Why do so many 5 & 6 string players NEVER use their low B?

[2cooltoolz]

I didn't read all the posts. Sorry.

First off, why do you care? If I want 20 strings on my instrument, regardless of what it's called, why would that bother you?

Secondly, I don't use my B string as often as the others because I play in cover bands, and 95% or more old music is written with E as lowest bass note. However, even in covers we drop several songs to Eb or D to fit our singer's range. The guitarist keeps three guitars in stands to cover this. I don't. We also have a few "Jam" songs, in which I love walking up from the low B to E, or D to G...

I admit to not liking the G string much, so I frequently play higher up the neck to avoid it. Then the B string offers me the opportunity to get to the E, F, or G without having to shift so much. I'm reluctant to give up the G, though, as I like it's "twang" above the 9th or 10th fret.

Now that 5 is "home", I can't see a reason to go back to 4. Ever.

 

[foothilla]

I didn't read all the posts. Sorry.

First off, why do you care? If I want 20 strings on my instrument, regardless of what it's called, why would that bother you?

I'm a bass player, and I am curious. Why would it bother you that I am curious?

It's kind of odd that a few people are being so defensive about a simple curiosity. It's those people that I think are playing them just because they think they look cool.

 

[2cooltoolz]

I'm a bass player, and I am curious. Why would it bother you that I am curious?

It's kind of odd that some people are being so defensive about a simple curiosity. It's those people that I think are playing them just because they think they look cool.

You're not curious. You like to debate. My best friend is the same. You stake out a position to start a debate, challenging (yes) people with "playing them just because they think they look cool", then saying they were just curious. Why would you limit yourself to only 4 strings? Not "pure" enough for you. Just curious.

 

[gregbackstrom]

Odd thread! I’ve been a bass player for about 52 years. In all that time it has never occurred to me to tally the number of notes I play on each string. For the last 25 years or so, I’ve played 5’s pretty exclusively. My guess would be that I play more notes overall on the E, A and D strings, and fewer on the B and G strings. Likewise, my piano players tend to play more notes in the center of the keyboard. Okay - time for bed. Yawn.

 

[JW56789]

I transitioned to five-strings in the mid-80's, as the major manufacturers began to sell them; my first was a 5-string Peavey Dyna Bass, later transitioned to BB5000 Yamahas, and others over the years. I quit playing fours, and never owned another one until a year ago, and I still consider myself a 5-string guy. I was never smart enough to go back and forth the way a lot of guys can, I do better sticking with one thing.

To me, fours were harder to finger lots of things. With a five, I could play across the fingerboard, rather than on a four where I'd start something here and have to jump to there to finish it. It just made a lot more sense to the way I saw the fingerboard. Sixes never interested me, frankly just too wide in most cases, and I didn't need any extra high end.

I'll say what I always say: Going from a four to a five just to pick up E-flat, D, D-flat, C and B is WAY too much work and expense. If you need this but really want only four strings, set it up for B-E-A-D, or get a drop tuner, and save yourself a bundle and a lot of headaches.

So I'd have to say I use the B all the time without thinking about it, it's just another string and the novelty wore off a long time ago and I just play it. I quickly broke out of the mindset that it was a four with an extra string, I approach as its' own thing. I just get around better on it, and when I change strings, the B's just as used up as the other four.

 

[foothilla]

You're not curious. You like to debate. My best friend is the same. You stake out a position to start a debate, challenging (yes) people with "playing them just because they think they look cool", then saying they were just curious.

If you think it's just pointless debate, why participate?

Debate, curiosity,...whatever semantics suit you, the result is the same. I want to know why some bass players do what they do.

Some people gave great explanations about why they prefer the 5/6, even when they aren't using the extra strings. I certainly don't think those people are just playing them because they like the look. But, the people that are all butt hurt over a harmless discussion,...those people are probably having some problem reconciling their own decision.

Why would you limit yourself to only 4 strings? Not "pure" enough for you. Just curious.

I don't find 4 strings limiting. Regardless, I don't personally limit myself to 4 strings. I have two 5 strings with a high C. However, when I play those basses, I play the high C. If I am not going to use the high C, I play a 4 string.

