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Would this put you off as a buyer?

ha ha perhaps another lesson in this story, a few days later I went to another dealership 45 mins away and they had the exact explorer I wanted, right color, right engine, tranny, etc..I went in there, took a test drive about a block into it I told the salesman, I'll take it lets go do the paper work..I sat down put the check on his desk and said, I want one thing...1000 off the price and a moonroof installed, I'll sign this check right now..?...he said I can't do that...I said ok, picked up the check and got up and started out of his cubicle..he said hoooolldd up...let me ask my sales manager..I said ok..he comes back, we can do it...lolol...I got everything I wanted for a fair price..and they got an immediate easy sale...and that's how you do it.

If you want something then buy it...if the deal doesn't work for you, walk away...maybe the perfect deal is just round the corner..

I've had this experience with cars, too. I was looking for a new car and went to a dealer. There was a late model used car that I had some interest in, but didn't quite meet my criteria. It had more features than I wanted. I thanked them and left. The salesperson and manager literally chased me into the parking lot, encouraging me to come back in and "make a great deal." I declined. My father, who was with me and watched all this unfold, said he was surprized I held my ground, but was proud of me that I did. A week later, I got the car I wanted at a different dealer, brand new, for about the same price.

It taught me to know what I want and not take even a "great deal" if it wasn't what I wanted. This experience has served me well in many negotiations, both big and small.

I've never regretted walking away from any "deal." Being as objective about things as you can be helps take the emotions out of it. When you are so gassed for something, the seller will see that. That's when you are most vulnerable to not getting what you really want and being disappointed not only in the item and how much you paid for it, but in yourself, as well. Be true to yourself, not what others are telling you.
 
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I've had this experience with cars, too. I was looking for a new car and went to a dealer. There was a late model used car that I had some interest in, but didn't quite meet my criteria. It had more features than I wanted. I thanked them and left. The salesperson and manager literally chased me into the parking lot, encouraging me to come back in and "make a great deal." I declined. My father, who was with me and watched all this unfold, said he was surprized I held my ground, but was proud of me that I did. A week later, I got the car I wanted at a different dealer, brand new, for about the same price.

It taught me to know what I want and not take even a "great deal" if it wasn't what I wanted. This experience has served me well in many negotiations, both big and small.

I've never regretted walking away from any "deal." Being as objective about things as you can be helps take the emotions out of it. When you are so gassed for something, the seller will see that. That's when you are most vulnerable to not getting what you really want and being disappointed not only in the item and how much you paid for it, but in yourself, as well. Be true to yourself, not what others are telling you.

+1

A 'great deal' may not be really such a great deal if you are not getting what you wanted. Similarly, if you find what you really want, paying a little extra is not such a terrible thing. In my opinion.

Years ago I wanted one of those USA EBMM SUB basses, in white. They were typically going for £375ish around here. Sometimes less, sometimes a bit more. I could get a black one for £350, or a white one for £415, both in very good condition. I had been watching for a while and I knew I could find others relatively easily but the white ones for some reason were harder to find. I ended up paying the £415. I got what I wanted, and a little extra cash was not going to sour it for me.

It's wise not to show how much you want something though. When I bought my old little Audi A3... it was exactly what I was after: the right trim with all leather interior, the right engine, the right colour... and during the test drive I could not hide how much I liked it. When it came to negotiate a price, I had to laugh because I knew the salesman was very aware, and understandably didn't budge on price. I bought it anyway. It was the one I wanted. I actually disliked the salesman's attitude for a couple of little things... but unfortunately he had the right car. I enjoyed it very much for the following 5 years or so.
 
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About a year ago I won the auction on Ebay for a Japan FSR walnut Jazz Bass. It was advertised as pristine, no marks, etc. I drove the 40 or so miles to pick it up and on inspection I found some small marks on the side of the bass. Other than that, the bass was really really nice, and I wanted it, but I was really irked that it hadn't been accurately advertised, and I also wondered about the sellers integrity. I declined the bass and drove home, although I nearly turned back after 5 minutes!

Decided my priorities were wrong, and won the Bass again, but it cost me an extra £50, not to mention time and petrol.

But I'm very happy with the Bass. So don't sweat the small stuff!

