Winter Build Off 2019 - Kubickenbacker

[rojo412]

It's been a busy week for NOT doing bass work. But I got back to it yesterday.

The plan was, prep the neck and body for threaded inserts. I had 5/16-18 inserts ready to go... but I couldn't find the bolts I wanted in that size. All I could find was 1/4-20, which isn't too shabby, so I went with those instead.
The process of meticulously measuring and finding the proper center areas for the holes was cruelly destroyed by a drill bit that decided to cut off center.

In lieu of my options of plugging the holes or going with larger inserts, and prompted by a rave review of a bass that was partially crafted with the help of @Bruce Johnson (a Singleton), I decided it was time to try the BruceBar method.
I have the brass, I have the tools, so it was just time to test it out.

Although in fairness, this is not quite what he has shown in the past, as the bars are mounted in the body, not the neck. And I wasn't sure if they needed to go parallel to the string path or not. But my goal was, securely mount brass bars in the body, then mount the neck to that with machine screws.

Unfortunately, I don't have process pics of that, but I cut each bar to 3/8" thick, countersunk the body screw holes for hefty screws (which I customized a little so they wouldn't protrude through the top), excavated the body for the brass, mounted the bars, plotted for the neck bolts, tapped and threaded those, and then remounted all of it, embedded in West epoxy. I let it cure overnight and did my best to clean it all up today...

A test fit of the neck reveals maybe the strongest bolt on neck joint I've ever done.

My initial plan was to countersink these bolts, but they are a size of forstner bit that I don't have (just a hair bigger than 5/8", much smaller than 3/4"), so they may stay like this. The point is, they are hex head and the neck mount is secure on there. Each bolt has a stainless washer below it and you can really crank it down.

With the success of that, my next plan is to do a plate under the bridge as well, because I know that is part of the process of Brucification.
There will need to be a plate at the headstock where the strings will go through it, so they can rest on metal when under tension, not wood. But I feel like I really should get the bridge in order so as to make sure all of my theoretical hole drilling will properly jive.
Then there's the matter of the bottle opener, making the string clamping system, as well as the Drop A mechanism. All kinds of fun!
Good thing is, I really enjoyed my first foray into metal craft with those bars. I feel like brass is a fun material to work with, easy enough to shape by hand, and strong enough to do any threading I'd need.

 

[rojo412]

I did this yesterday, too...

The grain is pretty intense, it does kinda hurt to make this a solid color...

Just waiting for the bridge to arrive to do the full-on contour of the body. I wanted to make sure that was totally proper before carving out the swoop.

 

[ctmullins]

Wow, I can totally get behind that.

 

[Jisch]

very nice

 

[Five String]

The design is sort of a bolt-on neck through. Looks cool.

 

[ArtGuy9516]

I’d stain it so as not to loose that nice grain.

 

[rojo412]

It's been too long since I updated, so I just gotta bump this with any developments.
Mostly, it's just been cases of "life gets in the way." Clogged drains, broken disposal, side work to pay bills. But I am really wanting to get back to this.

- I ordered the bridge a week ago, but Hipshot hasn't given me any info yet. Not sure why, they are usually very fast. No invoice, no tracking, no response. Kinda worried.
But I need that here to start the full contour of the body.

- The color has to be white of some sort. Believe me, I look at the grain and dream of some kind of trans color, but the plan was to capture that 80s vibe from both companies and white does it, especially with the black hardware.
Question is, what white?
Stark, snow white has that "80s, cocaine" vibe.
Slightly off white gives it the aged feel and keeps it true to form.
But the banana creme white is a really nice color, too. I've always loved that.
So I'm still debating on this one.

- The drop mechanism idea is both fun and challenging for being unnecessary, as well as completely annoying for being unnecessary. It's true to the Kubicki form, and it does challenge all of my problem solving.
But it's not easy to find strings that do 37+" scale, the mech would end up in a weird spot, the added need for a separate string anchor area is kinda hard, and honestly... who needs a drop A? Plus, I'd have to build my own Just-A-Nut style single nut for it, to adapt for string tapers in that area.
So I'm thinking really hard about that. If I abandon it, the bass is much easier to do. But I didn't pick these two companies and hope for an easy solution.

