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What Exactly Do You Need For Recording?

#82
You don't need a lot.

I've seen some great recommendations for DAW & interface solutions, and as noted, the bare minimum is instrument to interface with Hi-Z input to DAW.

If you use a DI, a mic input for the DI is fine, and they'll sometimes allow a split so you can run to your amp as well. Especially active DIs since they can buffer the signal properly. If you go just DI, it helps to use a cab sim, either pedal or software, and if software, you can get magic by duplicating a DI signal in the DAW, one channel with the cab sim, one without.


I've chosen to spend money heh....and run thru a pedalboard capped by not a cab sim, but a nice tube Ampeg preamp pedal (Sushi Box FX Slampegg Bee Pre). Then I run to a Rupert Neve DI (RNDI), and then go into a recording preamp, a clone of the Neve 1073. THEN to my interface, and I went with Focusrite. The RNDI lets me split signal to my cab (totally personal like most things, but I like using an Ampeg 2x10), and I mic that.


It's worth noting: if you decide to get a mic, don't get a kick drum mic! You're not miking the cab for ultra-low response or subharmonic thuds. You're looking for mid-range qualities, and a good general instrument dynamic mic is exactly the right tool. A Shure SM57 (or my personal quirky favorite dynamic mic, an EV PL88L) on the cab will get you very full and excellent sounds from your rig, and mixing that with DI will ensure both the lows and the characteristic mids are present.

I'll argue, though, that if you have to choose between mic and DI, go DI because of the cab sim option.
 
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#83
Simple and you can mix without a computer - Zoom H6 and other field recorders that can take additional instrument and mic input.. Also good for recording rehearsals, gigs, jams
You can stop reading now and you can will probably be recording by the evening. You can at a later date use them as an audio interfaces

The DAW route with a computer is expensive. frustrating and a steep learning curve. I actually had a big winded reply and as I read it, I could see that it was a tiresome read that was more discouraging than encouraging. I started recording to tape a long time ago. I did analog tape restoration to digital when the only game in town was Digidesign and recordable CDs were 7$ a piece. and I have to say, these field recorders are productive, no latency issues, decent compressor and limiter and HPF. For your church gigs and rehearsals, you can use your amp's line out or DI to the bass direct and still capture the band and choir.
 
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#84
seamonkey said:
Interface is best, and you'll have a lot less problems scaling it up.

But, if you have a recent iPhone or Mac, they have great built in mics.
Iphone can even do lossless in the Voice Memo app:
Settings > Voice Memos > Audio Quality and choosing “Lossless.”

Handy to record a rehearsal or jam and this will transfer into a DAW
Click to expand...

This reminds me: if you're on a serious budget BUT want to get some extra space or character in there on top of a basic DI... don't be afraid to experiment. Setting your phone up near the cabinet (gotta know how loud it can get before distorting the phone mic, so it'll need a bit of testing) can get an impressive mid-range recorded sound on the phone. On Android, there's free apps that do .wav PCM recording, if you've one of those (I do).

Also, I agree that the audio interface is the single most important part of the chain. It is your analog-digital converter, your monitoring station, and your connection between instrument and the rest of the music. Spend money there!
 
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#85
My basic home setup is a Behringer UMC204HD (currently $99) into an old Thinkpad T440 and a pair of Yamaha HS80Ms or some cans. Most of the time it's my stereo since the interface functions as a nice sound card, but when I want to record it is simple and works great. Previously I had an Alesis iO26 and then a Focusrite Forte. I had lots of glitch, dropout, and driver issues with the older interfaces (admittedly, with other PCs), and the Forte, which sounded great when it worked, eventually wet the bed (as did the warranty replacement). By comparison, the Behringer is rock solid and has zero problems ever. The Thinkpad isn't music optimized at all, through I did max out the ram at 12 GB and swap a nice big solid state drive. I don't ask a lot of it. I use Reaper with a few plugins and I'm not doing mixes or anything, but it's good for learning tunes (drop an mp3 into a Reaper track and record a bass track along with it, listen back, try again, etc.) or dinking around with a drum machine (ToonTrack EZdrummer old version, bought on sale). The Behringer instrument pres are functional but not amazing, so it helps to use a good preamp or DI when a nice sound is important. The DI out of a decent amp head is probably good.
 
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#87
Mr Cheese said:
So your saying I should get an interface and a DI?
Click to expand...
I would not recommend that initially. I have zero use for a DI, my Focusrite interface gives me the choice between balanced and unbalanced inputs. I get plenty of signal plugging directly into my interface and I can run through my head using the balanced direct out from there if I want to. Get the interface first and experiment with whatever plugins come with your DAW to shape your tone. If you aren't satisfied with your signal levels at that point, a DI might help, but I don't really see how it would as long as your interface is halfway decent.
 
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#88
logdrum said:
Zoom H6 and other field recorders that can take additional instrument and mic input.. Also good for recording rehearsals, gigs, jams
You can stop reading now and you can will probably be recording by the evening. You can at a later date use them as an audio interfaces
Click to expand...

I read a lot of recommendations for these. I have no idea what kind of quality you get from this vs. a traditional interface/DAW setup. Anyone got some clips to share?
 
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#89
Sid Fang said:
Been doin' this for a long time. A lot depends on what all you want to do. Do you want to lay down multiple tracks for arrangements? Use software synths/samplers/virtual keyboards? Record vocals and acoustic instruments?

If you haven't gotten the computer yet, there's the question of what specs to look for and what kind of machine. I use Macs and Linux for almost everything, but Windows for all my DAWs, because of the body of synths and plug-ins I've amassed over the years. They're more expensive, but I tend to use high-end laptops for DAWs, for the portability and for the (acoustic) noise factors. If all you're doing is recording audio, you can use a really wimpy computer BUT chances are you're going to want to have some EQ, effects, compression, etc. and those consume compute cycles. I recommend almost-the-fastest CPUs you can buy (the very fastest always cost a ridiculous premium) and 4 or more cores. USB3/USB-C is plenty fast for multi-channel audio. I personally would never buy an audio interface that didn't have MIDI in/out because I've got a lot of MIDI controllers, but you could save a few bucks on audio only if you're sure that's all you're going to do for a while. I've used RME, PreSonus, and Focusrite interfaces over the years. RME stuff is fabulous but really expensive, especially in the US. Focusrite seems to be the current market leader in volume and number of products, and they have an interface for almost any budget. I have not been wildly impressed by the stability of their drivers (RMEs were legendarily solid), but on the other hand their pre-amps are pretty good for the money. I could plug a bass or guitar directly in and it would be OK, but as I happen to have pre-amp pedals for bass and EUB, I keep those and run the XLR outs into the interface, instead of the high-z 1/4" instrument-in.

As for which DAW software to use, if you're going for best value-for-money and aren't fussy about user interfaces, Reaper is an obvious option. You can use it free in uncrippled demo mode forever, but buying a license is very cheap for what you get. I just find the user interface the least intuitive of any DAW I've tried (which are basically Creator, Logic, Sonar, Studio One, Ableton Live, and Reaper). Sonar was great, but they folded and the folks who took over the source base aren't the same people. I went to Studio One after Sonar, and it's very well designed in many regards, but its MIDI management is nowhere near as good as Sonar's was.

IK Multimedia has a virtual SVT amp plugin that's actually quite good, but something of a one-trick pony. I also play guitar/stick/etc. so I've been using Native Instruments' Guitar Rig for years, which has a big portfolio of guitar amp/cab models as well as a few bass rigs, and adds a HUGE toybox of cool effects.
Click to expand...
Mentioned some good things. I would say though for someone starting out now in 2021 that midi in and out isn’t really that important anymore. Most of the modern midi controllers have a usb out, actually a lot of them ONLY have a usb out. So as long as you have multiple USB ports it really isn’t that big of a deal. But obviously if you have some that don’t have usb you need the midi io
 
