What "Keep It Simple" Really Means

[pklima]

They're the first tastes I'd trust, because few of my gigs are about me anymore- most are about the music. They usually have a greater understanding of what they're hearing and why than people who don't play. There are exceptions, of course- there's an older guy who runs a jazz show on the local college station who I think has great taste and a great grasp of music, even tho I don't think he plays anything.

I'd love to see more women at the gigs, but I'd REALLY love to see women who didn't seem to want to "connect" with a singer (who would provide the focus for all the other sounds they haven't put themselves in a position to understand). I know they're out there, because I've played with a few. Most of the ensembles I play with don't have a singer.

We get more players in the audience --usually they're male-- than "civilians" I suppose, but people listening is an even better compliment than people dancing. They tend to return, so I'm cool with that.

We may be playing very different music to very different audiences, but I think it really comes down to the same thing... play as many notes as will get the best audience reaction. Doesn't it?

 

[lfmn16]

Absolutely the right way to do it.

Thanks. I think one of the reasons this topic gets argued over and over is that everyone thinks that everyone else has the same goal as they do. The answer to how many notes to play depends on your goal. If your goal is to be a hired hand, then you play as many notes as the guy paying you tells you to play. If your goal is to be in a corporate/wedding band, then you should probably play close to the record. If your goal is to create a musical vision, then you play as many notes as you need to play.

I always find it funny that no one calls Hendrix, Jeff Beck, or a host of great guitarists immature or a show offs. These school yard names are usually reserved for bass players that want to break out of the mold. I may never become a great innovator or influence on others but I stand up and applaud those that are trying to push the envelope. Too many bass players play it safe.

 

[Rockin Mike]

Two things:
1) Serve the song.
2) Stop learning chops and start learning meter & groove. If you can lock tightly with the drummer you make the whole band sound good.

 

[pklima]

I always find it funny that no one calls Hendrix, Jeff Beck, or a host of great guitarists immature or a show offs.

Well, I did tell one guitarist that people used to play guitar solos back in the 60s and 70s when they really didn't know what works and what doesn't. Now it's been long enough that we know, and nobody plays guitar solos anymore. And no, I wasn't joking.

 

[coyote1]

I think if one wants to be a "busy" player, that's OK, but one should realize that it may mean choosing / creating a genre that isn't oriented towards dancing and airplay. And one still has to work within the bounds of good musical taste.

In bands that play arranged music, you can't just change the bass part without changing everything. If the entire band isn't up to providing the bassist with some space to spread out, then a "busy" bassist will clash with the band and get blamed for it.

And yet, in many of those genres there's a boatload of space to play and improvise. Take the song Reach Out - I'll Be There. You have to nail the essence of Jamerson's playing, but you do not have to hit every note he hit. You can turn his phrases around a dozen ways while maintaining the integrity of the music. The error would be if you decide to shift up two octaves for those 8-count bass features, or played straight 16ths instead of of using his "grace note gallop", or if you ran a dorian scale there or something.

Of course, I highly recommend learning to play those things as-is, and staying with that until you learn the method to his genius. Then you can improvise from within his style. And this applies to just about anything out there from any player.

 

[lfmn16]

Well, I did tell one guitarist that people used to play guitar solos back in the 60s and 70s when they really didn't know what works and what doesn't. Now it's been long enough that we know, and nobody plays guitar solos anymore. And no, I wasn't joking.

Saying it doesn't make it so.

There may not be guitar solos in the watered down, Brittney Spears / Justin Bebier infected swill that the record companies spoon feed the public (which doesn't know any better), but if you explore the vast majority of music which is created but not generic and simple minded enough for the radio, you will discover solos are alive and well.

Again, it depends on your goals. If you want to sound like every other soulless, witless, paint-by-the-numbers radio hit, then you know what to do. If you want to create your own music, there is no roadmap.

 

[Zeke3elevn]

The bass is a Rhythm instrument ... it can't be over done. I went through this when I played drums (was a drummer first) and when I picked up the bass I was already well aware of my job.

Great post OP!

 

[azureblue]

It ain't the number of notes you play that count- it's the groove and pocket

 

[M Sterling]

Pick your spots wisely, put it in the pocket, and don't neglect the 1. You will figure out when and how to use your chops, just don't force it.

 

[phillybass101]

It's funny how many bassists come about this revelation. I have never had this issue! My learning years included listening to and playing along to records. If you really listen to what's going on, you will find mostly simplistic playing. Overplaying seems to be a 'new' thing! Back in the day we 'oldschoolers' always played what the song needed! Nothing more and nothing less!

I find the biggest issue with many, amatuer and weekend warrior, bands is that no one listens to each other. Everyone is in their own little world doing whatever they want in the name of 'creativity'! So now the music sounds so frikkin' cluttered and grooveless. Remember, it's a band! Work together and listen to each other!

