What brand has all your loyalty?

[allen_m]

Peavey made in the USA from the 1970s up until the last 15 years or so. Always considered them the best bang for the buck and never felt I was compromising. I still give them a look anytime I’m shopping and have acquired a few items not made in Mississippi and am not unhappy with them, but I don’t find them exceptional in any way. Still, you always reflect fondly on your first love.

 

[Hazeyhaze]

Coca cola
Talkbass

 

[Mark Sellers]

Lakland and G&L.

 

[RJI777]

RJI: All this to say "buy what you like"? Thank goodness there are so many choices.

No, because people who can name their favourite brands and demonstrate brand loyalty buy what they like too. I mean, brand loyalty or not, I'm not aware of anyone being forced to buy things they don't want. I was simply explaining the way I see things. Just my opinion.

And, just as many people choose to allow brand loyalty to influence their purchases, I am not immune to various factors. However, I am more influenced by some bad buying experiences e.g., the Yamaha n12 desk with Cubase integration via FireWire. Okay, it was a great piece of kit but it was practically gone before it even arrived.

Finally, I cannot deny that, over my four decades as a bass player, the increase in "choice" has been unprecedented. But considering the question of whether this is a good thing for bass players is a complicated affair. IMHO, the volume of products on the market is way above its optimal level and might be construed as a negative factor which detracts from the art of bass playing itself. After all, bass players are far more important than their technology, right?

However, that's just the way I see it.

 

[RJI777]

Ok, you have a point.

I know in the companies I listed I have listed it might be a bit different, since I have a professional working relationship with all of them.

Understood. My rant simply represented my opinion based on personal experiences. As such, it can't be interpreted as a "universal truth" that applies to everyone.

 

[tshapiro]

Electric Guitars/Basses - Fender
Guitar Amps - Fender
Piano's and keyboards - Yamaha

I have other 1 off favorites, but, the above are more blanket loyalty to that category of product.

 

[RJI777]

Wow.

Uh?

 

[TravStaff]

I was a die-hard Fender guy for many years then I bought a Epiphone Tbird pro at a pawn shop on a whim. It cut through the mix playing with my band better than anything else. It just rocked.

Being a bit of a brand snob with gear I had to have a Gibson and a couple years later I have two Gibson Thunderbirds. I still have my American Pbass and my MIJ Power Jazz bass but these days I rarely play anything but my birds.

 

[JimmyM]

Warning: Rant to commence in 3, 2, 1, ...

Given 40 years of bass playing, etc., and having spent a small fortune on musical equipment during this time, my take on brand loyalty can be reduced to a very basic premise, when needs be; as I might argue, is now. Sure; you will find posts written by myself that sing the praises of various companies e.g., Line 6, etc., and brands e.g., Boss Pedals, Harley Benton basses, etc., but that's actually extremely misleading in the context of so-called "brand loyalty".

You see, IMHO, when "push comes to shove" (whatever that means), brand and/or company loyalty is a mindset that suits the provider, not the customer; they maintain it, we're expected to conform to it. After all, we are humans (for the main part, with the possible exception of a few vocalist I have run into) and, as such, we need to "belong". Hence, it's hardly surprising that we adopt the tribal behaviours associated with identifying with and defending matters based on brand or product loyalty. As above, I am no exception; usually ...

... however, when the "chips are down" (again, ... ***?), none of this matters; not one iota. Simply put, the brands are a means to an end, based on the objectives of the companies that provide them. Simplifying further, their objectives can be reduced to a single goal: To make money. And who do they target to do this?; well, you, me; in fact, anybody who is willing to part with their hard earned cash.

More over, companies are typically ruthless when it comes to maximising profits e.g., chopping and changing product lines, switching markets, etc.; indeed, whatever it takes to make more money. After all, that's why they exist and branding is a means to their ends; which isn't always conducive with their customer base. However, none of this matters ...

... in summary, companies use branding to exploit their revenue sources (sometimes referred to as customers) to make money. They will, and do, chop and change to suit and care not about anything else, including you and I e.g., as soon as they identify a more lucrative market in which we play no part, we are no longer relevant. Hence, the brands "disappear", the companies move on and we are left with whatever unsupported legacy products we bought; and for a large part, purchased under the influence of misplaced brand loyalty.

Hence, in conclusion, if you believe that companies give a f**k about you, think again. You are a revenue source and will be treated accordingly. You will be lured by branding, etc.; you will purchase accordingly; but you will also be "dumped" at the discretion of the companies involved. They care not, and thus, when it comes to branding and company loyalty, I reciprocate in exactly the same manner: I care not. I buy what I want/need as pragmatically as I can, based on the best information I can find; which is not found in the language associated with branding. It's a misnomer, perpetuated by companies. We are, of course, involved; but, just as long as it suits them, not us.