Sometimes people get in their feelings and lose sight of what's important.

I found this bass on craigslist. I did not negotiate the price. It's in great shape but not perfect. I know people who would've walked away over the imperfection... which is great. More for me.
:D
20620_Used_Rian_6_String_FL_Bass_020706_a (1).jpg
 
I guess we just have different business practices, as I said I personally have no problem improvising to make a deal, I also welcome offers.

I guess I have a soured opinion of the seller to begin with as he is one of the dealers that set everything at 100-120% of fair market value and then they sit for months or years

Ironically he made me an offer once of 50% my asking price on a reasonably priced instrument

I don't have a problem with a seller willing to wait and get their price. While I'd like to move an instrument quickly, I had one boutique bass that took a year to get what i wanted. Because typically i only sell a bass once... and i didn't have to sell it. Time was on my side and worst case I'm stuck with a great bass that was appreciating in value over what i paid.

And it's rare that I dwell on the negotiation after I've acquired a piece. I have kicked myself for letting myself get in the way of an obvious bargain that I wanted
 
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I purchased a used Honda Civic Si as a work vehicle way back when from a Chevy dealer. Went over the car, has some minor front suspension issues that needed to be fixed. Salesman assured me that would be taken care of, I could bring it back after the sale if I wanted to take the car in the meantime.

Completed the sale, asked when I should bring it back, the salesman said there was nothing in writing about the work. I smiled, set the keys on his desk and walked out. He came running after me, saying "You bought the car, it's yours!".

I said cool, sue me. He agreed to fix the car and I made an appointment before I took it. It was a great car and I never dealt with that dealership again.

It was actually fun walking away from that jackhole. When buying, I don't get emotionally attached and my stance is that I started the day without this... I can end it that way too. But I also know a great deal when I see one which is why most of my gear is still worth more than I paid for it.
 
And lastly, I have to disagree with some of the posters saying the seller's response was fine. What he SAID was ok, it's more about what he didn't say. The 2 guys behind the seller account are businessmen. Their (self appointed) job is to interact with customers in such a way that generates more sales, not less. So context is important. I would be surprised if most of the people making that argument haven't grumbled about a less than bubbly fast food cashier, etc... Customer service is important and it's kind of a lost art these days. So if I had the same experience as the OP, I certainly would avoid that seller in the future, maybe unless they had something that was completely unique that I really wanted that I didn't think I would get as good a chance at getting again.

Yo O-Monk! I find myself in total agreement with virtually everything you post. But something about the above smacks a little of entitlement to me at least.

People operate businesses or their side hustles for their own reasons. I wouldn’t suggest thinking you can read their minds or presume to dictate how they should operate. The market sorts out what’s acceptable business practice automatically over time. Those who don’t know, or can’t learn, how the game is played go home after awhile. And if these guys have been at it for 20 years as you said, they’ve long since figured out what works for them and the people whom they want to deal with.

I know a few private instrument dealers where I am who won’t even talk to you unless they got to know you somewhere else (like a guitar show or auction) or you came with an introduction from an existing customer or supplier of theirs. They aren’t doing it so much for the money as they are the fun of doing it. They love the stuff they deal in and love rubbing shoulders with the people who know and love the gear as well and as much as they do. And they do a steady stream of hassle free and profitable business.

So being willing to sit down on your carpet in the bazaar and haggle with a total stranger over a cup of tea isn’t the only way to conduct business. And in between those two extremes there’s plenty of room to find your own spot on the business style continuum.

So was the OP’s request reasonable? That all depends on several factors for the seller that are outside our ken. At the very least they’d need to modify the listing on the unsold guitar they're switching the case on. I don’t know what Reverb’s policies are on doing edits after the fact. Possibly you’d need to pull the listing and submit a new one since detail changes could potentially mislead the people already watching your ad if they miss the the change and later decide to pull the trigger. Something that could also lead to issues if they don’t receive what the original ad said. So I can understand having a “no substitutions” policy.

I can’t speak for anyone but myself. But experience has taught if somebody isn’t happy with the product as listed, then they’re not going to be any happier with it once they actually receive it regardless of what you do. The two times I agreed to a concession on anything other than price on Reverb, I had major post sale hassles with both buyers. Hassles that ended with me taking the items back, issuing a refund, and paying for the return postage just to end the back and forth messaging. Never underestimate the power of buyer’s remorse.

