Worship Bassists Unite

[iamlowsound]

First off, don't be abrasive and condemning toward what he wants. I know that it sucks, but the last thing that you want (and the first thing that Satin wants) is strife withing your group. So while you might not like the fact that you HAVE to play root notes and that you HAVE to wear a suit and tie, do it and don't complain. But this does not mean that you can't try and change his mind, but there are constructive ways of doing this. First, try learning the bass lines to the songs that you are playing, he might like this (I have worked with leaders in the past that didn't care what you played, but LOVED it when you played the lines as they were written). Second, ask him if you can try out some of these lines IN PRACTICE -- to see if they add anything to the song -- don't just learn the lines and throw them out in a service. This would be undermining those that are in authority above you. If this flys, try a few variations and what not. I must add that for most songs in most situations I have found that root notes are the best thing in a worship service.

Now about the dress, find some scriptures on appropriate dress. Focus on the ones that are found in the new testament.

It may suck, and I am sure that it does, but you have to deal with it and give it up to God. Do not let this become something that causes strife within the group.

lowsound

 

[Michael Vee]

Do not let this become something that causes strife within the group.

I respectfully disagree, but I have to qualify why. And this is going to hit on a broader perspective than just the one problem in question.

If a leader is truly in error, then it is up to those that he or she leads to respectfully let them know that that is the case.

However, maturity is needed to know when disagreement is needed, and also how best to handle it.

If a leader is called by God, they can, and desire to, have discussions of merit and substance with their musicians.

If they aren't called by God, then if people are "avoiding strife" at all costs by not saying anything or calling the leaders out when that is needed, then sooner or later people are going to get frustrated and leave, and the worship program is going to be hamstrung and eventually the leader will leave, but not without subjecting the church to music that is much less than it deserved to be.

It's a lot better to pray about it, and then approach the leader to discuss things that need to be discussed. You'll find out whether or not God wants you in that particular body or not. If that's the right place, the leader will listen and value your input. If it isn't the right place, and strife happens and tensions arise, then chances are that leader isn't where they need to be and you probably should be looking elsewhere to serve.

Church musicians are volunteers in the vast majority, and good ones are HARD to find. Worship leaders don't need to unnecessarily alienate good musicians by taking a know-it-all or otherwise imperious approach. Good musicians know good bands, good music programs, and churches, and are attracted to those, and tend to leave churches where the music program is substandard or going nowhere.

My $2 worth.. 100% IMHO, but it may resonate with some readers.

 

[iamlowsound]

I respectfully disagree, but I have to qualify why. And this is going to hit on a broader perspective than just the one problem in question.

If a leader is truly in error, then it is up to those that he or she leads to respectfully let them know that that is the case.

However, maturity is needed to know when disagreement is needed, and also how best to handle it.

If a leader is called by God, they can, and desire to, have discussions of merit and substance with their musicians.

If they aren't called by God, then if people are "avoiding strife" at all costs by not saying anything or calling the leaders out when that is needed, then sooner or later people are going to get frustrated and leave, and the worship program is going to be hamstrung and eventually the leader will leave, but not without subjecting the church to music that is much less than it deserved to be.

It's a lot better to pray about it, and then approach the leader to discuss things that need to be discussed. You'll find out whether or not God wants you in that particular body or not. If that's the right place, the leader will listen and value your input. If it isn't the right place, and strife happens and tensions arise, then chances are that leader isn't where they need to be and you probably should be looking elsewhere to serve.

Church musicians are volunteers in the vast majority, and good ones are HARD to find. Worship leaders don't need to unnecessarily alienate good musicians by taking a know-it-all or otherwise imperious approach. Good musicians know good bands, good music programs, and churches, and are attracted to those, and tend to leave churches where the music program is substandard or going nowhere.

My $2 worth.. 100% IMHO, but it may resonate with some readers.