- One of the oddly challenging things to find in this build has been the pickup screws. I wanted to do allen head machine screws and threaded inserts for PU height, but finding the sizes of both locally has been tough.
They are either M3 or M4, #3 or 4-40 possibly. Good luck finding that at Ace Hardware!
I did, however, find pretty much all of the other allen head screws I've needed so far.

After I finish my coffee, it's time to work on bass stuff, that's for sure.
Good job to everyone out there building, too. You guys always inspire me.

 

[Jon Clegg]

It's been too long since I updated, so I just gotta bump this with any developments.
Mostly, it's just been cases of "life gets in the way." Clogged drains, broken disposal, side work to pay bills. But I am really wanting to get back to this.

- I ordered the bridge a week ago, but Hipshot hasn't given me any info yet. Not sure why, they are usually very fast. No invoice, no tracking, no response. Kinda worried.
But I need that here to start the full contour of the body.

- The color has to be white of some sort. Believe me, I look at the grain and dream of some kind of trans color, but the plan was to capture that 80s vibe from both companies and white does it, especially with the black hardware.
Question is, what white?
Stark, snow white has that "80s, cocaine" vibe.
Slightly off white gives it the aged feel and keeps it true to form.
But the banana creme white is a really nice color, too. I've always loved that.
So I'm still debating on this one.

- The drop mechanism idea is both fun and challenging for being unnecessary, as well as completely annoying for being unnecessary. It's true to the Kubicki form, and it does challenge all of my problem solving.
But it's not easy to find strings that do 37+" scale, the mech would end up in a weird spot, the added need for a separate string anchor area is kinda hard, and honestly... who needs a drop A? Plus, I'd have to build my own Just-A-Nut style single nut for it, to adapt for string tapers in that area.
So I'm thinking really hard about that. If I abandon it, the bass is much easier to do. But I didn't pick these two companies and hope for an easy solution.

- One of the oddly challenging things to find in this build has been the pickup screws. I wanted to do allen head machine screws and threaded inserts for PU height, but finding the sizes of both locally has been tough.
They are either M3 or M4, #3 or 4-40 possibly. Good luck finding that at Ace Hardware!
I did, however, find pretty much all of the other allen head screws I've needed so far.

After I finish my coffee, it's time to work on bass stuff, that's for sure.
Good job to everyone out there building, too. You guys always inspire me.

Bolt depot may be your answer

 

[Gilmourisgod]

I’d suggest a used D-Tuner Lever Steinberger bridge, which simplifies the headstock issues, but they are $$$$, and you already ordered the Hipshot. The extra frets and clamp on the Kubicki are a brilliant design fixture. Now that they are in production again, would Kubicki sell you a string set? I hear you on Shop Withdrawl, haven’t been able to touch my build for 2 weeks.

 

[Matt Liebenau]

Odd bolts like that may require a trip to an industrial hardware place. Locally we have Marshall's. [Invalid or Expired Link Removed] There must be something similar near you. Or, time for a tiptoe through the interwebs.

 

[ctmullins]

I’d suggest a used D-Tuner Lever Steinberger bridge, which simplifies the headstock issues, but they are $$$$, and you already ordered the Hipshot.

The Steinberger D-lever bridge is wicked cool, but (AFAIK) was never produced in a five-string version...

 

[Jon Clegg]

I've bought oddball screws from these guys: Invalid Link Removed fast delivery as I recall.

Shame about the drop-A; I was looking forward to it for the sheer absurdity 'factor'

 

[rojo412]

Yeah, the issue here is the 5er factor (no pun intended). The drop mech in the Steinie bridge isn't bad, but I could come up with other ways.
What I did see is that fanned-fret string sets may be ideal for this. But the Super Long set from D'Addario works up to a 38" scale B string.

