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Wood Matters Club!!!

How many of you could be sitting in your car on a given day and you hear a song come on the radio? You're grooving to the bass line and you say to yourself, without a doubt, that guy's bass has a mahogany body and a rosewood fingerboard on a maple neck.

Probably, except for an elite few, most of us would say, "well, it could be a number of things. It's hard to say because I don't know what he's playing through, etc..."

I think this is what Dan's arguement boils down to. Not that wood does not matter, obviously it does. Still, unless I was able to build two identical basses with different woods, such as JohnK did, I personnally would not be able to say definitively how much of a difference the wood makes in the case of each instrument.
 
Balsa is too weak to handle the string tension.

There are lots of reasons besides "tone" that certain woods are commonly used: looks, availability, strength, ease of finishing, etc.

When you say it's too weak to handle the tension, implicit within that statement is that the force from the string being plucked will be transferred into the material itself, rather than staying within the string causing it to vibrate and produce tone. Which is my point; wood strength, density, cell architecture, oil content and etc.. will ALL have an effect on the materials strength, rigidity, vibration absorption and harmonic resonation frequencies.

I don't mind an argument being made that wood is only one factor in determining how a bass sounds. What I mind are carefully worded fallacious statements attacking a very reasonable belief that the primary material an instrument is built out of will effect how it sounds. Build a jazz bass completely out of balsa wood, compare it to a maple/alder jazz bass. We all know they're not going to sound alike at all, no matter how similar they are in all other respects.
 
And another thing: TalkBass is not a good place to argue that subtle differences aren't important. This is where we debate the merits of different 12AX7 tubes in our preamps, endless replacement pickups, and how different brands of nickel roundwound strings sound. Obsessed? Probably, but there must be some truth to our methods or all these different options would never have arisen.
 
Still, unless I was able to build two identical basses with different woods, such as JohnK did, I personnally would not be able to say definitively how much of a difference the wood makes in the case of each instrument.

Seems to me that companies manufacturing the same model of bass using different wood options such as Fender, EBMM, and others have already done that for us.

All one needs to do is go to a music store that carries those instruments and try essentially the same style of bass with the only difference being basically the pieces of wood the hardware, pickups, etc. are attached to demonstrate how different they can sound.

Listening both acoustically and through the same amp may be of value.
 
I'm a firm believer in the Wood Making a Difference in how the bass sounds, looks, feels and plays. Although I'm not a luthier by any stretch I've built a number of basses for myself and friends. In my quest for the perfect bass I did several years of R&D at a substantial investment in money and time.

The first thing I did was find a good playing "mule" that I could carve up and modify as many times as needed to find my favorite pickup and preamp combination. The "mule" was a brand new musicman SUB5 bass. I locked in on pickup styles that I liked best - jazz, pbass and stingray then bought several different brands of each (Bartolini, SD, Delano) and tried various combinations of them installed in the SUB5 Mule with Bartolini, Aguilar, Audere and East preamps. It took about 6 months of nightly testing to work through all the different combos that I was interested in. When I found the combo I liked best (Bartolini Pbass reversed at neck, Bartolini Stingray at bridge position and John East Vol/Pan, Tone, Tone preamp) I locked in those variables and then focused on high mass vs low mass bridges. Quickly settled on the low mass hipshot as the best one for my needs. Then I tested several different brands of each key type of strings - Round Wound, Flat Wound and Tape Wound to see what worked best on this bass. DR Black Beauties came out on top for what I was looking for. By this time about 9 months had transpired and I decided to stick with the Mule in this configuration for another 3 months to see if my tastes would change and to get a really good feel for what if anything else would need to be revised to perfect the build. Three months went by and all was still good so I decided to take my learnings to a final build.

