more money with us being there, then we get our share, even if the going rate kinda sucks. The thing is music and other performing arts are not like any other business. People will do it for free, just to get a chance to perform. That's a reality that isn't changing.

 

[JimmyM]

They're counting on you seeing free races as pay enough. Forget that noise! As much money as those races make? Pfffft!

 

[crazyBassClown]

Let him know that he is getting paid generously for his organisation providing entertainment,
is it fair to ask someone else to provide entertainment for his venue for free? (I would let him know that - diplomacy is optional)

Well, I'm sure they are used to the racers paying for the privilege of providing the entertainment, so be glad they didn't ask you to pay.

 

[JimmyM]

Well, I'm sure they are used to the racers paying for the privilege of providing the entertainment, so be glad they didn't ask you to pay.

Entry fees are a whole different ballgame. The racers stand to make a good amount of money if they have a good showing. The band shares in none of it.

 

[leftyjohn]

most racers make about as much as most musicians,
racing is just another expensive hobby
if I had the money it would be another hobby for me
as it is i can only afford music......bass

 

[devnulljp]

You mean the race car drivers aren't racing for free because they really like to race?

of course not, they do it for exposure

 

[JimmyM]

most racers make about as much as most musicians,
racing is just another expensive hobby
if I had the money it would be another hobby for me
as it is i can only afford music......bass

That is true, but they still stand to make good bucks if they win or have a good showing.

 

[6Bass101]

I get and understand that perspective....however that approach works to drive down the market price for other musicians and bands that do care about the money. Imagine going around and doing contactor work for zero labor costs....you would put good people out of work.

The thing is no one enjoys doing contractor work as a hobby. If they did, I'm sure there would be a bunch of people doing it for free because "they love doing it."
You also have folks that take the no pay gigs because they think it's the way to "make it big." There is no similar scenario with contractor work.
And it's not only about not needing the money. Some people like playing music so much that despite being broke, they still do it for free.
On a personal note, while I would never play for free (except for a worthwhile charity), I don't think that one group of folks wanting/needing to get paid to play music puts any obligation on others to not play for free. Those folks are free to do with their time and resources as they wish. Just my humble opinion.

 

[juancaminos]

My guess is that it wasn't something in the track budget planning. Just some rogue employee thinking it would be great to have music.

 

[Spectre Gunner]

Charge something, at least something. The amount is up to you but do not agree to do it free. The amount you charge says a lot about your band's value. Make them aware of the value they are getting for their investment. What can you offer them? What quality of show will they get for their dollar? You're band has value so don' t set the precedent of giving it away for free. It doesn't have to be much but 0$ is not a good precedent and what if the next promoter ask what you were paid for your last gig. You'd like to be paid right? but you did the last one for free?

 

[crazyBassClown]

That is true, but they still stand to make good bucks if they win or have a good showing.

Actually that isn't really true at any level of racing. Prize money never covers running and build costs for racing. The only way the teams make money is through sponsorship and endorsement deals. This is something musicians may want to take note of as music is headed the same way.

 

[beaglesandbass]

Cause there are musicians out there that will do it.

/thread

 

[MD Stingray]

They'll get a performance that is in accordance with the benefits offered.

 

[Nephilymbass]

Curious.............bands that will play for free..........how good are they actually??

You mean how wealthy are their parents lol.

 

[sludgetail]

Man, if reading the original post didn’t hurt enough, reading the first reply was even more painful...

OP I feel you and thank you for doing the right thing — for you, for all of us.

 

[-Asdfgh-]

I agree with OP and the inevitable someone else will play it for free, plus a camping spot

Given that the band has to supply the PA then factoring in fuel, wear and tear, it's making a loss, not free, even if you could resell the right to free entry.

 

[-Asdfgh-]

They may or may not find someone to do it, but it won’t likely be any sort of a polished band, let alone one with the PA needed to sound remotely good. It won’t work out, and they’ll switch to just piping in music, or get a budget for live music.

There are sometimes bands out there that are good and will play for free. I'm reminded of Throwing Muses which, early on, paid audience members $1 to turn up. If you are a band needing to drum up business then playing for exposure (a loss leader) can be a sound business decision, and I've done it too, and it has generated fee-paying gigs.

From the other perspective of having been involved in running a venue and similar activities then while I would always ideally want to pay a band if it was unknown I'd have to consider not paying the band too unless the venue is doing well as otherwise having the venue open is subsidising the band's career. In that case turning another poster's suggestion on it's head perhaps I should be asking for 20% of the band's revenue for the next five gigs in return . But, much like the loss leader argument above, I'd putting on bands that lose money for you creates a sufficiently loyal clientele that they bring more people in on other nights and generally sustain the scene it might make sense, but making a confident return on investment calculation in that circumstance is actually very difficult even with things like audience feedback surveys (yes, I've surveyed the audience at gigs I've done a few times and it can be very illuminating even it might seem a bit weird).