And don't get me wrong @Jon Clegg, the idea is still there. I'm just rasslin' with it in my head.
If it works and well, it's a really cool feature to see. It's not super useful for most folks who aren't in a sludge metal band that drones a low A for most of a song, but it's cool.
And if I did the new hipster 5 string move of E-C, it would be a functional drop D.
But my big fear is that I'll do this and the mech won't hold the string well enough, or something like that which causes badness in the sound and function of the most utilized string on the bass.

One thing I just thought of while in the bathroom (aka, my thinking place) was making the drop mech area also able to hold a string. In other words, if I wanted to make the drop mech an optional feature, I could remove that and clamp a string through that hole.
And another thing I thought of just now was making that dual purpose hole able to lock the drop mech OR a string, so if it is something that doesn't hold well enough, it could be mechanically locked down with the string clamp bolt.

We have Fastenal and there's also McMaster Carr (which is about an hour from here), so I'm not SOL for now. I was just hoping to find something in person. I could find these and order about $2 worth of parts, but it's probably $6 to ship them.
Then again, I could make threaded inserts for the body. A couple of pieces of aluminum or brass, screwed below the pickups, then tapped and threaded for the screws, that's not hard.

 

[rojo412]

Okay, I did some actual work today!
Task at hand: Metal plate in the head for strings to rest on when going through the headstock
The plate was made from this piece of a Mercedes Benz audio component that I found in the scrap bin of an auto shop I used to work next to. I snagged it years ago, but never did anything productive with it until now.

While I'm fairly sure the wood could handle the break angle, I was just not 100% comfy with that. So I plotted out an area below the fretboard and behind the nut which could house an aluminum plate.
Using my old, small bandsaw with a fine blade, as well as my belt sander, I made a plate to fit the area. I then traced that and cut an inlay rout by hand so it could fit in.

Then I put it into a warm bath of epoxy, so it wouldn't rattle or move in the future:

When that's dry tomorrow, I'll sand it level and possibly drill and tap it for some components. Not positive on that, but I did need the plate for the strings, so it's in place for that at very least.
When the fretboard is in place, I'll be able to drill the string holes, then chamfer the aluminum and wood to properly brace against string tension.

And this is unrelated, but another pic I took. For the first time, I did a support piece above the truss nut and it came out nice.

I'm gonna let the fretboard overhang just a little, so as to give this a "visor", keeping it slightly hidden but readily adjusted when need be.
The body was also cut for access, but I forgot the pic. It did make contact with one of the screws for the BruceBar, but it's not a problem.

 

[rojo412]

Just stuck in a holding pattern for the moment. I wish I had more to report, but still no word from Hipshot. I'm seriously worried about them. It's not bizarre for a one-off pickup maker to just stop talking to people, that happens all the time (unfortunately). But a world renowned and successful hardware maker... that's very odd. I mean, if it's a backorder thing or they have to make these one at a time, I get that. Just let me know. But I've contacted them twice, 2 different people, and nada.

The drop mech, I've stood at the bench looking at the parts and just thinking. There may be an answer, I'm working that out on paper now. I found springs, I have some theories, so it's in the works.
But I'd really like to have that bridge and the strings in place to properly plan all of the holes.

Same for the string clamp. I have the whole design plotted, I think I know where it will work best, but would really like the parts to finalize that. And the inlays, as well.

As for color, I saw in the WB finish thread that a new Varathane was out there, which is proving successful. Tinting it with milk paint seems to be a good trick, so I'm going to experiment with that as soon as I can get everything properly shaped and ready for finish.
My BBFF @rogerbmiller just sent me some detailed pics of a Kubicki for contour dimensions, so that is friggin' sweet. I'm excited to carve this body.

For now though... time to get a new washing machine.

