Why I lost a bit of respect for Sting (Rick Beato Interview)

[smeet]

Sting is really super arrogant, but arrogance is a function of knowing you're really good at something. I suppose that's what you get when you wrote the most played track on radio, worldwide, since radio began - "Every Breath You Take".

If I'd written that, I too would probably be an insufferable a**hole, and I doubt that I would even care about anybody else's opinion. The man is a genius, with a talent for that elusive hook and groove, who wrote or co-wrote some of the most memorable moments of the soundtrack to an entire decade, and at least he's stayed faithful to his wife for 30 years. Now do Clapton.

He's an elite musician AND song writer, and he knows it. I don't see anything wrong with that. Learning to love yourself is an essential part of living a happy and peaceful life.

Sting is a rare talent. No other group has ever sounded anything like the Police. Pretty unheard of in the cookie cutter business of pop music. Arrogant? Maybe, but it doesn't detract from his music.

Clapton… I've never been impressed by his playing, I feel I've played with several guitarists that are better. He has once again revealed himself to be a reprehensible human, but that's no great loss for music as far as I'm concerned. Van Morrison on the other hand saddens me.

 

[-Asdfgh-]

Sting is a rare talent. No other group has ever sounded anything like the Police.

There were some not so far away from The Police, but few as capable of the same pinnacles of greatness whilst still being as potentially cerebral. Some of the bands that also straddled ska and punk for a while and later fell apart and reformed did later do some great stuff. Whilst Sting has not always been my cup of tea (I've aged, I am likely on the back of this thread to listen to some of his back catalogue and may make some purchases), he's actually one of the survivors from that late 1970s/early 1980s scene that has probably produced the best overall arc of work over that 40 years. I might namecheck contemporaries such as Terry Hall as another genius, citing work such as Colourfield, but it was all quite brief, and much as I like Hall, I wouldn't say that he's been as successful as Sting.

Other artists from that same period and the ska/punk crossover have also kept creating, but haven't necessarily become both as diverse and creatively complete. There have been others from that period but not that genre who have kept putting out good material, though.

One sad note is that Ranking Roger, late of Police contemporaries and co-tourers The (English) Beat kept that flame alive and eventually produced a new and pretty good album, in the same genre, but sadly died very shortly after.

All being said, I don't listen to entire The Police albums any more as there's a fair chunk of filler. I do still listen to entire The Beat albums bar a few tracks here and there (I don't think I've listened to more than 3 seconds of I Confess for about 20 years, possibly more) as whilst the heights may not be quite as high, they are a lot more consistent IMHO. I'd argue that Mirror in The Bathroom is just as good as something like Roxanne, though, quite possibly better.

In the end, it's not battle of the bands, though, and everyone has their favourites based on not only any sort of objective musical quality, but also context within their lives. YMMV, etc.

 

[-Asdfgh-]

Clapton… I've never been impressed by his playing, I feel I've played with several guitarists that are better.

I like Cream, but I am not sure if that's due to Clapton as opposed to the band as a whole. I've played with or known musicians that probably put a lot of famous acts to shame - we probably all have. I've never personally met a drummer I thought got anywhere near Stewart Copeland, though.

 

[friskinator]

I didn't find Sting irritating either.

Rick thinks everyone should be into modes as much as he is.

Sting's singing is great in all of the recent concert footage I've seen. He clearly wasn't prepared to do a proper performance during this interview.

Nothing sucks the soul out of enjoying pop music more than someone wanting to discuss modes, scales, etc. Most modern songwriters aren't thinking about those things when they're writing, and if an outsider was analyzing my songs like a math problem, I wouldn't want to be involved.

 

[J_Bass]

It's like dissecting a poem.

 

[-Asdfgh-]

It's like dissecting a poem.

People seem to love to do that too. I only care if it rhymes properly .

 

[buldog5151bass]

Nothing sucks the soul out of enjoying pop music more than someone wanting to discuss modes, scales, etc. Most modern songwriters aren't thinking about those things when they're writing, and an outsider was analyzing my songs like a math problem, I wouldn't want to be involved.

I don't agree. That's a way a lot of people learn.

 

[frankie5string]

I don't agree. That's a way a lot of people learn.

...and yet, with all of that "learnin'" Beato attempts to create, he still can't really do what any of those award winning musicians do, nor can most of the folks who watch his Youtube videos where they've supposedly "learned" everything about what makes a pop song technically great (in his mind). His real music business credits appear to be quite thin, with the exception of some teaching work.

Beato is kind-of like Steve Hoffman... Much braying, with a bit more real knowledge and a desire to maximize return on a Youtube channel instead of a forum with a bunch of sycophants (ala Hoffman) ...

 

[LBS-bass]

...and yet, with all of that "learnin'" Beato attempts to create, he still can't really do what any of those award winning musicians do, nor can most of the folks who watch his Youtube videos where they've supposedly "learned" everything about what makes a pop song technically great (in his mind). His real music business credits appear to be quite thin, with the exception of some teaching work.

Beato is kind-of like Steve Hoffman... Much braying, with a bit more real knowledge and a desire to maximize return on a Youtube channel instead of a forum with a bunch of sycophants (ala Hoffman) ...

