Victor Wooten: There are 30 keys

[Papageno]

Oh, well, it was all worth it to learn about the Ewald example. Wild!

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It's in Fb major! Quite perverse!

Can one figure out why he did not write it E major instead? Most players would not mind, and listeners would not hear anything different.

Another option would have been to write it in Dx major (D double sharp), with only 9 sharps... LoL! But the transposing instruments would not find it amusing...

 

[jamro217]

After retiring, I found I had at least 100 keys, and no idea what they unlocked.

If one goes to my '99 E-150 I won't be needing it back. The van has been sent to the boneyard.

 

[jamro217]

I hate to disagree with someone of Victor's stature, but after trying to play the fretless I've found keys that no one else can understand.

 

[CryingBass]

Has this turned to 30 shades of political?

 

[Les Fret]

Next jam session I will opt for a Blues in B# minor just to see the reactions....

 

[Papageno]

Next jam session I will opt for a Blues in B# minor just to see the reactions....

The guitar player will tell you: "no problem", then he'll place a capo on fret 1 and play a blues in B minor...

 

[Febs]

Next jam session I will opt for a Blues in B# minor just to see the reactions....

Here ya go. Have 'em play this one.

 

[Whousedtoplay]

Here ya go. Have 'em play this one.

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Do you have any "clearly pronounced" MINOR Blues in B#?

LOL!

 

[Whousedtoplay]

then he'll place a capo on fret 1 and play a blues in B minor...

But what would the guitar player do if it's in Cb(flat) minor?
Where to place that capo?

 

[Febs]

Do you have any "clearly pronounced" MINOR Blues in B#?

LOL!

Sure!

I'm just kidding around, of course, but I think these examples show why keys beyond the 30 Wooten referred to aren't very practical and why, with extremely rare exceptions, you don't see them in the real world.

 

[Spin Doctor]

My impression is some of us care, and others appear to be trolling those who care.

The standard convention in Western music theory is there are 30 written keys. The rules for the convention are not complicated or mysterious in any way, and as @Febs has shown these keys exist in the wild.

If you want to make a distinction between keys and key signatures, then I agree with @Mushroo : There are 24 keys and 30 key signatures. I believe it's actually taught this way in some schools.

Nothing says you have to comply with convention, and nothing is stopping anyone from practicing in, or otherwise using theoretical keys, and yes you may come across them occasionally in the wild. Also, nothing is stopping anyone from working only in a few of the most common keys, or totally disregarding theory and written music, and playing exclusively by ear. However, if you want to be a skilled professional reading musician, IMHO it's wise to be prepared to work in all 30 written conventional key signatures.

IMHO this has been beat beyond the point of amusement:

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I agree. The convention is the convention. And it's not complicated. One can always make this easy stuff weird, but that's a personal choice. I made this chart maybe the first week of my studying bass and I'm not trying to make the idea any more complicated than this.

 

[Whousedtoplay]

I agree. The convention is the convention. And it's not complicated. One can always make this easy stuff weird, but that's a personal choice. I made this chart maybe the first week of my studying bass and I'm not trying to make the idea any more complicated than this.

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To sum up.

D# MINOR - No problem. Play as much as you like it.
D# MAJOR - What?
MODULATION to Eb immediately.
But it's from the same TONIC - D#?

LOL.

 

[Papageno]

But what would the guitar player do if it's in Cb(flat) minor?
Where to place that capo?

easy: tune all strings a semitone lower, and then play a C minor blues...

 

[Papageno]

Sure!

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I'm just kidding around, of course, but I think these examples show why keys beyond the 30 Wooten referred to aren't very practical and why, with extremely rare exceptions, you don't see them in the real world.

This one is my favorite. Would you by chance have the lead sheet for alto sax (Eb) ?

 

[Febs]

This one is my favorite. Would you by chance have the lead sheet for alto sax (Eb) ?

We're now way, way, down the rabbit hole ...

 

[Whousedtoplay]

easy: tune all strings a semitone lower, and then play a C minor blues...

"Dear Audience,

Our orchestra is going to take a short 10-minute break in order to detune our string instruments for the Cb Blues composition.
Thank you for your understanding and empathizing with our situation cause by some lame arranger."

 

[SteveCS]

Our orchestra is going to take a short 10-minute break in order to detune our string instruments for the Cb Blues composition.

Harpist to rest of Orchestra: "I'm off to the pub. Call me back when you're all done!"

 

[Whousedtoplay]

Harpist to rest of Orchestra: "I'm off to the pub. Call me back when you're all done!"

And, as the winner of our comic relief intermezzo (entr'acte), you are entitled to a song (recommendation) for your current band (and a fretless bass).

Visions (Stevie Wonder) - Elizabeth Shepherd · Michael Occhipinti

 

[Tupac]

Victor is correct. F# major is different from Gb major. The two keys actually sound different as well. Those who took classical piano lessons can easily tell.

Example pretty please!

 

[HelpImaRock]

From a Twitter handle called "Threatening Musical Notation", modulating from A major to C# major to Db major: