Why I lost a bit of respect for Sting (Rick Beato Interview)

[BassBrass]

Miles Davis hated Sting. That's good enough for me.

I just heard an advertisement for tonight 12/30, PBS, American Masters-Miles Davis
Back to topic...

 

[Mike Mitchell]

I'm sure many of you have seen the Rick Beato interview with Sting and his guitarist, Dominic Miller. It was a fascinating look into songwriting, basslines, and (inadvertently) one gargantuan ego.

It was a great conversation. But when Rick began to discuss the other members of The Police (Stewart Copeland and Andy Summers), Sting stepped in and essentially gave himself credit for their contributions to the band.

At some points it was subtle. Others, not so much. But I found it to be very off-putting that one of my all-time favorite musicians showed so little humility in dealing with his bandmates.

Did anyone else notice that?

Been following and playing his music for years. Bass & lead vocals. very underrated bass player. That said I have been lucky enough to hang with him a bit and he's always been a gracious host. But. I have friends who have worked with him and Im told its a struggle.

 

[Gilmourisgod]

He has this weird clipped speech pattern that sounds like he's tightly clenching a pinecone in his a** that I associate with upper-crusty British dudes, which is weird, because his background is good solid English working class AFAIK. He comes off as a bit of a prick in interviews, but maybe he's just sick to death of answering the same questions. Most celebrities develope that kind of hard outer shell as as a defense mechanism, maybe that's all it is. Yeah, he's an extremely talented overall musician, but I don't find him too inspiring as a bass player. In recent years he seems to have "dumbed down" his bass playing by using a kind of lazy thumb-only pluck, vs. some of the pretty good pick and fingerstyle he used to do. Maybe that's necesary as the songs he sings have gotten more complex.

 

[sean_on_bass]

I'm sure many of you have seen the Rick Beato interview with Sting and his guitarist, Dominic Miller. It was a fascinating look into songwriting, basslines, and (inadvertently) one gargantuan ego.

It was a great conversation. But when Rick began to discuss the other members of The Police (Stewart Copeland and Andy Summers), Sting stepped in and essentially gave himself credit for their contributions to the band.

At some points it was subtle. Others, not so much. But I found it to be very off-putting that one of my all-time favorite musicians showed so little humility in dealing with his bandmates.

Did anyone else notice that?

I got a little of that, but overall did not feel there was any ill will there as he was talking. I think he was just trying to talk about the experience in a fairly specific way, which doesn't happen too often in interviews. Beato drives the conversation there because he really wants to understand the finer details of how the recordings were made. Just my take as a not very die hard Police fan but someone who watched the whole interview.

 

[damianerskine]

As a contrast, I think that Damian Erskine, Steve Bailey, the late/great Charlie Hayden and others show that you can be famous and still be a decent human being.

This just made my day!

honored to be thought of here. Thank you!

 

[sean_on_bass]

I agree. I was wondering if I saw the same interview as everyone else here.

Sting acknowledged several times that Andy's and Stuart's contributions helped complete the Police's sound.

Sting downplayed his theory knowledge and jazz background, choosing rather to focus on surprise and adventure in songwriting. But when pressed by Rick, he conceded that he has had some jazz training.

Sting clearly stated that The Police had achieved all that they could, and that it was time to go in a new direction. As Beato pointed out, they were one of only a few bands to retire on top.

I've seen a bit of his egotism and arrogance in older interviews, but none here. I sense that most posters here are reacting to the Sting they think they know - not the one in this interview.

Same impression, i think he was just trying to honestly answer the questions and talk about the experiences.

 

[Johnny StingRay]

What genius isn't temperamental? They are always in another plane of existence than the rest of us worm food. Maybe they get tired of trying to explain why they do what they do and just come to the conclusion "Hey, if you don't get it, then you just don't understand and you never will, so I'm not going spend the time and energy trying to explain it to you."

 

[tb-player]

I thought the interview was good and I did not get the impression that there was any jerky-ness and ego going on. He complimented both Stewart and Andy and acknowledged their contribution to how the songs came out. But, he was the main songwriter and wrote the best songs, so maybe that can get interpreted as ego but it's just the truth.

So, to the OP's original question: no, I didn't notice that Sting diminished the contributions of Stewart and Andy to the band.

Have you ever seen interviews with Stewart Copland? It sounds like just about everything out of his mouth is BS! I'd have a hard time getting along with him as well! He's a great drummer though. I am sure the tensions in the band played a part in how those songs came out.

I recently watched the drum documentary "Count Me In" on Netflix. Stewart Copeland is brash with every.single.word. Something tells me Sting wasn't the only source of any problems between the two of them.

 

[Fialka]

I didnt watch the whole interview yet but it was very informative and he seems like a decent guy to me. No one si perfect, even music gods are common people with flaws.

 

[bmusic]

Then why were the Police records so much greater than his solo ones?

I should probably read the rest of the thread before I jump in to answer this, but dang it, it's a rainy California morning and I'm feelin sparky...

1) The premise at the core of your question is debatable in and of itself. I happen to love "Nothing Like the Sun" and "Brand New Day", and I think there are probably metrics by which one could argue the post-police music is more sophisticated, richer.

2) But it was the Police who inspired me in my teens/twenties, and "Walking on the Moon" was the first time I ever consciously thought "Whoa, cool bass line." Heck, it was probably the first time I learned the phrase "bass line" (thank you, music major roommate). You can bet your sweet patootie it was the first thing I ever played when I finally picked up a bass. And, to get to the point...

3) Sometimes the tension in a band—creative or personal—makes for good music. If Stewart refused to drum exactly the way Sting wanted him to—regardless of whether or not Sting is an all-knowing musical genius—it may create tension, a not-quite-comfortable clash of vibes that crackles with energy and excitement. On Sting's solo material (at least to a degree), everybody is hand-picked to play the way Sting wants. Which isn't to say Branford or Vinnie are mindless drones, but they have been enlisted because their musical choices are by and large in line with Sting's vision, and when push comes to shove, no one is going to push or shove him because he's the boss. With the Police, there must have been compromises.

4) I just think younger people make more interesting music. Not a hard-and-fast rule, but...no wait, it is a hard-and fast rule. I may like "Rising Sand" more than any Zeppelin record, but "Rising Sand" is not inspiring a mighty generation of kids to pick up the guitar, take drugs and have sex. Young people's music is energized by rule breaking and beautiful moments of discovery born of blind searching in the darkness of untrained exploration. "Automatic for the People"? Blech. Give me "Murmur" (or anything before "Green", really). Even bands like U2 or Radiohead that (for me) took a couple records to really distill their thing into its purest form...they peak and then fade. (Radiohead have enjoyed a nice creative plateau, actually, but I can't believe they have another "In Rainbows" in them.)

5) Okay, I thought of a treasured exception: Tom Waits. But that's only because he sort of became a different creature when his voice changed, so everything from "Heart Attack and Vine" onward is a separate artist.

Alrighty, I'm out of fuel now. Really, I'm just trying to put off actually watching the Beato/Sting interview as long as I can. I leave you with the immortal words of one John Winston Lennon:

You have to be a bastard to make it, and that's a fact. And the Beatles are the biggest bastards on earth.

 

[Doctor Intrepid]

I didn't find anything problematic with the content of what he said, but I do think his accent is posh and that throws some folks off.

 

[P. Aaron]

In the business world, entertainment being no exception, time is everything. From business execs to musicians, it's about showing value within minutes if not seconds. I learned this in 20 years selling real estate. The biggest agents/producers had little time for small talk, casual chat or the hang. I envied their ability to cooly if not coldly, evaluate almost every aspect of their working hours.

Ditto my oncologist and orthopedic surgeon.