 

[Haroldo]

Just stuck in a holding pattern for the moment. I wish I had more to report, but still no word from Hipshot. I'm seriously worried about them. It's not bizarre for a one-off pickup maker to just stop talking to people, that happens all the time (unfortunately). But a world renowned and successful hardware maker... that's very odd. I mean, if it's a backorder thing or they have to make these one at a time, I get that. Just let me know. But I've contacted them twice, 2 different people, and nada.

The drop mech, I've stood at the bench looking at the parts and just thinking. There may be an answer, I'm working that out on paper now. I found springs, I have some theories, so it's in the works.
But I'd really like to have that bridge and the strings in place to properly plan all of the holes.

Same for the string clamp. I have the whole design plotted, I think I know where it will work best, but would really like the parts to finalize that. And the inlays, as well.

As for color, I saw in the WB finish thread that a new Varathane was out there, which is proving successful. Tinting it with milk paint seems to be a good trick, so I'm going to experiment with that as soon as I can get everything properly shaped and ready for finish.
My BBFF @rogerbmiller just sent me some detailed pics of a Kubicki for contour dimensions, so that is friggin' sweet. I'm excited to carve this body.

For now though... time to get a new washing machine.

Good luck with the washing machine. And I agree, Hipshot's behavior is so un-Hipshot like.

 

[rojo412]

Washing machine: DONE! Just a drive to the in-laws, then some rasslin' with a large appliance and my new (used) washing machine is in. She ain't purdy, but she won't leak like the other one. And it was basically free.

Back to bass now.

 

[ctmullins]

Well, you didn’t get a top-loading bridge, but you did get a top-loading washer.

 

[rojo412]

Patience was rewarded!

I can finally start getting this moving at a reasonable pace (assuming life stops getting in the way, dad gummit!). Not that I couldn't make it happen with just measurements, but I like to be able to move things around for real.
Of course, now I need to order the strings, should have done that a while back. OOPS! Ah well, this is gonna keep me plenty busy.

The debate now becomes, do I mount this flat, then bevel the body around it?
Or do I bevel the body, then mount this slanted on the bevel?

- If I do the flat mount, it's theoretically easier for the bridge to be added. I can easily use a router for the metal block install on a flat surface, as well as doing the cove cut for the tuner access. But then I have a ledge that needs to be carved around for the body contour.

- If I do the slanted bevel mount, I need to make sure everything is perfectly cut. I'd have to pre-cut the tuner cove (for best results), then cut the body at a perfect line, make sure it's all straight. For the inlaid block, I'd need to make an interesting jig to cut it flat at that angle. And I'd also need to make sure that the bridge mount area either keeps a crisp edge or just make an inlay area for it to sit in.

Time to stare at it for a while and see what happens. But seeing as the theme of this build is "overcomplicated," pretty sure the answer is to mount this on the bevel.

 

[Slidlow]

Patience was rewarded!

View attachment 3323868
I can finally start getting this moving at a reasonable pace (assuming life stops getting in the way, dad gummit!). Not that I couldn't make it happen with just measurements, but I like to be able to move things around for real.
Of course, now I need to order the strings, should have done that a while back. OOPS! Ah well, this is gonna keep me plenty busy.

View attachment 3323867
The debate now becomes, do I mount this flat, then bevel the body around it?
Or do I bevel the body, then mount this slanted on the bevel?

- If I do the flat mount, it's theoretically easier for the bridge to be added. I can easily use a router for the metal block install on a flat surface, as well as doing the cove cut for the tuner access. But then I have a ledge that needs to be carved around for the body contour.

- If I do the slanted bevel mount, I need to make sure everything is perfectly cut. I'd have to pre-cut the tuner cove (for best results), then cut the body at a perfect line, make sure it's all straight. For the inlaid block, I'd need to make an interesting jig to cut it flat at that angle. And I'd also need to make sure that the bridge mount area either keeps a crisp edge or just make an inlay area for it to sit in.

Time to stare at it for a while and see what happens. But seeing as the theme of this build is "overcomplicated," pretty sure the answer is to mount this on the bevel.

Looks like that bridge is designed to be mounted flat.