Being somewhat blunt: Brand loyalty? F**k that. Loyalty is a two way street, so don't let them fool you. Instead, use your common sense and basic intelligence. See through the charade; buy what you really want and/or need; not what they companies would like you to. To hell with them, and their branding. Make informed choices about your purchases; live long and prosper.

See, rants like this assume that this is some big giant secret that has been exposed to only you and a handful of "free-thinkers," and you're passing on some great knowledge that has been common knowledge since the dawn of time by anyone over 14. It's part of why businesses have to conform to regulations here and in most developed countries...so they can't screw us over without at least some small measure of consumer and worker protection. It also assumes that anyone who's brand loyal is loyal for any other reason besides mind-control and a weak will. Doesn't take into account those who are brand loyal because they actually like what they're using and came to the conclusion that they're best sticking with it. And while thinking that everyone in business is trying to steal your money and give you nothing in return is just plain silly and misanthropic, when I know for a fact that there are many major business people who truly do care, it's not like I expect Christmas gifts and attending my funeral, either.

To me, the basic premise here is "I'm smart and you're not." If that's not the intended message, that's what I'm getting out of it.

... and "cut". Rant #1, Take #1; it's a wrap folks. Good night, may your god go with you and, please, be safe: Stay indoors; avoid CV-19 and all forms of branding. We can and we will get through this.

Well I'll try to avoid the CV-19 at least and do my best to help flatten the curve, as they say. That part of the post I'm behind

 

[oldskoolskatedad]

See, rants like this assume that this is some big giant secret that has been exposed to only you and a handful of "free-thinkers," and you're passing on some great knowledge that has been common knowledge since the dawn of time by anyone over 14. It's part of why businesses have to conform to regulations here and in most developed countries...so they can't screw us over without at least some small measure of consumer and worker protection. It also assumes that anyone who's brand loyal is loyal for any other reason besides mind-control and a weak will. Doesn't take into account those who are brand loyal because they actually like what they're using and came to the conclusion that they're best sticking with it. And while thinking that everyone in business is trying to steal your money and give you nothing in return is just plain silly and misanthropic, when I know for a fact that there are many major business people who truly do care, it's not like I expect Christmas gifts and attending my funeral, either.

To me, the basic premise here is "I'm smart and you're not." If that's not the intended message, that's what I'm getting out of it.


Well I'll try to avoid the CV-19 at least and do my best to help flatten the curve, as they say. That part of the post I'm behind

Come on though, as far as rants go, that was all in

 

[A9X]

I'm not brand loyal per se, but I've had a couple of brands that have always been good, and one of those I'd probably buy online remotely with less hesitation than others.

Basses:
Alembic
Ibanez
Anything from Fuji Gakki
Peavey USA
Status Graphite

Straps:
DSL Australia, the best in my experience.

Strings:
Single balls could be anything, double balls, Status and Ken Smith are most consistent and best value.

Amps:
Peavey (older) and Yamaha pro units in recent years.

Cabs:
Peavey (older) and my own designs in more recent times (similar to but pre-dating greenboy's fEARFULS).

 

[cmcbass]

That would be Warwick for me. I love how they sound and feel. I really like their bridges too, but wish they would use better tuning machines. I really like stingray style basses too, but can't afford to spend the cash on a music man. I currently have 2 Warwicks, a Sterling ray 35, and a Yamaha bbg 5 that I defretted.

 

[Tim Schnautz]

Fender has mine. An obvious choice. They have everything that I need. I'm at:

American Standard Jazz Bass with rounds
American Standard P Bass with flats
Elite 5 string with rounds
77 Music Master with tapewounds
Mexican fretless with flats

what company are you committed to?

What brand has my loyalty?
what company are you committed to?

none.
I don't get paid for endorsments.

 

[martinc]

No, because people who can name their favourite brands and demonstrate brand loyalty buy what they like too. I mean, brand loyalty or not, I'm not aware of anyone being forced to buy things they don't want. I was simply explaining the way I see things. Just my opinion.

And, just as many people choose to allow brand loyalty to influence their purchases, I am not immune to various factors. However, I am more influenced by some bad buying experiences e.g., the Yamaha n12 desk with Cubase integration via FireWire. Okay, it was a great piece of kit but it was practically gone before it even arrived.

Finally, I cannot deny that, over my four decades as a bass player, the increase in "choice" has been unprecedented. But considering the question of whether this is a good thing for bass players is a complicated affair. IMHO, the volume of products on the market is way above its optimal level and might be construed as a negative factor which detracts from the art of bass playing itself. After all, bass players are far more important than their technology, right?



However, that's just the way I see it.

