Waiving The White Flag Of Surrender

[oldrocker]

...

To be honest I am not sure if some of these people that first picked up a guitar 5 years ago even know or understand what type of bass playing or bass player would be a good match for their band.

I have to agree here - even for people with much more than 5 years. But as a mediocre bass player I have been able to use this to my advantage

 

[bluewine]

I will not have an answer on whether I got the gig or not till mid -week.

Guys, you will come back at me and say I have a bad attitude because of the way I express myself and the harsh opinions and commentary I give in this forum. To that I say, "whatever"

But for you guys that understand where I am coming from (not you johnny come latelys). You know who you are

The other guy is a friend of the drummer and they were both in the same band not to long ago.

Kind of tough odds to beat.

At the end of the day, life ain't fair and neither are auditions.

I will never audition for a band if I find out any sort of friend of anyone in the band is auditioning.

Another thing, for future auditions, I am only going to audition unless they will let me go last. Going first, by the time they make a decsision they don't even remember you.

 

[ChrisB2]

While you're right about the friend angle most of the time, it's not always true.

I once landed a spot in a band that was also considering, not only a close friend of the band, but their former bassist.

Way before I knew about them, he had left along with another player to form a band. After a time, when that didn't work out, they were both going to return to the band, but only the one returned because I beat out the friend bassist for the spot.

I was a complete stranger to everyone in the band.

So it's not cast in stone. Sometimes the outsider gets the gig over the friend of the band.

So stay positive, and keep rockin'!

 

[bluewine]

While you're right about the friend angle most of the time, it's not always true.

I once landed a spot in a band that was also considering, not only a close friend of the band, but their former bassist.

Way before I knew about them, he had left along with another player to form a band. After a time, when that didn't work out, they were both going to return to the band, but only the one returned because I beat out the friend bassist for the spot.

I was a complete stranger to everyone in the band.

So it's not cast in stone. Sometimes the outsider gets the gig over the friend of the band.

So stay positive, and keep rockin'!

Thanks for the positive vibe.

I have the ability to take these bands to the next level. I have an above average understanding of how and why and what compliments a band in term of the bass guitar.

I also understand personalities, how to fit into a band as a contributing team player.

As I said some of these bands don't really understand what would be good for their band.

All I am asking for is a chance.

 

[guy n. cognito]

Thanks for the positive vibe.

I have the ability to take these bands to the next level. I have an above average understanding of how and why and what compliments a band in term of the bass guitar.

I also understand personalities, how to fit into a band as a contributing team player.

As I said some of these bands don't really understand what would be good for their band.

All I am asking for is a chance.

This attitude will make it difficult to fit into an existing band.

 

[bluewine]

This attitude will make it difficult to fit into an existing band.

Guy, I have been doing this for 45 years.

I decide what attitude will do what and where, not you.

blue

 

[guy n. cognito]

Guy, I have been doing this for 45 years.

I decide what attitude will do what and where, not you.

blue

Well, of course, you may choose to behave any way you choose. I would suggest, however, that walking into an audition with the attitude of "you don't know what you need, I do...I'm better than you and I can make you better" can be considered a bit insulting to established bands.

 

[bluewine]

Well, of course, you may choose to behave any way you choose. I would suggest, however, that walking into an audition with the attitude of "you don't know what you need, I do...I'm better than you and I can make you better" can be considered a bit insulting to established bands.

Guy you have read my post wrong.

What I say in this forum and how I go into and present myself at any audition are the difference between. day and night.

I go into an audition to win, nobody can win if you go into an audition with a " know it all attitude".

Did you read my post where I was quite specific about the fact that while I vent and have an attitude in this forum, all that stuff is checked at the door before I enter a room to audition for a band.

I have made it clear several times in this thread how I approach an audition.

With that being said, what are you talking about.

 

[guy n. cognito]

Guy you have read my post wrong.

What I say in this forum and how I go into and present myself at any audition are the difference between. day and night.

I go into an audition to win, nobody can win if you go into an audition with a " know it all attitude".

Did you read my post where I was quite specific about the fact that while I vent and have an attitude in this forum, all that stuff is checked at the door before I enter a room to audition for a band.

I have made it clear several times in this thread how I approach an audition.

With that being said, what are you talking about.

No, Blue, I hear you, and I understand that you try to keep your personas separate. I would suggest to you, however, that you might not be as good at keeping them distinct as you think.

 

[bluewine]

No, Blue, I hear you, and I understand that you try to keep your personas separate. I would suggest to you, however, that you might not be as good at keeping them distinct as you think.

Believe me, I am well aware of how I come off. If you're really want a gig you can't go in acting like a jerk.

The auditions I have lost have been to friends of the band.

 

[ChrisB2]

I have the ability to take these bands to the next level. I have an above average understanding of how and why and what compliments a band in term of the bass guitar.

I also understand personalities, how to fit into a band as a contributing team player.

As I said some of these bands don't really understand what would be good for their band.

This attitude will make it difficult to fit into an existing band.

Let's clarify. Blue is not stating that he would express these views to the prospective band, just that he holds them.

That said, this exchange brings to light a point that's interesting to me.

I believe I have an above-average understanding of how a band should sound. But I don't convey this openly to my band. Being it's a democratic band, that would come across rather egotistical and arrogant.

I believe most of us bassists have a pretty good understanding of what's right and wrong with our bands, and what would make them better. And I believe that bass players are usually more well-equipped to have this perspective than other musicians.

I just think the personality type that would gravitate toward our instrument is the same type that is likely to have superior insight in this regard.

I also agree that many bands don't understand what would be good for their band.

