- Jul 20, 2005
- 881
- 76
- Disclosures
- Endorsing Artist: Samuel Shen Basses, NS Design, D'Addario Strings
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Xsonics Club
- Thread starter kringle77
- Start date
Chef
In Memoriam
Your stuffed f-holes would indicate you have/had serious feedback problems.
I've cured this one of two ways in the past:
LR Baggs Paracoustic DI has a phase invert switch that will usually cure almost all of it, and, a great 5 band eq that will kill the rest.
f-deck HPF with phase invert.
I've cured this one of two ways in the past:
LR Baggs Paracoustic DI has a phase invert switch that will usually cure almost all of it, and, a great 5 band eq that will kill the rest.
f-deck HPF with phase invert.
Had the 215cf/SL900 rig hammering last night. I'd never played upright bass that loud (or electric bass for that matter). Absolutely smoking!
- Jul 20, 2005
- 881
- 76
- Disclosures
- Endorsing Artist: Samuel Shen Basses, NS Design, D'Addario Strings
Thanks, Chef. I started doing that years ago with my Kay. As it is now, I haven't had any feedback issues. In fact, the volume last Saturday was staggering, and I had no problems whatsoever. I've considered a high pass filter setup or an EQ setup in the past to dial out certain frequencies, but in the interest of carrying less equipment (not more) I never spent any dough to experiment with it. I will, however, investigate your suggestion. Many thanks, brother.
Looking forward to your findings.
I have a mesa Walkabout (300w/4ohm ; 500w/2ohm) and want to get the most clean volume out of it using a compact cab setup. I need it loud enough for medium to large gigs (1000 sqft room).
Anyone using low powered heads with good loud results with these cabs, or can anyone suggest a good cab configuration for my needs? Thanks.
If you are cosidering an xsonics cab for you walkabout I would be looking at the 2155cf. Naturally the larger speakers will give you the best sensitivity, and make the most of the power and head room you have. Additionally I would recommend you get the mid loaded cab. The 3015's have a certain upper mid presence that pairs well with a lot of amps, and might give you the presence in the mix you want. If thats not the sound you want, then the faital mid driver is very smooth, and might appeal to you as well. Either way the 2155CF will give you the sensitivity you want, and the option of having two voicings.
Is there anyone in Michigan who's currently using any of the Xsonics cabs? Im becoming increasingly interested in the 2155cf, but I'd like to try any of Nick's line.
Thanks.
Thanks.
Xsonics cabs are isobaric dual-driver designs. Isobarics perform no better than a single driver in a larger cabinet, but take twice as much power to accomplish the same output. It's just an expensive way to trade size for weight.
So the question you should be asking is will a single 400W 12" cab fill a 10,000sq ft room, and the answer is hells no. Of course you can use a 212CF in such a room, and your friends will probably still say you sound great, if that's all you care about then fill your boots. Just don't play soon after a band with proper gear and you'll be just fine.
They're lying about the specs too, the driver they're surely using is the Kappalite 3012LF, which is 95.5dB/1W. You lose 3dB efficiency with an isobaric cab, so it's no better than 93dB sensitive. That's really low. Good modern 4x10's are 102-105dB sensitive, which is between 8 and 16 times more efficient. So according to Eminence's own specs the 212CF is no louder than a GK, SWR, or Traynor 4x10 at 100W.
Someone's tinkering with the laws of physics again...
So the question you should be asking is will a single 400W 12" cab fill a 10,000sq ft room, and the answer is hells no. Of course you can use a 212CF in such a room, and your friends will probably still say you sound great, if that's all you care about then fill your boots. Just don't play soon after a band with proper gear and you'll be just fine.
They're lying about the specs too, the driver they're surely using is the Kappalite 3012LF, which is 95.5dB/1W. You lose 3dB efficiency with an isobaric cab, so it's no better than 93dB sensitive. That's really low. Good modern 4x10's are 102-105dB sensitive, which is between 8 and 16 times more efficient. So according to Eminence's own specs the 212CF is no louder than a GK, SWR, or Traynor 4x10 at 100W.
Someone's tinkering with the laws of physics again...
I have no dog in this hunt at all, but you are not correct. First, definitely not LF drivers. Those are more sub woofer drivers, and require a mid driver pretty much. I believe these use either one of the Faitals or the 'non LF' HO drivers.
Also, they are not isobaric. The second driver is wired out of phase from the first... so kind of like a 'passive radiator' design that is not passive.
Most likely band passing going on that gives these cabs a good dose of upper bass, which can work very will in a mix.
