Double Bass Yamahiko Double Bass Pickup

[DoubleMIDI]

Thanks Man,
What I want to do honestly is have both pickups, and my Remic Mic go into the Grace Felix and then into a power amp and my cab without any more outboard gear. It would be great to get the phase reversed organically (put one Yamahiko in threads up and one threads down?...no that wont work) but I'd love to be able to have the mic channel of the Felix dedicated to that. BUT maybe the Yamahiko 2 element is going to be for those times when the Mic is not feasible and I need to go with just pickup in which case I could have a channel each for each pickup. I wonder if it would work with one pickup into one channel of the Felix with the Phase reverse switch on and then the other pickup in the insert for that channel....but then you get no eq on that pickup....

Reversing the direction of the Yamahiko doesn't reverse the phase because the element is pressure sensitive.

If you do't need the mic, use both channels of the Felix for the two pickups. Otherwise the homemade electronics solution with the Quick'n'dirty impedance buffers from Francis would work. And the output could be fed into one channel of the Felix.

The insert does't work, because it might disconnect the input signal from the EQ and even if it works because you can mix dry and wet, the second pickup has no impedance buffer of preamp that would be needed for a rather low impedance return input. And you don't have the EQ on the second pickup.

 

[bassfacer22]

I have two Schertler stat-b single capsule pickups I never tried together yet.. one for each side of the bridge..

I don't have the felix yet, but thinking about getting it..

I do however have a 2-channel WW amp I could try plugging both single Schertler Stat-b into the amp... would I still get phasing?

I'm gonna have to try it sometime.. but having 2 separate phantom power little boxes is kinda annoying..

 

[Ric Vice]

I have two Schertler stat-b single capsule pickups I never tried together yet.. one for each side of the bridge..

I don't have the felix yet, but thinking about getting it..

I do however have a 2-channel WW amp I could try plugging both single Schertler Stat-b into the amp... would I still get phasing?

I'm gonna have to try it sometime.. but having 2 separate phantom power little boxes is kinda annoying..

They, re-introduces the dual element Stat-B Vintage two years ago. It's simply two single Stat-B's wired together, it's not the same as the original two element version that had a pre connecting both elements. I'm fairly certian that the dedicated pre, dealt with phase issues. Using two individual Stat-B's would most likely create phase issues. Just my take.

Ric

 

[bassfacer22]

I tried a (or what I thought was new) double capsule version of the schertler.. It had major tonal change when using both capsules.. I did try turning one around and all that etc..

I also have a video showing using it and the phasing issue.. The sound gets really thin etc..

Anyway one day this nonsense will be solved.

 

[flatback]

...wrong thread for this topic but....
actually Im going to put my 2 cents on the proper thread...

 

[SamuelHarris]

OK
Good news and bad news.
the good news
The Yamahilko with the two elements is the best amplified sound I've ever gotten. The G and D string are now thicker with more rhythmic pop and punch. The A and E seemed to have improved, too. Very acoustic sounding.

the bad news
As I thought it might, when you use the interconnecting cord between the pickups---it sounds like crap. (one pickup connected to the other). No wonder this hasn't caught on. That's their recommended setup. Thin, middy, bright.
But----- I also purchased another pickup-to-jack cord. Ran into the 2 channels of the Doubler. You can get very different characters of sound by varying the respective volumes. Sounded great. What made it sound REALLY great was using the variable phase control. It sounded good in phase. It sounded good but fatter 180 degrees out of phase. It sounded---the best I've ever heard somewhere in between. Now I'm going to have to talk to Zoran to see if I can get a custom box to combine and vary phase. I think it's still fantastic if you can combine the two----maybe a Felix.

Oh man did it sound good. I'm willing to deal with inconveniences. To me it's worth it. I liked the single element Yamahiko better than other piezos. I like this dual setup a lot more.

I'd bet that the venerable Underwood would dramatically benefit from isolating the two pickup elements into separate channels.

Hey Mike, still using the dual Yamahikos? Still digging them?

 

[flatback]

Just popped for a Yamahiko myself. SIngle element version, plan is to use it as the bottom end of a mic/pickup blend.

