Why did Fender fail to capture the 5 String market?

[Bill Whitehurst]

I think Fender was still a little uneasy after their own first 5 string.
They waited to see if there was any market for the first ones.
Since the early 5ers were often not just different, but also often pricey,
there were not that many being sold, at first.
By the time they first decided to build a 5, Music Man had jumped in and beat them
to market with a decent, affordable 5.
Curiously, that was during Leo's watch.

Fender can and has built some good 5s.
They still can, if they chose to.

For those suffering from floppy Bs,
a fatter B string will increase tension and thereby reduce flop.

 

[wes stephenson]

The Dimensions , Roscoe Becks, Deluxe Jazz, and Elites are all good 5 strings from Fender.
Can’t say the same for the new Ultra 5’s due to the g string too close to the edge issue. Hopefully they get that sorted out and rectified .

I’ve heard some folks say this but I just got an Ultra and the G string is perfect.

 

[scottfeldstein]

Can someone explain to me what the bass itself has to do with a B string feeling floppy? Other than the stiffness of the neck or the scale length. Isn't this a function of the string itself rather than the bass? Given two basses of the same scale length, how could the identical B string feel floppy on one bass and not feel floppy on the other?

I don't know that I have a complete answer for this, but I do have my own experience to relate. I got my 2002 Fender Jazz V a few weeks ago. I had to shim the neck to get the string height down out of the stratosphere. don't know how that happened, but it did. Even then, even with a very straight neck (maybe .011 relief) I can't get the B string to go below 6/64s and not buzz.

My 2014 Warwick will go to just a whisker above 4/64s and not buzz at all. You tell me. It's mechanical. That's what I know.

 

[markorbit]

Can someone explain to me what the bass itself has to do with a B string feeling floppy? Other than the stiffness of the neck or the scale length. Isn't this a function of the string itself rather than the bass? Given two basses of the same scale length, how could the identical B string feel floppy on one bass and not feel floppy on the other?

I find myself pondering this too. A string rests on two witness points - why should it matter what else is there?

 

[Dr. Cheese]

I’ve heard some folks say this but I just got an Ultra and the G string is perfect.

I played one last week and did not notice the G being too close to the edge.

 

[5stringthumpin]

A lot of responses here but for my two cents, most people think of fender as traditional. They’re willing to shell out ridiculous money for a line of basses where they imitate worn paint, or put together basses from different parts and call it a pawn shop bass. When shopping for a 5 string there are so many better options, including fender clones. My Sire v7 5 strings blow away any fender 5er I’ve ever played. They’re the Harley Davidsons of bass, classic, but behind the times and never able to really catch up.

 

[wes stephenson]

Yes, and to great effect:

I’ve heard from several bassists that the Suhr era (which is what Sharay is playing in first vid) 5ers are incredible.

 

[scottfeldstein]

I’ve heard from several bassists that the Suhr era (which is what Sharay is playing in first vid) 5ers are incredible.

Mine is one! It sounds great! It just doesn't play great. It plays ok. But the sound is terrific. Even if it is pretty quiet.

 

[AndyPanda]

My Warwick will go to just a whisker above 4/64s and not buzz at all.

Sadowsky considers 6/64ths to be LOW, 7/64 MED and 8/64 HIGH ... so your 4/64ths B string height seems unusually low IMO. But buzzing aside ... does the same string feel less floppy on the Warwick?

 

[scottfeldstein]

Sadowsky considers 6/64ths to be LOW, 7/64 MED and 8/64 HIGH ... so your 4/64ths B string height seems unusually low IMO. But buzzing aside ... does the same string feel less floppy on the Warwick?

Well it feels different. I don't have to be careful how hard I pluck it with my right hand. And it feels different in my left hand because the string doesn't have to travel as far to meet the fret where I want to play it. Maybe that does equal "less floppy" sure.

Edit: I have DR Lo-Riders on the Fender right now and DR Sunbeams on the Warwick.

 

[wes stephenson]

If Fender is not for you, there are a ton of Fender style basses to chose from like Performance.

Dude! I got a Performance YB-5/24 about a year ago. Best over all bass I’ve ever had!

 

[OptimalOptimus]

Why ?
It is Fender.
They are only allowed to make 4 strings P or J bass. Nothing more.
Everything else they try is bound to fail by the very conservative fan base of Fender.

 

[retslock]

Edit: I have DR Lo-Riders on the Fender right now and DR Sunbeams on the Warwick.

That’s a variable right there - two different type strings. Impossible to make an accurate comparison. Are they the same guage?

 

[OptimalOptimus]

The Dimensions , Roscoe Becks, Deluxe Jazz, and Elites are all good 5 strings from Fender.
Can’t say the same for the new Ultra 5’s due to the g string too close to the edge issue. Hopefully they get that sorted out and rectified .

Doesn’t botter EBMM So I think it is ok for Fender bu since it is far from tradition it will fail hard

 

[craig0316]

1. Why ?? They designed the perfect 4 string.
2. Passive 5 string P basses just don't sound good. Active humbucker 5 strings sound the best.

I suppose thats all in how you play, what you play and what kind of strings... I have a Fender 5P Am Pro and I love it,,, So do the guys in my band.

 

[scottfeldstein]

That’s a variable right there - two different type strings. Impossible to make an accurate comparison. Are they the same guage?

Sure, but it's the opposite of what you'd think. The Fender has a more rigid string which theoretically would prevent some buzz. The Warwick has the more flexible string which would buzz more, but it does not.

Soon I will put some DR Neons on both (different colors, mind) and then we'll see. But I guarantee that the difference between these two isn't down to strings, that much I'd bet the farm on.

 

[Chad Michael]

To this day, I'd still like to try one of these:

 

[Mastermold]

Not much to add to what's been said already. Other companies beat them to it so Fender was not leading the market. And Fender designs are iconic and appeal to a traditional customer which wasn't the early 5 string customer.

 

[brianrost]

I think perhaps they overestimated the appeal of the high C with that initial offering and didn't realize that players would appreciate extended low range.

-- Danelectro "shorthorn" basses of the 1960s that predated the Bass V had 15-fret fingerboards.

-- The Kay 5-string "Chubby Jackson" double basses of the 1940s and 1950s had a high C string.

-- Amps of the mid 1960s didn't have the low frequency response to easily handle an open B.

-- Synthesizer bass lines going below the open E note didn't exist yet.

-- No PAs with subs yet (look at photos of the Beatles baseball stadium shows).

-- Most people still listened to records using low fidelity record players with tiny speakers and low wattage.

 

[Michael Jewels]

I joined Talkbass at the end of 2000, and within a few months I noticed the chatter about the early Ibanez BTB models. I played a few, and noticed how strong the low B strings were, but wasn't thrilled with the pickups.

Then, early January 2006, I went into the Sam Ash Manhattan store, and played the Prestige BTB 1205E they had, and I took it home the next day.
The low B, the overall tone of the bass, and the looks knocked me over.
To me, I am still delighted everytime I plug it in.
I'd say that's pretty good for a 14 year old bass.
I can't ask for more.
I've played a few Fenders, but wasn't impressed.
Mike