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#90
My approach is, I think, in the minority, but it's worked for me: I could never get comfortable with the complexity of computer-based recording (the software, the interface, the plug-ins, etc., etc.). So I spent $400.00 on a Zoom R24, and I was good to go. I like being able to manipulate knobs and sliders, and it's easy for me to understand and work with. It makes sense to my brain. YMMV. I can plug a bass (or guitar, or keyboard, or microphone) directly into it, adjust the gain, EQ it, add built-in effects if I want, etc., and it sounds great. The manual was understandable, and I supplemented with a few YouTube videos. I found that I was multi-tracking in no time, mixing, mastering, punching in (when necessary). For my needs it works great, and it's simple. Our drummer, on the other hand, has a Mac-based DAW, is proficient with Logic Pro, etc. I like that I can export the WAV files of the tracks I record on the Zoom, throw them up on Dropbox, and he can download them into his DAW and add drums tracks, then send them back to me to import back into the Zoom to add more stuff or mix down, etc.

I use the R24 for sketching out my song ideas, rather than just for recording bass. Here's a few examples of things I've done on it, playing all of the instruments myself (with occasional help from my wife on vocals/piano and a buddy who played harmonica on one tune). These certainly aren't intended to be radio or Spotify ready, but it keeps me amused and I'm learning new things all the time.
Dropbox - Demos - Simplify your life
 
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#91
LBS-bass said:
I read a lot of recommendations for these. I have no idea what kind of quality you get from this vs. a traditional interface/DAW setup. Anyone got some clips to share?
Click to expand...

@rickwolff has a lot of Zoom recordings. This is the DB thread where he compared mics and the built in mic of the Zoom. Where you see mid-side, that is the mic that comes with the Zoom. he has a lot of examples and posts where he just uses the zoom built-in mics

Five short recording clips comparing microphones

Here's what I did in San Diego - It's more on the avant garde side of things - Upright bass and birds chirping at night. My friend's house which is a bit too bouncy



here's with the old H4 Zoom using the MS mic. Me with guitar and Princeton amp and a drummer who is cymbal happy - Hard bop sort of: I used the studio compressor built in

 
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#92
Rabidhamster said:
Another budget interface, the discontinued Digitech Eleven Rack has a built in USB interface, DI/Reamping, and a pretty good Ampeg SVT model included.
Click to expand...
Strongly recommend against discontinued products unless you figure you're never going to upgrade your DAW OS. Once the driver and firmware updates stop, it's just a matter of time before Microsoft/Apple or an application breaks it.
 
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#93
I get pretty decent sound going through the line in of a PC from a passive bass. This is done by cutting a 1/4" cable at one end and soldering an 1/8" female jack to the cut end and connecting an 1/8" cable to that.
I use virtual amps sometimes but even without those, it still sounds thumpy and detailed. Not too different from how it sounds going through an amp without boosting either bass or treble. I imagine that you could get much better results using a DI box or an interface but I have no experience with that. Line in on a PC with a decent sound card is at the very least much better in terms of quality than recording using a phone.
 
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#94
Danny O Danny said:
My approach is, I think, in the minority, but it's worked for me: I could never get comfortable with the complexity of computer-based recording (the software, the interface, the plug-ins, etc., etc.). So I spent $400.00 on a Zoom R24, and I was good to go. I like being able to manipulate knobs and sliders, and it's easy for me to understand and work with. It makes sense to my brain. YMMV. I can plug a bass (or guitar, or keyboard, or microphone) directly into it, adjust the gain, EQ it, add effects if I want, etc., and it sounds great. The manual was understandable, and I supplemented with a few YouTube videos. I found that I was multi-tracking in no time, mixing, mastering, punching in (when necessary). For my needs it works great, and it's simple. Our drummer, on the other hand, has a Mac-based DAW, is proficient with Logic Pro, etc. I like that I can export the WAV files of the tracks I record on the Zoom, throw them up on Dropbox, and he can download them into his DAW and add drums tracks, then send them back to me to import back into the Zoom to add more stuff or mix down, etc.

I use the R24 for sketching out my song ideas, rather than just for recording bass. Here's a few examples of things I've done on it, playing all of the instruments myself (with occasional help from my wife on vocals/piano and a buddy who played harmonica on one tune). These certainly aren't intended to be radio or Spotify ready, but it keeps me amused.
Dropbox - Demos - Simplify your life
Click to expand...
I forgot to mention earlier I bought an 8 track (Fostex, I think !) but I still need to learn how to use it. I never learned how to use a 4 track back in the day, so I have no idea how to bump tracks, etc. But that's my next move. I'm like you, I know computers are the way, but for now I'll learn from the bottom up. I don't know. Maybe I'm wasting my time.
I'm just scared of technology. It's intimidating.
 
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#95
mb94952 said:
I forgot to mention earlier I bought an 8 track (Fostex, I think !) but I still need to learn how to use it. I never learned how to use a 4 track back in the day, so I have no idea how to bump tracks, etc. But that's my next move. I'm like you, I know computers are the way, but for now I'll learn from the bottom up. I don't know. Maybe I'm wasting my time.
I'm just scared of technology. It's intimidating.
Click to expand...

The funny thing is... I make my living as a computer network engineer. :laugh: So I'm very comfortable with computers and technology, but for some reason I could never get comfortable with PC or Mac based DAWs (and I tried several) and all the bits and pieces involved. What I wanted was as straight and simple a line as possible to begin working on music, rather than fiddling about with the underlying technology.
 
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#96
Mr Cheese said:
What do you need to record your bass? I'd like to start recording, and I'm getting a computer for it. I know you need a DAW, (I've looked at Cakewalk, Reaper, and Garage Band) but beyond that I'm lost. An interface, a di...both? A mic? What exactly do you need, and what are your recommended products for recording bass? (Looking for an option that won't leave flies in my wallet.) I get 15% off any item over $49 at GC, but it only lasts a few more days, so I'd like to get one of the pieces needed to record soon.
Click to expand...

1) first off, change your ridiculous logo.

just kidding, it’s pretty embarrassing to be a Bears fan nowadays, I shouldn’t be talking ;)

2) Reaper. Intuitive, flexible, reliable, cheap, and there’s a glut of excellent support videos and forums. Reaper Mania and the Reaper Blog are highly recommended.

3) the best interface your budget allows, but buying any popular interface will ensure there is lots of support out there. Scarlet 2i2 is probably the most ubiquitous interface, considering I’ve never owned one and know the model number, you sure see them used a lot. My main interface is the Roland octacapture, and it’s excellent, with a strong reputation for quality and flexibility, but it’s not the most intuitive or popular device, and there aren’t a whole lot of tutorials on it out there, so if you’re very new to recording in general, I’d look for something more well-documented. I’m looking to invest in Audient gear to take the next step up in features and quality but the Roland is going string for nearly a decade now, I’ll be using it until it’s dead.

4) to mic or not to mic is a big question. I’m on team mic. Most of my bass recordings end up being a blend of mainly the mic signal, with some direct to fill in low end as needed. Yes you can do everything direct and use emulated cabinets nowadays, but bass is a difficult instrument to learn to mix, and direct signals are generally very fat, in your face, and require heavy processing to be at all useful, even after cab simulations. Miking introduces air and space to the sound, and cuts down on the unusable low end present in most direct signals. I can and have recorded and processed bass entirely direct, but nowadays I always use a miked signal when possible, just because it starts out so much closer to being mixed properly than just a direct signal.

Pro mic placement hint: move the mic around until it sounds good. No charge for that.

So I’d recommend a decent mic or 2. An SM57 is $100 or less, that’s a no brainer. Some kind of large diaphragm condenser would be ideal to have too. Mics are the first stage of recording eq, so having a little variety can again help things fit it a little easier. There’s plenty of used stuff out there, but a great, pro build quality, entry level priced LDC mic is the AT4040.

As with anything music, your budget’s the limit, but for under $1000 (excluding the computer) you can absolutely produce release quality material with the products above or similar. Good luck and have fun!
 
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