They may be fine on vacation but conducting business at a high level, like entertainment is a developed personality trait. Oftentimes off putting to those who know a person only through their product. These very same people demonstrate paths to success which at a very high level means, judging everything in front of them quickly, harshly and without regard to what others think. It's business. Just because one buys their record or saw them in concert doesn't mean they owe you anything. If you won a backstage meet & greet, don't expect more than a few minutes, if that. Our time, and our health is all we have. I wish I'd learned those lessons much earlier in life.

FWIW, I watched the same interview. Sting didn't need to do the Beato interview. I'm glad he did as I learned a few things. Beato produces interesting content that I find useful. I'd have absolutely no expectations from either person if I found myself in an elevator with either of them. Would likely say "thanks" for many moments of music and even then, their minds are likely elsewhere.

I'm sure many of you have seen the Rick Beato interview with Sting and his guitarist, Dominic Miller. It was a fascinating look into songwriting, basslines, and (inadvertently) one gargantuan ego.

It was a great conversation. But when Rick began to discuss the other members of The Police (Stewart Copeland and Andy Summers), Sting stepped in and essentially gave himself credit for their contributions to the band.

At some points it was subtle. Others, not so much. But I found it to be very off-putting that one of my all-time favorite musicians showed so little humility in dealing with his bandmates.

Did anyone else notice that?

 

[-Asdfgh-]

"Automatic for the People"? Blech. Give me "Murmur" (or anything before "Green", really).

I am fine with Green, then Monster and then.. nothing. I'd agree on Murmur. Plant's done a lot of good stuff recently, though, in the sense it's all been good, not necessarily copious in its volume.

 

[-Asdfgh-]

What genius isn't temperamental?

What's the definition of genius? If it's high IQ, then there doesn't seem to be any particular pattern I've encountered.

 

[-Asdfgh-]

Maybe that's necesary as the songs he sings have gotten more complex.

Might also be arthritis, who knows.

 

[-Asdfgh-]

Watching the video, finally. I am impressed Beato got him there in person. I wasn't expecting that.

I don't understand the suggestion that he sounds posh. My grandfather was from Sting's neck of the woods and still had the accent. Sting's obviously lost any Geordie accent he might have had in large part, but there's still a Geordie lilt in there and it's just a generic English accent other than that, not at all posh. His pronounciation of words like colour and some is definitely more working class than posh.

 

[Mantis Tobaggan]

Man, I skipped to the end of this thread hoping the Beato criticisms would have increased! That would be a worthy read!

He seems to have made a living as a musician and/or producer and/or teacher but I am not sure. He definitely has a lot of gear. There is another guy called Tone King that owns a ludicrous amount of gear. They just seem to enjoy gear and playing. Youtube is a funny place.

 

[Peter_Drake]

I didnt watch the whole interview yet but it was very informative and he seems like a decent guy to me. No one si perfect, even music gods are common people with flaws.

I agree. In his youth he was probably very over confident and so on. As he has mellowed he has become much more agreeable. He might seem blunt to some, but that is just his manner

 

[Sixgunn]

@tb-player you have evidently never met or heard Andy or Stewart talk about their contributions to the Police, or listened to any of their songs.
While Andy and Stewart are both brilliant musicians in their own rights it was Sting that wrote and sang the songs and has been successful in several areas since the Police. Andy and Stewart not so much.

Ol' Stew's done pretty well for himself in the movie and video game soundtrack biz .

 

[Johnny StingRay]

What's the definition of genius? If it's high IQ, then there doesn't seem to be any particular pattern I've encountered.

You are confusing IQ with genius. Those who are considered "genius" seem to be in another plane of consciousness in which they perceive ideas, not obvious to others, in a very clear understanding and use that knowledge to the betterment of humankind. I've met high IQ individuals who were completely unable to develop any kind of original idea. They were just good at following the established "rules" to their advantage. Also, trivia experts are considered high IQ. I just think they are good at remembering a bunch of worthless crap. Can they use their knowledge to create something new? Geniuses are just on a higher plane of consciousness then most of us.

What's the definition of genius? If it's high IQ, then there doesn't seem to be any particular pattern I've encountered.