Lastly, how do you think a cat like Nathan East got to play on so many records dating back to the 70's?? By playing what the song calls for! No more and no less!

DW is right. Remember what the role of the bass is in music and what your role as bass player is in the band. We live in an era where we have easy access via youtube, skype etc to observe and learn all the greatest and newest bass shredder techniques. we now have bass seminars, bass camps, etc to go to. We even now live in a time where guys are actually making a living going all over the country giving one man bass shows and getting paid for it. This however is not the norm. No one likes a person who talks too much in a conversation. Playing in a band setting needs a back and forth conversation between the band members. and to do this you have to listen. you can't listen if you are always trying to dominate by talking too much. The same goes for your bass playing. If you are too busy playing all your greatest licks, you're not listening and certainly not communicating with the other members of the band. And you must realize the role of the bass. Bass is a supporting instrument. if you need to be out front, and have so much to say, then maybe the bass is not the best instrument for you. if you require attention, bass is not the instrument for you if you really want to serve the music, the song, the band.

 

[pklima]

Bass is a supporting instrument. if you need to be out front, and have so much to say, then maybe the bass is not the best instrument for you. if you require attention, bass is not the instrument for you if you really want to serve the music, the song, the band.

Nah, you're wrong about that. If you need to be out front and have so much to say, sing and rap. What instrument you play while doing it isn't important. Though yeah, it's very hard to play bass and rap at the same time, but hey, trying to do so will force you to keep the bass part simple.

Saying it doesn't make it so.

There may not be guitar solos in the watered down, Brittney Spears / Justin Bebier infected swill that the record companies spoon feed the public (which doesn't know any better), but if you explore the vast majority of music which is created but not generic and simple minded enough for the radio, you will discover solos are alive and well.

Again, it depends on your goals. If you want to sound like every other soulless, witless, paint-by-the-numbers radio hit, then you know what to do. If you want to create your own music, there is no roadmap.

LOL. I'd be glad to hurl insults in the general direction of unpopular niche music and pretend to be unable to spell the names of its heroes, but tbh I do like some music with guitar solos. It's all country, though, which is supposed to sound all traditional and "not keeping up with the times". Solos are OK for that purpose.

 

[scottfeldstein]

And you must realize the role of the bass. Bass is a supporting instrument. if you need to be out front, and have so much to say, then maybe the bass is not the best instrument for you. if you require attention, bass is not the instrument for you if you really want to serve the music, the song, the band.

I'm not sure I completely agree with this. In some music the groove is the dominant feature, the part that's "out front." Take this for example.

Butter of 69

 

[lfmn16]

LOL. I'd be glad to hurl insults in the general direction of unpopular niche music and pretend to be unable to spell the names of its heroes, but tbh I do like some music with guitar solos. It's all country, though, which is supposed to sound all traditional and "not keeping up with the times". Solos are OK for that purpose.

I'm not pretending. They aren't worth bothering to spell their names right! For a long time I thought it was Justin BEAVER. That little twit makes David Cassidy seem like a musical heavyweight.

 

[lfmn16]

I'm not sure I completely agree with this. In some music the groove is the dominant feature, the part that's "out front."

Actually I completely disagree with it. Support may be one possible role for the bass, but no one person (or group) gets to decide that there is only one role for the bass. The same thing is true about the, "if you don't like the role I'm telling you that you have to follow, choose another instrument" crap. I say, if you don't like how I play the bass plug your ears.

When your mind starts to close , repeat these truths:

1. The earth is NOT flat
2. The moon is NOT made out of green cheese
3. There is NOT a single role that all bass players have to follow

 

[Sub300Hertz]

.....Back in the day we 'oldschoolers' always played what the song needed! Nothing more and nothing less!...!

This is so true. Years ago I watched a Miles Davis interview where he said he would hire any musician who could play 3 notes like he needed/wanted.

 

[Passinwind]

1. There is NOT a single role that all bass players have to follow

/thread

 

[randyripoff]

I'm not sure I completely agree with this. In some music the groove is the dominant feature, the part that's "out front." Take this for example.

Butter of 69

I've always liked that song.

 

[carlthegroover]

I just love the liberal use of the term "wank" on this forum. Keep it comin' guys. <3

Apologies. "Noodling" it is, then.

 

[scottfeldstein]

I kind of like "squintily wee."

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[lfmn16]

Back in the day we 'oldschoolers' always played what the song needed! Nothing more and nothing less!

We still do. The argument comes because we don't all agree on what the song needs.

This is so true. Years ago I watched a Miles Davis interview where he said he would hire any musician who could play 3 notes like he needed/wanted.

This would be an excellent approach if you goal is to mimic Miles Davis.