Strife is when it becomes something that causes tensions. Your opinion should be voiced, and a true leader will listen and consider what you have to say. Don't let your issues become something that causes infighting and frustration. If the leader still wants it his way, AFTER he has listened to you and considered what you have to say, then you have you respect his wishes. Weather or not he is where God wants him, he is still someone that is in authority over you and you have to respect his decisions. If at this time you are still not satisfied, take sometime off and reevaluate your position in the group. Do not try to undermine him, this will cause strife and can lead to the breakup of a church, I HAVE SEEN IT HAPPEN. Don't undermine your leaders, they are placed in authority above you and you MUST respect this.

Romans 13:1-5 Let every soul be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and the authorities that exist are appointed by God. 2Therefore whoever resists the authority resists the ordinance of God, and those who resist will bring judgment on themselves. 3For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to evil. Do you want to be unafraid of the authority? Do what is good, and you will have praise from the same. 4For he is God’s minister to you for good. But if you do evil, be afraid; for he does not bear the sword in vain; for he is God’s minister, an avenger to execute wrath on him who practices evil. 5Therefore you must be subject, not only because of wrath but also for conscience’ sake.

2 Peter 2:10 and especially those who walk according to the flesh in the lust of uncleanness and despise authority. They are presumptuous, self-willed. They are not afraid to speak evil of dignitaries,

lowsound

 

[dan.ablett]

wooooo i am playing my new marcus miller IV tomorrow morning for the first time publicly.

not a very adventurous set but im MD so hopefully we will get a bit funky..... cant wait for the active tone too..

 

[oxygenbass]

wooooo i am playing my new marcus miller IV tomorrow morning for the first time publicly.

not a very adventurous set but im MD so hopefully we will get a bit funky..... cant wait for the active tone too..

Cab we see some pictures of the new bass please?

 

[dan.ablett]

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should be a fun service.

 

[RedsFan75]

HeyMikey
I was told basically the same thing once. Stop playing the walkups and the 5ths cause it sounded too country. Funny thing is at that time we were practicing a southern gospel standard and it was supposed to be that, so I felt a bit offended and irritated because I felt, like you, that my freedom was being limited. I had been playing a long time and instead of getting bitter, I used it as a motivator, and I looked at my technique, I focused on my heart to make sure I was playing for the right reason. Another thing I did, was when I could I'd get the sheet music, and work out the bass line as written in the music, then I worked with my worship leader and the music to show him I wasn't just trying to go against his desires, I was just trying to make good music for the King. It worked out well in the end, and I realized I had been in a rut stylistically and as a musician. It ended up challenging me to go deeper in my skills.

As far as the clothes, can't help you there man.

Hi all
I've been the primary bassist at our church for the past 3 years. A couple other bass players have come and gone. I keep my focus on the fact that I am there to worship God. That said........
About 6 months ago we got a new Praise/Worship Director. He is a very talented musician and his music selection is great(a lot of songs by Chris Tomlin, Isreal Houghton, etc.). However, he is very restrictive in what he wants from the bass (me). Up until now, I've had the freedom to play the bass lines as I felt inspired. I would freely use walk-ups or walk-downs and passing notes in transition between verse and chorus. He dosen't like that. He says it sounds too "country". All he wants from the bass is root whole notes or half notes or eighth notes, nothing more. It has taken a lot of fun out of being the bass player. He has also demanded all musicians and singers be in "coat and tie" or "dresses" for the ladies when on the platform. Before he came we were allowed to be causual but neat.
I'm sorry this is sort of a negative post but I need to vent. I know worshiping God is the primary reason for going to church. Yes, I have talked to him about being so restrictive (the music director, not God ) to the bass lines but he says he wants me to play roots. I have also talked to God about this. I wonder if any other bassists' out there have been severly restricted in how they play bass lines for worship.
God is great.

 

[oxygenbass]

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should be a fun service.

im playing my Rickenbacker 4003 bass in bluesburst for the first time tommorow!!

im dead excited too!

 

[matrok]

That is such a beautiful Ric.