Theory exists to describe what musicians do when they create music. It is not the other way around, but there are a lot of would-be creators who would love to think that if they learn enough theory they'll somehow become more creative.

 

[buldog5151bass]

...and yet, with all of that "learnin'" Beato attempts to create, he still can't really do what any of those award winning musicians do, nor can most of the folks who watch his Youtube videos where they've supposedly "learned" everything about what makes a pop song technically great (in his mind). His real music business credits appear to be quite thin, with the exception of some teaching work.

Beato is kind-of like Steve Hoffman... Much braying, with a bit more real knowledge and a desire to maximize return on a Youtube channel instead of a forum with a bunch of sycophants (ala Hoffman) ...

Listen to someone like Ron Carter or Anthony Jackson talk about music. Tell me THEY can't play.

 

[frankie5string]

Theory exists to describe what musicians do when they create music. It is not the other way around, but there are a lot of would-be creators who would love to think that if they learn enough theory they'll somehow become more creative.

Yes, but not when he's also using it to explain why most modern music, if not performed by Adele, is essentially substandard to the music he grew up with. It turns into a bit of a farce.

 

[LBS-bass]

Yes, but not when he's also using it to explain why most modern music, if not performed by Adele, is essentially substandard to the music he grew up with. It turns into a bit of a farce.

I am not arguing with you.

 

[LBS-bass]

Listen to someone like Ron Carter or Anthony Jackson talk about music. Tell me THEY can't play.

Being able to play isn't what we're discussing.

 

[frankie5string]

Listen to someone like Ron Carter or Anthony Jackson talk about music. Tell me THEY can't play.

Absolutely... and Ron Carter does/did have an online presence that kind-of took off during the pandemic. He had lots of interesting interviews. The production value was relatively poor but the content was really interesting. Some incredible stories there and of course reams of teaching material.

Anthony is interesting. He can sound quite aloof and he's very philosophical when he talks about music and his journey - but I really doubt he'd make a Youtube channel to do it over and over again. I mean, it took him 40 years to put out a solo album and even then, someone he really admired had to commit to working on it with him...

Overall both of them are WAY too busy to do what Beato is trying to do.

 

[tb-player]

Link Removed

 

[Tom Bomb]

Ahhh! The poetry.

When good poesy comes up,
Good poesy goes down,
Page after page,
And everywhere between.

Is it the poesy,
That takes our Geordie Gordie,
Beyond the boom and bustle?

That's the Sting in the tale.​

Enter the Rudyard coupling —

I KEEP six honest serving-men
(They taught me all I knew);
Their names are What and Why and When
And How and Where and Who.
I send them over land and sea,
I send them east and west;
But after they have worked for me,
I give them all a rest. …

​

For the journaler
The brother is the What.

For the S(t)inger (poetic),
The lover is not.

She bears down on the bit, thinking,
"How do the big boys do it?"

Jester coupler thoughts . . .

(poetic)

​

 

[lordofthebass]

I just hope he takes full credit for this...

dude what are you talking about this is a total jam

wish it was longer

 

[jmattbassplaya]

I'm a huge fan of The Police and throughly enjoyed the interview. To answer the OP's question, I don't think Sting shafted Copeland or Summers when discussing his work with them. In fact, I thought he seemed to really acknowledge and respect their contributions to making the group sound and perform at the level that they did and for giving him the chance to move on to different things within the music sphere.

I might be an outlier and perhaps it's due to my age and me not being alive when The Police were in their heyday, but Sting has never come across as incredibly pompous to me considering the amount of vitriol he receives. He is certainly self assured, confident, and doesn't mind acknowledging is accomplishments or contributions, and I don't consider that to be heinous thing. This interview was no exception. He was perhaps reserved at first, but I'd imagine most people who have operated at his level for as long as he has would be too. Once he opened up there were some great nuggets of information that I learned that I hadn't heard before.

As for Beato - he is brash but he creates great content. I appreciate his contributions to the musical world. I guess to summarize or TL;DR my post - people are allowed to be who they are. Neither Sting or Beato are hurting anyone, and I would personally argue that they do quite the opposite with what they produce and provide to the world. To that I say, good for them.

To quote String, I think this thread has sincerely been, "good discussion."

 

[friskinator]

...and yet, with all of that "learnin'" Beato attempts to create, he still can't really do what any of those award winning musicians do, nor can most of the folks who watch his Youtube videos where they've supposedly "learned" everything about what makes a pop song technically great (in his mind). His real music business credits appear to be quite thin, with the exception of some teaching work.

Beato is kind-of like Steve Hoffman... Much braying, with a bit more real knowledge and a desire to maximize return on a Youtube channel instead of a forum with a bunch of sycophants (ala Hoffman) ...

In the early 2000s, my band worked with Beato on a demo. Our manager urged us to do it, saying he was almost guaranteed to get us a deal based on his connections. We did 3 or 4 songs with him, and to be honest, I wasn't impressed. We'd worked with several producers at that point, and in my opinion, he didn't do anything special with the songs at all. And he wasn't the easiest guy to work with.

We (and our management) never heard from him again after we left the studio.

 

[JimK]

People seem to love to do that too. I only care if it rhymes properly .

Some of the "best" poetry...does not rhyme.