So these days any Reverb or eBay listing of mine now clearly says: “item(s) as described and photographed - and sold as is” along with ”not accepting offers.” and “all sales final.” My return policy is also clearly spelled out. And I ignore messages and offers from anyone who ignores that.

Sad thing is, regardless of my theoretical “no return” policy, if someone isn’t happy I’m going to do an immediate return and refund. Because (a) I don’t want the buyer deliberately damaging what I sent them to bolster their claim; and (b) eBay and Paypal will invariably side with the buyer regardless of merit and refund them their money anyway. So best practice is to get your stuff back, give them back their money, and get it over with.

In person I’m a lot more easygoing and accommodating. But dealing with an complete unknown who is sitting behind the imagined anonymity of the web is another thing. Sad but true.
 
I can’t speak for anyone but myself. But experience has taught if somebody isn’t happy with the product as listed, then they’re not going to be any happier with it once they actually receive it regardless of what you do. The two times I agreed to a concession on anything other than price on Reverb, I had major post sale hassles with both buyers. Hassles that ended with me taking the items back, issuing a refund, and paying for the return postage just to end the back and forth messaging. Never underestimate the power of buyer’s remorse.

So these days any Reverb or eBay listing of mine now clearly says: “item(s) as described and photographed - and sold as is” along with ”not accepting offers.” and “all sales final.” My return policy is also clearly spelled out. And I ignore messages and offers from anyone who ignores that.

It's unfortunate you had hassells with buyers. I'm sure you are a nice guy and someone who might even be a friends if we knew each other, but if I saw a listing of a used item with no offers - all sales final, I'd likely just pass you by (nothing personal intended here). The only exception I'd make is if the item were in obvious pristine condition and it was priced fairly. Unfortunately, we don't see that too often, at least in my experience.

Negotiations are not a bad thing, nor do they have to be stressful or a contest.

I bought an item from a seller via Reverb a few weeks ago. It took several messages over a few days to complete. In the process, I better understood what I was buying and the seller better understood my interests and objectives. It was a good purchase at a fair price. I had no misunderstandings about what I was getting and was glad to give the seller my money. In the end, we both acknowledged that it was a pleasure to do business with each other. No demands were made or take-it-or-leave its were stated. It was more a conversation where we both discovered things that we didn't know, made adjustments, and concluded with a good sale.

Not everything goes like this and when dealing with the public, there are all types - and that's true on both sides of the equation. Buyers can be demanding and capricious, and sellers can be, too. When you are selling or buying used stuff, you are bound to run into it. But I also think that within a message or two, you know what's on the other side of the sale. If I were selling and a buyer was being uncool or unrealistic, I would simply thank them for their interest, but let them know the transaction won't be taking place with them. The same goes if I were buying.
 
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If I were selling and a buyer was being uncool or unrealistic, I would simply thank them for their interest, but let them know the transaction won't be taking place with them. The same goes if I were buying.

If the question is seeking some clarification about the item, I invariably respond with the information requested. If the question is about the pricing or similar - and it’s politely worded - I’ll also respond with a gentle reminder as to the terms as stated in the listing. Usually it’s politely received in return. But not always. Aggressive messages, stupid dickering proposals, and similar null set messages go unanswered.

I’m pretty easy going. But I ran my own business for 35 years. And after awhile you can develop the skill of knowing who you’re dealing with and where they're coming from pretty early in the exchange. And as I said in an earlier post, you soon learn to qualify your customers just as carefully as you qualify the people you’re thinking about buying something from.
 
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Entitlement is real. People rarely think that what they want is unreasonable and look for justifications that will suit them, seller be damned.

Would the seller swap cases? No. Why? What difference does that make? Might as well ask why are you selling it, a generally pointless question for a stranger. And some strangers don't want to spend any more time than necessary with some "buyers".
 
There have already been dozens of correct responses in this thread. I'll add my two cents....
As to the original question - No, that would not put me off as a buyer. If I were the seller however (I have sold on Reverb, EvilBay, and here) and I discovered anyone making such a big fuss about this, I would block that potential buyer from all future sales. IMHO someone this entitled sounds like the kind of customer who would demand a refund because the bass wasn't shipped in tune ... I don't have time for that.

