Why you shouldn't pay in full upfront for a custom build

[MultiScaleMale]

Wisdom would include avoiding all luthiers who don't have a well established build history. So, how do up-and-coming artists get their start? The majority are not shady. It isn't fair that all be judged by bad apples such as Darrin Huff.

You asked about Darrin Huff -- he was in the above category. He'd built a custom EB3 style bass for Mike Watt, a few other customs, but only a half-dozen of his unique designs. That design appealed to me, so I conversed with him via email, also by phone a couple of times. I also reached out to other customers who gave glowing reviews of Darrin and his instruments. Despite this due diligence I knew I was taking a chance, but felt that there was no more I could do.

The full story is here, but it's 252 pages long. To sum up: around 20 of us are still waiting for basses that were ordered as long as 20 years ago (20th anniversary of my order will be this April).




USA does too. I live on the east coast of the USA, Darrin Huff lives on the west coast. Would not have been worth my while to take him on out there. Besides, even if his customers did take him on and win -- the very best case scenario -- we would not have been made whole (repaid in full): he would have had to liquidate his meager assets and we would only have received a small fraction of what we'd given him up front. I don't see how that would be different anywhere else.

And statute of limitations comes into play and will vary by state. The legal system really only exists to help mega-corporations.

 

[Hawk256]

In my country, we have what it's called "small claims court". Created to give celerity to certain cases. No recourses, court will give a veredict under 30 days period. Plus, there's a clause called "obligation to do", and once signed by the hired company/firm/shop, you can't run away.

We have the same in the US and the case I'm referring to was a small claims case. The guy won his case but hasn't been paid. The local sheriff is unable/unwilling to do anything because his assets are in his wifes name. When you start involving LLCs and the such, personal assets could be untouchable and if the business has no assets, what are you going to get? Can't squeeze blood out of a turnip.

 

[Jason Bonilla]

the builder i'm working with laid out the plan as follows. pay 50% as deposit, when the bass is ready for applying finish and electronics, pay the other 25%, and pay the last 25% on completion, and I agreed to those terms.

BUT I decided to pay triple the price of the bass upfront in hopes that they'd hurry up and put up a plaque with my name on it in the work shop. Kidding of course, but seriously, I don't know how someone would WANT to pay upfront for a build, I already feel strange paying half of a bass I wont see till months/years after. Of course, I understand the reason for deposits and am not disagreeing with them, but shoot ANYTHING could happen between you placing the order and the build being completed that are beyond you or the builders control. Why take that risk with your money?

 

[N. Kentucky Bass]

You must never have had an instrument order go bad. Do you seriously believe that the contract will protect you?

Contract is worthless if the builder is in the hospital or dead.

 

[Hawk256]

My current custom build was set up for 25% up front, 25% after the rough in process and the final 50% upon delivery. It's only been a couple of weeks so I'm still at step one.

 

[J.Wolf]

If you think small claims court is a viable resource to recoup your losses on a $3000 custom build gone south, You are dreaming. There has been much discussion about these things here and elsewhere

 

[J.Wolf]

I suppose you could pay a lawyer a couple thousand dollars to help you recoup your $3000, if that seems like a good option

 

[FRoss6788]

Never pay in full upfront. Never.

Would you pay a contractor in full upfront for a kitchen remodel or an addition?

 

[BBQisgood]

Funny how basic common sense generates multiple pages of conversation.

 

[MAJOR METAL]

Also, if you pay in full and the luthier dies.......

 

[J.Wolf]

Funny how basic common sense generates multiple pages of conversation.

common, yes. Universally applied? apparently not. And usually because people erroneously assume it's gonna get a better bass in their hands quicker. Or because they have the money now and are afraid they wont when the time comes (which interestingly is an even better reason to not do it).

 

[BBQisgood]

common, yes. Universally applied? apparently not. And usually because people erroneously assume it's gonna get a better bass in their hands quicker. Or because they have the money now and are afraid they wont when the time comes (which interestingly is an even better reason to not do it).

I’m right there with you man.

I can’t fathom how some folks operate. But, then again, maybe I’ve got lots of things wrong myself.

 

[P. Aaron]

More than one, I’m referring to a handful of small builders who do really amazing work but struggle with the delivery aspect

Incentives matter. Pay 'em to start, and the rest when they're done.

 

[ac100X]

There's a big difference between "I ordered a bass from Z and A, B, and C happened," and "I heard someone ordered a bass from Z and A, B, and C happened." And I believe you are, rightly and correctly, addressing that difference.

And this thread is a good reminder - once you've paid in full there is no financial incentive for the work to be finished. Not just ordering a bass, but in a lot of situations in life. If circumstances remove other incentives to finish from the equation you can be left with an empty wallet and empty hands - sometimes with no path forward.

This is the general rule of thumb for dealing with residential remodeling contractors.