The high C is more of a string for soloing and chordal work in my view. If I am playing straight rock/blues, for instance, I would never touch the high C, and therefore would use a 4 string for that kinda work. But, that's obviously just me.

For most standard bass playing I find the low B too flabby and undefined,...and I find the high C too hifi. The other 4 strings,....just right.

 

[foothilla]

Odd thread! I’ve been a bass player for about 52 years. In all that time it has never occurred to me to tally the number of notes I play on each string. For the last 25 years or so, I’ve played 5’s pretty exclusively. My guess would be that I play more notes overall on the E, A and D strings, and fewer on the B and G strings. Likewise, my piano players tend to play more notes in the center of the keyboard. Okay - time for bed. Yawn.

In those 52 years have you noticed many guys like I've shown in those videos? Guys playing 5 strings that never even touch the B string once? Because they aren't a rarity. Maybe not the norm, but not rare either.

 

[Wasnex]

If you have 4 string basses, and you play 4 string basses, and you are making a recording where you only want to use the E-A-D-G strings,.....then I don't understand why a guy would grab a 5 string for that particular recording.

I would have to understand why they are doing that before I could deem it smart, stupid, or otherwise. The fact that I don't understand a move like that, is why I am asking players about that particular decision.






Perfect scenario to explain my curiosity:

Say 2 string basses were common (like 4 string basses are). If you had an array of 2 string basses at your disposal, and you were very competent on your 2 string basses,....then yes, I would be curious why you used your 6 string bass for recording a Presidents Of The United States cover tune.

Not calling you stupid,...but I would be curious why you would chose a 6 string, over a 2 string, if you were only going to use 2 strings anyway (and you had 2 string basses at your disposal).

Using that scenario, wouldn't you understand why I would find your choice of a 6 string curious?

I explained my position in my first response. Here's the relevant excerpt

I doesn't really make sense for me to switch back to a 4 string. I started with Simandl fingering 1,3,4. But, when I was transitioning to 5- and then 6-string bass, I also transitioned to one finger per fret. So I have developed a totally different system of fingering and shifting across the strings than what I used back when I was exclusively a 4-string player.

I do own 5-strings and 4-strings, including my first bass. I have played the TRB6P for so long that it is home, so basically it would take extra mental effort to figure out how to play technical passages on a 4-string or 5-string. The 6-string gives me more choices in how I play a line.

Just because I am covering a part that was originally played on a 2-string bass does not mean I will only play it on only two strings. If I understand correctly, Chris Ballew's Bassitar was strung with a 0.060 and a 0.036 which were tuned to C# and G#. Note the strings are tuned in a 5th, so a different finger pattern will be required on bass anyway.

Swapping basses is no a foreign concept to me. For the record I used to tour with three basses: 6-string fretted bass guitar, 4-string acoustic upright, 6-string electric upright. It was a lot of extra work and sometimes I felt like it didn't matter to anyone else. But I thought it made sense to switch between these instruments because each had a very unique character and feel.

I don't see the point in switching basses because you won't use all of the strings, as I am competent enough on the 6-string that there is rarely an advantage to playing an instrument with less strings. It's more of a mental encumbrance to play with less strings because I am used to thinking as a 6-string player.

However, as I mentioned I do own 4- and 5-string basses. The reason is because they produce a different sound and feel. For example I have a Modulus Flea 5 which is a great crossover bass for anyone who shifts back and forth between slap and finger-style. I can slap just fine on my TRB6P, but it doesn't sound like the Flea. I also have a Modulus Genesis 5 which is super woody sounding and has a huge B string. I think this bass would be ideal if I were going to play certain types of old school gospel....it's awful for slap though.

 

[DrayMiles]

The low B is powerful stuff grasshopper. You don’t think of it the way you are...

I have played it on a lot of records, but the ensemble dictates when there’s enough sonic room to use it... Or a song’s arrangement. You use it when it’s appropriate and musical, not in an immature way. Just because it’s there... Do you use your technique or ability to play fast all the time? I hope not...

 

[gregbackstrom]

In those 52 years have you noticed many guys like I've shown in those videos? Guys playing 5 strings that never even touch the B string once? Because they aren't a rarity. Maybe not the norm, but not rare either.

No, but I imagine that there are times I don’t play my B or G strings too. The strings I use are dictated by the fingering needed (by me) to play a song.

 

[Thumpin6string]

There's the ticket, practicality. C and D keyed songs. But I don't even use a 5'er, I use a Hipshot double drop tuner for that very reason. Even stuff in F, G (and Bb), having to go up for that 5th doesn't sound as good as having the lower note available. No problem normally for stuff in E, A and B. I'll even drop the E to D for songs in F so I don't have to use that darned first fret with the thickest piece of cable, that gets tiring after a while. Doubling octaves when in DADG is simple, same fret. That covers 98% of every song ever written, or at least the ones I'll ever pay. Eb? Bah.

Glad that works for you. Never understood dropping only one string. My 60 year old brain would be unable to figure out what I was supposed to play. Detuning all the strings would solve this, but talk about floppy strings. I'll stick with my ways.

 

[foothilla]

The low B is powerful stuff grasshopper. You don’t think of it the way you are...

I have played it on a lot of records, but the ensemble dictates when there’s enough sonic room to use it... Or a song’s arrangement. You use it when it’s appropriate and musical, not in an immature way. Just because it’s there... Do you use your technique or ability to play fast all the time? I hope not...

I'm more talking about guys that are almost never (or never) playing the low B.

Take the first video I posted as a prime example. That guy is probably youtube's biggest bass playing sensation. He's a great player, with a very unique style that literally has gotten millions of hits (which is impressive for a bassist). The guy is primarily a 4 string player, and has a boatload of 4 string basses. But he uses a 5 string for that recording, and never plays a single note on the low B. Meanwhile he is aggressively thumbing the hell out of the E string. So the entire time he is thumping on that E string,...there is that B string in the way, needing to be muted, and needing to have it's overtones controlled. What he is performing would have been so much easier and cleaner, had he used one of his 4 strings.

Now, if he was primarily a 5 stringer, and that is the only neck that felt right to him - I would have gotten it. But he's not, he's a 4 string player primarily.

Had that 5 string been his only bass, I would have gotten it. But, it's not, he has tons of 4 strings.

Had this been a live show and he wanted to use just one bass throughout, then I would have gotten it. But, it's not. It's a recording that was clearly rehearsed. He could have grabbed any bass.

Using that first video as an example, it just doesn't make sense to me, why he'd use a 5 string for that performance. But the thing is, it isn't just him, I am seeing this trend over and over (and I posted a few more examples of other players doing similar things).

...so it all comes back to trying to understand why great players do the things they do.

 

[_One//Man//Mutiny_]

I was in your boat never bonded with B strings. I always strung my 5s with a high C. When I started playing with a band that used CGDGBe as a tuning I was using my C fairly heavily. But with the music the high c was too shrill and stuck out in the music. So I opted to swap back to a b string and tune up to C. I ended up settling on using a 4 tuned CGDG, kind of redundant to have half my strings tuned the same and not every bass has allows for me to down tune the E and A strings that far, but with DR Fat Beams more than one of my basses can swing it and that's why I ditched all but my 4 strings!

 

[nnnnnn]

Why do so many 5 & 6 string players NEVER use their low B?
It's not uncommon to see some monster players that will go the entire tune without hitting the low B string a single time.

Not hitting a string in a particular tune, or even not hitting a string in a whole set, is not the same thing as never hitting that string.

My five-string bass has a more comfortable neck than my four-string, and also I prefer the string spacing on my fiver. Also I like that I could play notes on the B string even though I may choose not to in a lot of songs. So I play my four-string bass when I want its particular pickup options or if I'm in the mood for variety more generally, but otherwise I stick to the five-string whether I need the B string at the time or not.

 

[juggahnaught]

Maybe I didn't articulate well. I realize that a lot of players use their low B string. And I don't really study every genre (I don't actively listen to pop, country, metal, worship, and punk). I'm sure that if you took every genre into consideration, the majority of players are indeed using their B string to some reasonable degree.