 

[flatback]

I should be done with pickups. I've gone thru too many. But over the past few years the part of the Amplification signal past the pickup, the preamp and speaker parts have changed so much for the better that getting the right piezo (for the bottom end of a mic blend) has me back at it. Mostly for the Contrabassetto. My big bass sounds great with the Remic and FC mixed or the Ischell and FC. The small bass has an Underwood on it right now and the Ischell and that sound suffers a bit with both the brightness of the little bass and the flatness of the Underwood. I had the Aptflex on there which is a really great pickup (with the right preamp) but it is very poorly made and has ended up a frankenpup after too many repairs. I also tried the Stat B on there which can sound good but bright...THe stat B though, has a way of getting its sound messed up at gigs so that you are left futsing trying to get the ugly middy sound which you are fighting to go back to that fat nice sound you had before.
If the Yamahiko is really good I may get the other element but right now I sure dig blending a piezo on the bottom with a nice mic on top.

 

[Chris Fitzgerald]

I should be done with pickups. I've gone thru too many. But over the past few years the part of the Amplification signal past the pickup, the preamp and speaker parts have changed so much for the better that getting the right piezo (for the bottom end of a mic blend) has me back at it.

I have to agree with this - I've obsessed over blending mics and pickups, carried an insane rig around for years, and written numerous articles about the nuances of blending. And then when I stumbled across my current amp and found it such a happy partner for my bass with the FC, I just stopped all that and played the gig with that beautiful sound.... not quite MBOL, but more like GETMBMW (Good Enough To Make Beautiful Music With). I hope the Yamahiko gets you there, and look forward to your review!

 

[flatback]

Yeah dude, no offense, but I wish someone would just sneak into your office and bust up that Phil Jones...I miss your informative years. Now it's the same old FC into PJB, no stress thing and yet here you are the dang moderator. I counted on you being dissatisfied at least thru 2020...

as to a crazy rig I don't think these rigs are crazy...an AI two channel or a Felix into anything...THe elevated speaker was a little much but thats only (at least for me) because I play in clubs rather then stages and the possibilities of knocking a raised speaker onto an instrument mortifies me.

 

[lowfreqgeek]

Well, I ain't no moderator, but I'll concur that a FC into a PJB Super Flightcase is a very natural sounding DB rig, IMO. The first time I played that combo, it *finally* felt like I'd just turned up the volume on the bass without any actual amplification.

That said, I opted for a Realist on my "new" bass (no adjusters), and the PJB still sounds great, but I've gotten a lot more complicated with an AMT and AI Flex also in the path...

 

[rogerbmiller]

 

[Chris Fitzgerald]

Yeah dude, no offense, but I wish someone would just sneak into your office and bust up that Phil Jones...I miss your informative years. Now it's the same old FC into PJB, no stress thing and yet here you are the dang moderator. I counted on you being dissatisfied at least thru 2020...

as to a crazy rig I don't think these rigs are crazy...an AI two channel or a Felix into anything...THe elevated speaker was a little much but thats only (at least for me) because I play in clubs rather then stages and the possibilities of knocking a raised speaker onto an instrument mortifies me.

I hear you. I like to think that advocating GETMBMW is still being informative, though. Seriously, the older rigs were just getting crazy for me - I didn't mean to imply for anyone else. It was just too many cables and too much futzing. But I think we each have to go through that process to arrive at where we end up, and there's no one right answer. Rufus Reid and Lynn Seaton still travel with a mic and a pickup on their basses, and I sure wouldn't argue with their results!

 

[Ric Vice]

Just popped for a Yamahiko myself. SIngle element version, plan is to use it as the bottom end of a mic/pickup blend.

So it's a Ischell/Yamahiko into both channels of the Grace Felix. Sounds like a real winner. I think the Yamahiko is a more robust design than Fishman's Full Circle, which possibly used

elements of the latter in it's build. It's kind of unfortunate, that there isn't one single pickup that gets us the best sound, in higher volume situations. Obviously the Ischell, or in my case the

Ehrlund work great by themselves, until you have to play loud. I rarely have that kind of situation. I guess I'm fortunate.