The interesting points as I see them are,
A) is this special insight true?
B) how do we apply this insight in an effective manner and help improve our bands without overstepping our boundaries? (Bassist-bandleaders obviously are doing B already.)
C) what are the personality traits that correlate the tendency of a person to choose bass and to have this insight?

 

[bluewine]

The interesting points as I see them are,
A) is this special insight true?
B) how do we apply this insight in an effective manner and help improve our bands without overstepping our boundaries? (Bassist-bandleaders obviously are doing B already.)
C) what are the personality traits that correlate the tendency of a person to choose bass and to have this insight?[/QUOTE]

For me, I will wait until I have proven myself to the band as a bass player before I start adding my 2 cents about anything.

 

[Marko 1]

…

Another thing, for future auditions, I am only going to audition unless they will let me go last. Going first, by the time they make a decsision they don't even remember you.

I’m cool with you so far Blue, except I’m not sure about this.

How would one implement a condition like that without coming off like a jerk?


In any case, I really hope this or something works out for you soon.

 

[agreatheight]

Blue,

If you are
a) as good as you say you are
b) as smart as you say you are
then you should be killing auditions.

I wish you nothing but the best, but I think you need to seriously re-evaluate.

 

[bluewine]

I'm cool with you so far Blue, except I'm not sure about this.

How would one implement a condition like that without coming off like a jerk?

In any case, I really hope this or something works out for you soon.

It would be a polite question, you know "thanks for addressing my concern, I will have to think about this".

 

[bluewine]

Blue,

If you are
a) as good as you say you are
b) as smart as you say you are
then you should be killing auditions.

I wish you nothing but the best, but I think you need to seriously re-evaluate.

I am not sure how good I am, but I didn't pick up the bass guitar 6 weeks ago

I'm not that smart

I honestly think some bands are not looking for really good or advanced players.

At the end of the day, no matter how well I audition all bands are not open minded to the point where they will consider a 58 year old bass player.

And some bands don't want a Black member. In some cases for good reason.

I remember playing flawlessly at an audition and I lost to a young guy that I saw aidition, he didnt know the material and had only been playing for a year. They fired Jim after a few months. They never called me back. And I had offered to sub and or be reconsidered if the Guy didn't work out

 

[Marko 1]

…

At the end of the day, no matter how well I audition all bands are not open minded to the point where they will consider a 58 year old bass player.

And some bands don't want a Black member. In some cases for good reason.

Unfortunately ignorance still abounds… not sure what a “good reason” would be,though.

 

[bluewine]

Unfortunately ignorance still abounds... not sure what a "good reason" would be,though.

All I can say is, there are some low end venues with clientel that I would not feel comfortable in.

 

[TBrett]

For originals bands, they usually have nothing to offer except dreams and will generally take anyone who walks in the door and is willing to pay to play.

Do me a favour, Blue, and stop making demeaning generalizations like that. I know you’re only venting, but still. It totally insults and undermines our and other bands’ hard work and sense of professionalism. Sorry, I guess I’m a bit touchy about the implication that because we’re an original band, we have nothing to offer and will accept working with just anyone. Soooooo not true, even if there are a lot of self-fancying noobs out there. For example, we only auditioned two drummers before we found our guy (who has over 30 years of pro experience, by the way), after countless emails and conversations with prospective drummers.

That said, I do sympathize with your situation. I can imagine being very frustrated indeed if I were in your shoes. (I was an actor for years, so I know full well the frustration of losing gigs to less experienced and/or talented artists.) But experience has taught me that you really never know what’s around the corner, or how a particular situation is going to play out. I know it’s hard to stay positive, but keep trying. Someone is going to see your talent, experience, and abilities and be thrilled to work with you. We all know that a solid rhythm section is absolutely critical for a successful band, whether it’s covers or originals. That’s your big selling point right there. Wishing you much luck for next time!

 

[bassbully]

Do me a favour, Blue, and stop making demeaning generalizations like that. I know you’re only venting, but still. It totally insults and undermines our and other bands’ hard work and sense of professionalism. Sorry, I guess I’m a bit touchy about the implication that because we’re an original band, we have nothing to offer and will accept working with just anyone. Soooooo not true, even if there are a lot of self-fancying noobs out there. For example, we only auditioned two drummers before we found our guy (who has over 30 years of pro experience, by the way), after countless emails and conversations with prospective drummers.

That said, I do sympathize with your situation. I can imagine being very frustrated indeed if I were in your shoes. (I was an actor for years, so I know full well the frustration of losing gigs to less experienced and/or talented artists.) But experience has taught me that you really never know what’s around the corner, or how a particular situation is going to play out. I know it’s hard to stay positive, but keep trying. Someone is going to see your talent, experience, and abilities and be thrilled to work with you. We all know that a solid rhythm section is absolutely critical for a successful band, whether it’s covers or originals. That’s your big selling point right there. Wishing you much luck for next time!

I agree and Blues attitude toward originals bands having an open door policy to bassists is insulting to bassists who are in originals bands writing their own material.
I have done both originals, cover and bands that mixed both. Covers are way easier for me to learn since there is plenty of recorded songs, chord sheets, videos to download, not so with originals. I have to really learn the song since I have never heard it and learn the feel of it what the writer is trying to get across.

Let me say this, I am not a great bassist by any means but the bassline in may bands songs would not come easy to some and learning them would take some practice. My band would never let anyone walk in and play anything over our songs if I was to leave or be replaced. The song would have to played like it was by me and on our albums. We added a great guitarist /keys player and he had to learn all of our songs (charted) to be played like the rest of us. I don't get where an originals band with good songs that are performed and recorded is any different than a coverband except like I said before the music isnt mainstream.
I understand you are upset Blue but you turn on others when you vent and that can/could be a reason you are getting the results that you are.