 

[rfclef]

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should be a fun service.

Nice bass... But howcome it's all backwards?



Bobby

 

[fourstringbliss]

As far as the clothes, can't help you there man.

Wear a zoot suit and a really skinny tie!

 

[HeyMikey]

Thanks for the encouragement guys. First and foremost, I've been praying over this and asking God to have his way. I want to serve God and my church. It's just that the new band leader has taken most of the fun part out of playing bass. We usually play one oldtime Gospel song in each set along with 4 or 5 contemporary ones. Two weeks ago he called for(at our weekly practice session) an old song called Victory In Jesus. I hope you are familiar with it so that you know how it sounds. It is fairly upbeat with a tempo of about 128 bpm. That song just begs for the bass to play alternating root 5ths with walkups and downs throughout the song. So he counts it off and I give it a great bass line. "Stop,stop stop. Bass player, just give me quarter notes on the root, nothing more". Now I sound like the kick drum with tone changes.
Okay, I recognize he is the director and I do follow his instructions. By the way, I'm not some young know it all on the bass (no offense intended to any young players). I'm 59 years old and the oldest player in the band. I've been playing bass for over 10 years and and am very competent with the instrument. I just feel so restricted. I have lost the freedom to play as inspired and I guess I resent it.
I usually have access to an mp.3 of any new song that we perform. I do listen to what the bass is doing on the mp.3 and follow that line 90 percent of the time. Our director will often modify the song in a different way from what's on the mp.3 so I never really know what he wants until we go over it at practice.
Once again, I apologize for the negative sounding post. I'm frustrated to the max. So far, I've gone along with his direction but the pressure is building. I'm thinking about maybe looking for another church to serve. I hope to stay. The people there are super. I am hoping God will lead me to do what is best for everyone concerned.
God is great.

 

[JoshC]

Nothing wrong with being frustrated. We've all been there. Worship leaders can be some of the most ignorant people on the planet when it comes to bass. They tend to be people who have been either stealing your lines playing keys or wanting soft acoustic guitar and vocal songs their whole lives. Your leader thinking walkdowns are too "country" is insane, and in old hymns you should be able to walk to your hearts content. I'm not sure what I would do. It would most likely involve going along with what the worship leader wants most of the time. Octaves can be fun, slide alot. play your 1 and 8's all over the fret board. Find creative ways to get a 3rd or 5th in there on the day of. You shouldn't have to sit there and play 2 notes the whole song. If that is what you are being made to do I think it is time for someone to talk to the worship leader. The way I worship was changed for a better when I first read Psalm 33:3 which says: "Sing to him a new song; play skillfully, and shout for joy." God loves complexe bass lines. If your creative talent is being stifled maybe it's time to have a serious talk with either the leader or someone higher up the chain about your frustration. I know I wouldn't be worshiping if all I got to play was roots, because I wouldn't be able to express myself to God through my bass playing. Anyway good luck with your situation, hopefully it gets resoved.

 

[fourstringbliss]

Thanks for the encouragement guys. First and foremost, I've been praying over this and asking God to have his way. I want to serve God and my church. It's just that the new band leader has taken most of the fun part out of playing bass. We usually play one oldtime Gospel song in each set along with 4 or 5 contemporary ones. Two weeks ago he called for(at our weekly practice session) an old song called Victory In Jesus. I hope you are familiar with it so that you know how it sounds. It is fairly upbeat with a tempo of about 128 bpm. That song just begs for the bass to play alternating root 5ths with walkups and downs throughout the song. So he counts it off and I give it a great bass line. "Stop,stop stop. Bass player, just give me quarter notes on the root, nothing more". Now I sound like the kick drum with tone changes.
Okay, I recognize he is the director and I do follow his instructions. By the way, I'm not some young know it all on the bass (no offense intended to any young players). I'm 59 years old and the oldest player in the band. I've been playing bass for over 10 years and and am very competent with the instrument. I just feel so restricted. I have lost the freedom to play as inspired and I guess I resent it.
I usually have access to an mp.3 of any new song that we perform. I do listen to what the bass is doing on the mp.3 and follow that line 90 percent of the time. Our director will often modify the song in a different way from what's on the mp.3 so I never really know what he wants until we go over it at practice.
Once again, I apologize for the negative sounding post. I'm frustrated to the max. So far, I've gone along with his direction but the pressure is building. I'm thinking about maybe looking for another church to serve. I hope to stay. The people there are super. I am hoping God will lead me to do what is best for everyone concerned.
God is great.