Ric

 

[Ric Vice]

as to a crazy rig I don't think these rigs are crazy...an AI two channel or a Felix into anything...THe elevated speaker was a little much but thats only (at least for me) because I play in clubs rather then stages and the possibilities of knocking a raised speaker onto an instrument mortifies me.

They may not be crazy, but they are crazy expensive. I have the receipts to prove that. Fortunately, I got my M700 used. If I'd waited just a little bit, a brand spanking new Grace Felix showed up on a guitar forum last winter. Missed out on that one.
Ditto on the knocking a raised speaker onto an instrument. I once forgot to re attach my B-15N's head to it's chassis and flipped the top. I have a little dent in my Mirecourt Bass from that mistake. Let's be careful out there.

Ric

 

[bassfacer22]

I've debated getting the Felix.. But for $1000 again, I'd be better off buying a PA speaker.. (QSC) etc.. That comes with the amp and speaker and is as clear as the Felix..

I've already spent $15,000 if not more for amps/speakers and pickups..

All I had to do was buy one pickup and a boutique PA speaker and I'd have been good to go..

Life lessons..

The stat-b vintage solved most of my problems but you need a really good luthier to make your bridge work properly.. Balancing issues etc.. And it does seem to slightly change over awhile but I believe it's because the cork and bridge are shifting or warping and humidity and all that.. Etc..

 

[flatback]

I just got word from Mr. Yamaya, that he is sending me the two element version of the Pickup (I had originally ordered the single version) for purposes of review and comparison and discussion here. I am super pleased that I will be able to try all the different combinations of the pickup especially into the Felix and MAS speakers and with the different mic's. I am very grateful to Mr. Yamaya for sending the extra pickup, and will post a full review here when I get it set up. Any installation tips you might have Mr. Arnopol, would be great.

 

[bassfacer22]

this quote says all...


Went through the 5 pages here and not a single photo of anything.. the video by Mike was nice though..

as for @flatback, I can't wait to hear your "phasing" stories with the Double Element version..

I have both the single and double element capsule version of the Stat-B vintage, so we could literally do a compare video against each others pickups..

sorry to sound commanding, but if you can, with the double element version, post a recording/picture/video using a Zoom H4n recording or something if you got one...

I may tell my current girlfriend to get one in Japan for me when she is home.. (got me one of those Japanese girls at the moment!)


(No, the picture isn't really her..)


I'm not quite sold yet on buying the Yamahiko.. mostly for volume reasons.. I have to play some louder type music, or some loud jazz etc.. ever played "Compared to What"? by Eddie Harris and Les McCann.. that kind of loud..

 

[Ric Vice]

I've debated getting the Felix.. But for $1000 again, I'd be better off buying a PA speaker.. (QSC) etc.. That comes with the amp and speaker and is as clear as the Felix..

I've already spent $15,000 if not more for amps/speakers and pickups..

All I had to do was buy one pickup and a boutique PA speaker and I'd have been good to go..

Life lessons..

The stat-b vintage solved most of my problems but you need a really good luthier to make your bridge work properly.. Balancing issues etc.. And it does seem to slightly change over awhile but I believe it's because the cork and bridge are shifting or warping and humidity and all that.. Etc..

Bass Facer,
That Walter Woods you own will get you a beautiful sound from almost most any decent pickup. The Stat B is a one of only a handfull of pickups, that actually sound like the bass it's installed on.

Since it's an Electrostatic device you can also get a good deal of volume out of the Schertler. As I mentioned, in a previous post, the original Stat B vintage had a pre amp with it's own ballance control,

so I can see where it would take a accomplished luthier to get the dual element version set up so that both elements were seated properly. I guess that's why I enjoy the convienence of the Ehrlund, cause

when it works you don't have any of the issues that you mention. Here's a picture of the Lieg Dual Element Electrostatic Pickup which is closely based on the original Schertler Stat B. Notice that their are dual gain controls one for the D-G strings and another for the A-E strings.

Ric

 

[bassfacer22]

Ric,

I don't know the Lieg pickup.. But now I want that dang it.. I have a need for that right now, as when I use the double element, the volume needs to be changed..