This is when I found out first hand just how much difference wood can make in every aspect of a bass. Lacking some of the finer woodworking tools and experience I decided to go the Warmoth route and spec a body and neck. Some of my top end basses have mahogany bodies and my favorate fb material is rosewood. So I selected a solid one piece mahogany jazz bass 5 body and a solid rosewood neck. When the body came in I routed it for the pickup and preamp combo I settled on with the Mule. Got it all put together using the pickups, preamp, strings and bridge from the Mule and was shocked at how it sounded. Tons more punch, more sustain, much much deeper lows but not as much clarity on the top end. Keep in mind that I set up both basses so string height and distance between pickups and strings and all electronics were virtually identical. The only significant difference between the two basses was the wood. The mule had a basswood body, maple neck and rosewood fb - the second bass had a mahogany body, rosewood neck and rosewood fb. (note: I suspect there were also some differences in truss rods and stiffening rods of each neck so there could have been some impact from that as well).
Anyway, I liked the sound and feel of the new bass better but wanted to get the top end back. I had the neck refretted with brass frets and a brass nut vs the nickel and tusq ones originally installed and - bam- that was it. The bass absolutely destroyed every thing else I own, and I have some top end stuff.

Just to see how much difference other woods make I purchased a swampash body and a maple/maple neck and reinstalled all the electronics, hardware and strings from my mahogany/rosewood bass to this third one. Again, same experience - a completely different sound and feel. This body and neck seemed to be much more lively but the tone was also much more midrange focused with entirely too much zing on the top end. It completely lost it's deep dub low end and picked up some mid range growl and top end snap. Not what I was looking for so everything went back into the mahogany/rosewood bass and there it stays to this day.

Was this a scientific test - nope! Purely aneqdotal. Did it reinforce to me the prevailing opinion in the bass building community that wood does impact tone - yep, without a doubt.
 
GBass, I hear you on that! Good story, and what a great learning experience.

BTW... I also have a bass with a solid rosewood neck ( a Schecter neck) but a solid Walnut body. I chose a higher-mass brass bridge for it, and tonally, it's all by itself out of everything I've owned in 30+ years of playing.

I think might be that rosewood neck that's having the most effect. I have had "stock" Fender 62 pickups in it most of it's life, I recently switched to some Bill Lawrences just for the heck of it. Sure enough, more output, but unmistakeably the SAME BASS... same timbre, same attack / decay / sustain. The wood IS the overriding factor in the sound of that bass.

Better pickups for your bass = better microphone for your singer.
 
Ok you tonewood lovers, I've posted a new audio clip poll. This time it's Alder vs. Scrap Lumber! I can't wait to see the results. Here's the thread: Alder vs. Scrap Lumber

Head on over and make your guess. Put your money where your mouth is!

alderj.jpg
lumberj.jpg
 
What's the matter, not enough confidenece in your skills to tell the difference? Because it certainly seems you're deliberately avoiding the actual point of the test. You're constantly bragging about your experience and expertise, here's a perfect chance to prove yourself right and everybody who disagrees with you wrong. Instead, you keep carping about how bad the basses sound, which is totally irrelevant.
 
Dan, you are pretty much running through a trailer park with a megaphone yelling WalMart Sucks. This is going to go on with you posting a test, them saying its not a fair test, you posting a better one, them saying you cheated... the end result is that you build instruments. Make them out of ninja soulwood, link it to a Wikipedia page you made yourself talking about how it sits perfectly in the mix and the scent from the wood actually makes drummers keep time better and guitarists not trip over cables, and rob these guys blind.
 
knucklehead G said:
Dan, you are pretty much running through a trailer park with a megaphone yelling WalMart Sucks. This is going to go on with you posting a test, them saying its not a fair test, you posting a better one, them saying you cheated... the end result is that you build instruments. Make them out of ninja soulwood, link it to a Wikipedia page you made yourself talking about how it sits perfectly in the mix and the scent from the wood actually makes drummers keep time better and guitarists not trip over cables, and rob these guys blind.

That's fantastic! That bass would sell through the roof!! I'd definitely buy one of those!!! :P