So, I am generalizing, but I am noticing a decent amount of players that never/rarely use it. I am particularly noticing this with some really talented jazz player and rock players. I'm seeing it with local players out in the Los Angeles circuit, on youtube, and out at big shows. These guys may be the minority, but there seem to be a lot of them. Maybe it's always been that way, and I just never noticed? Maybe it's more common in the styles of music I seek out? Or maybe I am blowing it out of proportion.

I guess if no one else is noticing this in players, it must just be my inaccurate perception. I was just wondering if these guys felt like the bigger neck sounded better? Or if they actually preferred something about the feel of the wider neck? Or if it was something else strange that I wasn't even considering (e.g. "I like the aesthetics of a huge bass").

...but it seems like it's just me that is noticing these guys that barely use the low B. So, we can close the thread if I'm just being an over analytical douche.

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Haha, no harm done. This is far from the worst thread we've had on Talkbass concerning basses with more than four strings.

My uneducated guess would be that in the art of jazz, the range provided by the upper and middle strings gives greater flexibility in walking lines - and again, similar to my reasons for not "hanging out" on the B string, when you're walking, you want to have options above and below the string you're on for maximum flexibility without resorting to position shifts. So based on that and based on the keys that jazz players find themselves in, I could see the B string not getting that much use. In rock - it might depend on the subgenre of rock (some subgenres downtune, etc), but I could see the B string being used sparingly if at all. I think those are the cases where you want the low B for that one song but otherwise it's a thumbrest. Also - in rock and jazz, solos and embellishments usually take place in a higher register, so my guess is that you'd be more likely to see the use of the high string.

Part of my guess is also this - a pro player may opt for a five instead of two separate four-strings for versatility, and only use the low string when necessary - which is perfectly valid. (This may actually enable them to switch between basses with different string counts more easily, which makes sense to me - having a five or six as a main is one thing, being unable to play without those strings is another.) Some players do the opposite (see Billy Sheehan).

Maybe you're blowing it out of proportion, but then, maybe you aren't. It's not a bad question to ask if it's an earnest one, and I think it's always good to think about the way that we approach our instruments.

 

[okcrum]

I've done recording sessions with a 5 where I couldn't use the B string at all, because the tour bassist would only have a 4.

 

[Real Soon]

The low B string has a particular tone, one that must be used judiciously or, even, just when absolutely necessary (or desired!).

5-string is common in a large swath of modern players, some of whom are in the school of using it as an easy reach whenever it saves a position change, some of whom are in the school of using it for Eb down to the open low B. The latter is more common since most players start on 4 and pick up a 5 out of necessity rather than adopting the extra range early on, and also, some basses & strings are simply better suited for one use vs the other. I have a 5-string that's better for Eb down on the low string, and a 7-string (!) whose B string is tight for all 23 frets.

I know some very talented R&B type cats around here who play 5-string axes and who often go entire gigs without using the low B, but also who bring one main bass and one backup and who sound phenomenal and who are clearly pros. It's the instrument of choice. One likes to play a 6-string and, again, may or may not use any more than the middle 4 strings.

Also, for recording... one might bring the 5-string because it's active with sweet punchy humbuckers and has that sound vs the P bass, because the session called for the 'buckers.

All in all, I can think of a lot of reasons a player might bring the five bangers to the place.


Also there's cats who get one because it looks cool and they don't actually know how to use the string at all. Prob a lot of them in LA

 

[Iristone]

The current live bassist (I'm still the live drummer ) in my band is using my 5-string Squier. He said he hasn't a use for that string, but likes the J bass tone and uses the extra string as a thumbrest. He doesn't even change that string when he changes all the others!
For myself... I bought that bass because my former teacher told me I need the low B string to hold my own against a keyboardist. And we haven't even found a permanent keyboardist for the band.

 

[Wasnex]

This cat has a ton of 4 string basses, but plays this on a 5 string, and never touches the low B. Seems like this would be a hell of a lot easier without that B string in the way?

Maybe this guy is not really a 5-string bass player; so he doesn't really fit the criteria of you question.

Here's and example of someone who is comfortable using all of the strings:

 

[Leo Thunder]

First off, why do you care?

Why do you care if he cares?