But that's just me.

This x 1000
 
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So I was looking at a bass on Reverb and a large volume seller has a bass I like priced at $2700, the bass is within a fair price range for what it is although on the high end, one of the downsides for me is it has a non original damaged case. The sellers price is firm, no " make offer" feature

The same seller has another bass of the same make, model and vintage with a nice original case but the color and condition of the bass is less desirable so its priced at $1800

* I had mistakenly suggested he has hundreds of guitars listed, most of his inventory are pedals, he has 18 guitars listed in total*


I had emailed him and said I would be interested in purchasing your $2700 bass if you would swap out the case with the case from the other listing.

He replied with one sentence that he " wouldn't be willing to do that "

Me personally, to make a sale, I would be happy to, in my opinion the condition of the case really has no bearing on value of the instrument it's more the fact I already have several basses with worn broken cases.

The demeanor of the reply makes me want to take an antacid for my G.A.S and move along


Am I unreasonable?
Not at all. The seller's a fool.
 
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So I was looking at a bass on Reverb and a large volume seller has a bass I like priced at $2700, the bass is within a fair price range for what it is although on the high end, one of the downsides for me is it has a non original damaged case. The sellers price is firm, no " make offer" feature

The same seller has another bass of the same make, model and vintage with a nice original case but the color and condition of the bass is less desirable so its priced at $1800

* I had mistakenly suggested he has hundreds of guitars listed, most of his inventory are pedals, he has 18 guitars listed in total*


I had emailed him and said I would be interested in purchasing your $2700 bass if you would swap out the case with the case from the other listing.

He replied with one sentence that he " wouldn't be willing to do that "

Me personally, to make a sale, I would be happy to, in my opinion the condition of the case really has no bearing on value of the instrument it's more the fact I already have several basses with worn broken cases.

The demeanor of the reply makes me want to take an antacid for my G.A.S and move along


Am I unreasonable?
A good gig bag is better than any case IMHO. I never care about the case since I always use a gig bag
 
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I guess we just have different business practices, as I said I personally have no problem improvising to make a deal, I also welcome offers.

I guess I have a soured opinion of the seller to begin with as he is one of the dealers that set everything at 100-120% of fair market value and then they sit for months or years

Ironically he made me an offer once of 50% my asking price on a reasonably priced instrument

This is the Wheeler Dealer who scowers CL, guitar shows and preowned music stores. He thinks everyonelse is stupid, buys only when he can turn a huge profit (nothing wrong with that) and is very likely not a player. He has some knowledge, a bank roll and has no problem waiting for lil fish to swim by and pay top dollar for a Bass that he took the nice case from and put with the other Bass that is as beat up as its OHSC. BECAUSE, putting a lil polish on that turd @ $1800 is going to sell to a different lil fish who has fewer dollars and sees a good value of a solid case and a "road worn" Bass.

He is Positioning the product in a market to get you to pay top dollar @ $2700 for the Bass in good condition and get the other lil fish to see how much he is saving and still getting a super nice case @ $1800.

If he gives you the whole package, he may never sell the other Bass.

He was not rude. It was a short message that answered your inquiry. He knows you want the Bass and though you say it's a "fair price", "but on the higher side" means you are not happy paying for something that you admit is reasonable and this Bass coming into your collection must have a better case than others you have purchased.

Sooooo, had the guy NOT had the other Bass @ $1800 you would have purchased the Bass @ $2700, added it to your collection and been happy to have what you desire. Not getting the best case gives you something to cry about on TB and not just move on or drop the coin and be happy.

I pass on things all the time...I buy things all the time...I never come on TB and cry about some wheeler dealer who I can't get to give me my way.

Go buy the Bass...
 
I guess I have a soured opinion of the seller to begin with as he is one of the dealers that set everything at 100-120% of fair market value and then they sit for months or years

Ironically he made me an offer once of 50% my asking price on a reasonably priced instrument

Apparently he is in business and continues to do business because how he is doing it works. You buy low and sell high. That is how you earn money. Eventually someone will pay what he is asking.

You liking it or not has nothing to do with it.