RJI: Thanks for the reply. I have a tough time understanding why you think having a choice of instruments can be complicated and detracts from the art of bass playing. It's only complicated if you make it that way. Electric basses are still just planks of wood with a neck and pickups. It should not take long to find one that you like...either by price or design. I don't see it as a conspiracy against me.
You are required to be an educated consumer with anything you buy. To me that's the enjoyable part. I have a 2019 Fender P-Bass (with Fender Pure Vintage 63 pickups) which replaced a Fender parts P- bass and I also have a Yamaha PJ -style BB234. One cost 4 times than the other but I enjoy playing both. They are both well made. Same as my German ply upright and my Eminence EUB.
I see this thread as a fun topic and am enjoying reading about the choices and loyalty (or lack of) that posters have made. It is a welcome distraction from the times we now live in. There are lots of way more important things things to rant about in the world around us but to me, buying a bass is not one of them.
As the great banjo player Alan Munde once said when players took things too seriously...."it's only a banjo!" I think that also applies to electric basses.
Cheers.

 

[Old P Bass Guy]

Except as a "short scale" kid, I have always used Fender products. I would imagine that Yamaha basses would be very good based on their other products I have used.
Based on some very enthusiastic endorsements here I am now intrigued by FGN basses. Once after I can get out of the house again I'll drive down to the flatlands and go to a SA or GC and see if I can check them out!

 

[RJI777]

1/ See, rants like this assume that this is some big giant secret that ...

2/ It also assumes that anyone who's brand loyal ...

3/ ... is trying to steal your money and give you nothing in return is just plain silly ...

4/ ... I know for a fact that there are many major business people who ...

5/... the basic premise here is "I'm smart and you're not." If that's not the intended message, that's what I'm getting out of it ...

I should start by apologising for selecting sections of your reply as I have done. Ignoring context in this way is far from ideal and certainly loses the overall sentiment of your response. I also concede that I have missed some of your key points; hence, I apologise for that too.

You provide a good, structured argument, and I think I can see where you are coming from. However, are you not, perhaps, taking this a little too seriously? After all, it was an off the cuff rant, prompted by an email I received on the subject of brand loyalty. Again, it really was a rant; topped and tailed with commentary that you are unlikely to find in a serious article / post, which my narrative was never intended to be. It was only a rant; an opportunity to vent a frustration or two; almost an involuntary reaction (on my part).

In fact, the only real point was that companies exist to make money; that's their primary objective. However, I also pointed out during the rant and in subsequent posts that, it's only my humble opinion, that it is influenced by personal experience, and in particular, cannot be extended to everyone as a universal truth. It's just the way I see it; in fact, it can't be generalised to anyone, simply because doing so cannot be supported by any means that have any substance or relevance. Unfortunately, I forgot to mention that part during the rant.

However, there are a few points in your argument that I am having difficulty with. As above, these include:

1/ and 2/ I didn't state any assumptions, but you are stating quite clearly that specific assumptions apply to my rant. Although you seem to be making these claims as if they were, pretty much, "facts" akin to normalistic thinking, I fail to see how you can "know" what assumptions, if any, apply;

3/ I don't recall mentioning "stealing" and giving "nothing in return". As above, the rant was about companies, their objectives and the fact (based on my own experiences) that some organisations can be ruthless in this respect;

4/ You clearly state that you "know for a fact" but provide no supporting information on terms of the validity and reliability of your claim. You also ignore the issue of generalisation, although I don't have too much of an issue with that aspect;

5/ I sincerely apologise that my rant has caused you to feel this way. I certainly did not intend to offend anyone in any way. However, it seems as if I did so, again I apologise AND will try and be more careful with my narrative should I fall foul of ranting yet again.

I hope this helps. As I said, you provided a fair analysis and I think I can see where you are coming from e.g., your argument has substance. Finally, although I have highlighted five extracts from your response, I don't mean to be critical, as such. I'm just a little confused ...

... but that's quite normal for me.

Cheers

 

[RJI777]

Come on though, as far as rants go, that was all in

Yeah, you're probably right BUT I did push it a bit, especially in the last full paragraph. I'm sorry about that ... I really should know better, but sometimes, I JUST GOTTA RANT. I will however, attempt to demonstrate more self restraint, next time.

 

[JimmyM]

Yeah, you're probably right BUT I did push it a bit, especially in the last full paragraph. I'm sorry about that ... I really should know better, but sometimes, I JUST GOTTA RANT. I will however, attempt to demonstrate more self restraint, next time.

You don't need to apologize. If those are your feelings, they're your feelings. But it sure seemed rather bleak when talking about an industry that wants to get people interested in making music. There are easier ways to make a lot of money if that's your goal.

 

[eldoryder]

Peavey USA, Squier by Fender, Fender and G&L (in that order).

 

[Hazeyhaze]

Yeah, you're probably right BUT I did push it a bit, especially in the last full paragraph. I'm sorry about that ... I really should know better, but sometimes, I JUST GOTTA RANT. I will however, attempt to demonstrate more self restraint, next time.

Every thing alright at home