Don't rule out the idea that God might be testing your obedience to Him in this. He allowed your new worship leader to be in charge. From a musical standpoint it might not make any sense to play what he wants you to play but it might be an opportunity to grow in submission to God.

If you're leaving because you can't play what you want to play in worship you're admitting to yourself, your fellow players, and God that your main motivation for playing is to have an opportunity to play bass - not to worship God through bass. I don't mean that to sound harsh, but from the first time I read your initial post on this issue I've thought that God might be trying to test you here. Pray about it. God has asked people to do crazier things to test their obedience (like with Abraham).

 

[rfclef]

Yeah, try to have some calm, reasonable conversation and talk to him about the parts... No "What you want sucks!", and let him know you just want to enhance the music and the worship, not cover it, detract from it, or draw attention to youself... A balance can be struck... And, FWIW: Old time gospel is pretty darn country!

 

[HeyMikey]

Interesting replies have given me food for thought. Is God testing me? I simply do not know the answer to that. Is playing bass more important than worshiping God? Absolutely not. I believe in God and accepted Jesus as my Savior over 45years ago. I would still worship God even if I never played another note on the bass. However, I must admit I am disappointed in not having the freedom to express myself with the instrument. I was fat, dumb, and happy with the program before the leadership change.
I grew up in a First Baptist Church where the only instrument played during service was either a piano or organ. There was no such thing as a "band" back in those days. Drums, guitar, bass, percussion, saxophones, etc. were unheard of in church. Both my parents, long since passed away, would be shocked by the music of todays' standard and the dress code. You always wore your Sunday best when going to church back then. Levi, T-shirts, shorts, tennis shoes, and the like were totally looked down on.
I'll give more time to prayer over this matter. By the way, I have approached the director about having a little more freedom to express the bass lines but so far he has said no. He wants the bass to be played only as he sees fit. He leads the band on the piano with me on bass, one electric guitar, a drummer, percussionist, and a saxophone once in a while, and of course, the singers. I'm also pretty sure he knows I'm not real happy with the situation. It's not just me who he restricts. He tells each player what he wants from them. No one has the freedom to express themselves through their instruments. Everything has to be done exactly as he wants to hear it. I do not dislike the man. He is a nice person. I just wish he'd give us all a bit more freedom.

 

[Fassa Albrecht]

Interesting replies have given me food for thought. Is God testing me? I simply do not know the answer to that. Is playing bass more important than worshiping God? Absolutely not. I believe in God and accepted Jesus as my Savior over 45years ago. I would still worship God even if I never played another note on the bass. However, I must admit I am disappointed in not having the freedom to express myself with the instrument. I was fat, dumb, and happy with the program before the leadership change.
I grew up in a First Baptist Church where the only instrument played during service was either a piano or organ. There was no such thing as a "band" back in those days. Drums, guitar, bass, percussion, saxophones, etc. were unheard of in church. Both my parents, long since passed away, would be shocked by the music of todays' standard and the dress code. You always wore your Sunday best when going to church back then. Levi, T-shirts, shorts, tennis shoes, and the like were totally looked down on.
I'll give more time to prayer over this matter. By the way, I have approached the director about having a little more freedom to express the bass lines but so far he has said no. He wants the bass to be played only as he sees fit. He leads the band on the piano with me on bass, one electric guitar, a drummer, percussionist, and a saxophone once in a while, and of course, the singers. I'm also pretty sure he knows I'm not real happy with the situation. It's not just me who he restricts. He tells each player what he wants from them. No one has the freedom to express themselves through their instruments. Everything has to be done exactly as he wants to hear it. I do not dislike the man. He is a nice person. I just wish he'd give us all a bit more freedom.