Just FYI, since this has been discussed to death in various threads regarding these cabs
As has been said before, Xsonics is not an isobaric design. However, the sensitivity ratings are conservatively rated as if they were an isobaric cabinet (i.e., 100 dB for a 3012HO speaker >> 98 dB for the 212CF cab, instead of 103 dB for a traditional 212).
I really feel a need to address a post by tuned. Fretlessboy is correct these are not isobaric cabinets . And stating that the builder is lying about the specs is well in one word slander. If you are wanting information about how these cabs perform , there are plenty of happy gigging bassist's on this thread, using xsonics cabs. This is an xsonics club thread so coming into it with false accusations is liable to just start another conflict thread . I for one don't really want that. There are more than a few happy gigging bassist's that would be more than happy to give you there gigging impressions. At this point there are no graphs on how these cabs perform only real world players and there personal opinions on them. There are two cabs that are going to Tom Bowlus at BGM. Until those cabs are reviewed by BGM the answers are really unknown. Just let us happy bassist be just that happy.
And the cabs use the following drivers 212cf eminence 3012HO , 210cf eminence 3010HO, I am not sure on the 215cf what driver . But I do know he is using a faital mid driver that can be switched from two way to three way. I have been very happy using my 212cf it is more than I need in a gigging situation ( and I play big rooms and outdoors ) with a really loud band . I have not had to push this cab very hard at all to achieve the volume levels I need and I've got 900 watts to play with and I haven't even hit half volume. The lows are well defined ( all I play are brubaker 5's) the B is tight and well rounded , the mids are very alive and natural and can get Grundy if you dig in real hard all leading up to a brilliant top end. I used to play these same rooms with a 210 112 stack , or a 212 or 410 and those cabs to me felt like I was pushing them hard ,the 212cf doesn't seem to even be breaking a sweat. And I have been in the same situation outdoors with no problems except the sound guy telling me to come down on my volume.
Best thing to do in this situation is totally IGNORE Tuned comments. Just pretend he never showed up, and continue with the real world experience of these cabs. Mine has replaced my 810 - and be clear, I did not say it is louder, I said it easily replaced it for the volume level I needed the 810 for. Though, i would say it would give it a serious run for its money. Xsonics are simply great cabs for people that gig, and gig a lot.
Ok , here is a pic of my two cabs . The one on the right is a single 12 three way cab with a Deltalite 2512II driver . Box is about the right size tuned to 45Hz. or so . The cab on the left is the one in question and it's loaded with two Kappalite 3012HO s . Nick is using the thermal wattage rating for the speakers like almost every other major cab builder , right or wrong that's how they all do it . So using that my 112 cab has a 250 watt rating and the 212cf 800 watts . My 112 cab can probably use the whole 250 watts , I've used it with amps rated more than it is supposed to take for a few years pushing it pretty hard and never got a bit of farting and it gets very loud for a 112 .
Though the cabs are very close to the same size the Xsonics 212cf next to it kicks the 112 to the curb volume wise as it should . I would have to have two of the 112 cabs like mine to keep up with the 212cf . I know it looks like the inside of the cab is too small for the drivers and you only get the mids and highs from the front facing 12 but these just work great when playing with a band . Mine really does remind me of my Eden 210XLT cabs tone wise like he was shooting for only these are way louder than one of those could get and 25 pounds lighter . Maybe these aren't supposed to work but when you play through one it sure seems like they do . I'm loving mine . Weird science ? Maybe , but it seems to work . I have no doubt at all that this would keep up with any 410 cab .
Though the cabs are very close to the same size the Xsonics 212cf next to it kicks the 112 to the curb volume wise as it should . I would have to have two of the 112 cabs like mine to keep up with the 212cf . I know it looks like the inside of the cab is too small for the drivers and you only get the mids and highs from the front facing 12 but these just work great when playing with a band . Mine really does remind me of my Eden 210XLT cabs tone wise like he was shooting for only these are way louder than one of those could get and 25 pounds lighter . Maybe these aren't supposed to work but when you play through one it sure seems like they do . I'm loving mine . Weird science ? Maybe , but it seems to work . I have no doubt at all that this would keep up with any 410 cab .
The Fdeck hpf-3 shouldn't really be used to "clean up" anyone's sound. It should be used to minimize signal below your hearing range. That expands headroom in the amp, and preserves excursion in the cab. Every system with out a good HPF could benefit from it regardless of designer.
I did notice their website rating was very conservative for a two speaker cab, but real world players seem to be getting serious volume from their rigs, so there must be something to these cabs.
Still interested to see the results from BGM and if Tom can gauge their performance with a low powered head such as the Walkabout, that would be very much appreciated.
Still interested to see the results from BGM and if Tom can gauge their performance with a low powered head such as the Walkabout, that would be very much appreciated.