I'll have to agree with you on this one HeyMikey. I became Christian 2 years back and a bassist a year ago. I have never once doubted that what comes first is my faith, and anything else is a manifestation of that. I will also agree that things like the dress code are very relaxed both at Christian Union and also at church (although I still like to dress smartly but casually). I usually go in jeans and a smart top...
I will also agree that I also don't like the set-up of my church's own band....the bass seems relegated to 'parrot' bass-playing where I simply recite what the tablature says, and I know that I would have little say in what I play, and the bandleader seems very reluctant to do anything other than that, even if he is an excellent singer, guitarist and band leader.

 

[iamlowsound]

Interesting replies have given me food for thought. Is God testing me? I simply do not know the answer to that. Is playing bass more important than worshiping God? Absolutely not. I believe in God and accepted Jesus as my Savior over 45years ago. I would still worship God even if I never played another note on the bass. However, I must admit I am disappointed in not having the freedom to express myself with the instrument. I was fat, dumb, and happy with the program before the leadership change.
I grew up in a First Baptist Church where the only instrument played during service was either a piano or organ. There was no such thing as a "band" back in those days. Drums, guitar, bass, percussion, saxophones, etc. were unheard of in church. Both my parents, long since passed away, would be shocked by the music of todays' standard and the dress code. You always wore your Sunday best when going to church back then. Levi, T-shirts, shorts, tennis shoes, and the like were totally looked down on.
I'll give more time to prayer over this matter. By the way, I have approached the director about having a little more freedom to express the bass lines but so far he has said no. He wants the bass to be played only as he sees fit. He leads the band on the piano with me on bass, one electric guitar, a drummer, percussionist, and a saxophone once in a while, and of course, the singers. I'm also pretty sure he knows I'm not real happy with the situation. It's not just me who he restricts. He tells each player what he wants from them. No one has the freedom to express themselves through their instruments. Everything has to be done exactly as he wants to hear it. I do not dislike the man. He is a nice person. I just wish he'd give us all a bit more freedom.

How good is the worship? Has it been powerful, miraculous and life changing? Has it been better than it was under the old leader? I have worked with a leader that was very controlling in what was played and how it was played and those were services where I saw lame people walk and demons cast out. Also, if you are still not happy, take some time off from the team. Maybe once you come back, you will see things different. I must also add, as a little side note, that I look back on some of the lines that I used to play in worship and I realise how bad some of them were. Maybe your lines really aren't adding and could be taking away. I mainly play root notes because it sounds better and adds to the music. I might put in the odd passing note. Your worship leader might also have an idea about where God wants to take the service and is directing how he sees fit to achieve this. I know that if I was leading worship, I would be very demanding, because I have a very specific idea about worship.

lowsound

 

[basspraiser]

Wear a zoot suit and a really skinny tie!

Matt - I would LOVE to see you in one of those....they do not look good on skinny white guys (just kidding!!!)

 

[basspraiser]

HeyMickey:

I have been "sittin' back" and reading your posts and all of the replies....all of the statements made (both yours and the responses) are valid....

one thing to bring up to your worship leader is that you are trying to get into the spirit of the song....you say in an earlier post that you play alot of contemporary songs "90%" of the way they are on the recording...I do the same but get to throw in a few licks here and there......

I would continue to speak with him about your concerns and, if you are being "forced" to play less than what is on the mp3...challenge him (nicely) on why....maybe a good hour or two over a cup of coffee (Christians are Starbucks biggest customers!) might shed some light on his "vision"...maybe directly asking him what his "vision is" and being GENUINELY interested may help the two of you come to terms....

peace and prayers...