Zoom MS-60B+ (a compact B2-Four?)

[Zoot H Rollo]

MS-60B+ back in the fold.

An RC Bass Booster 2 and Genzler Magellan Preamp pedal brought the 60B+ back from the dead.

 

[needmorebasss]

The comps, like all the other effects or amps, are close to their analog inspirations but there are some subtle differences. I tend to use the 160 close to the end of a signal chain especially to tame envelope filter peaks. Monotone and Bassman are my most used amps but I do occasionally use others often for distortion or overdrive textures.

I ‘m really digging the Monotone. Glam comp + monotone + some reverb

 

[doran.dragic]

Hey folks,
had a strange thing happen on a gig last weekend and I can’t quite pin it down.


Setup:

• Bass → Zoom MS-60B+ → Radial StageBug SB-2 → stagebox → Allen & Heath digital mixer
• Running on fresh batteries in the Zoom
• Used this same rig many times before without problems on other mixers

What happened:

• Soundcheck was clean, no problems.
• During the first set the bass started distorting. I played with the same intesity I did at the soundcheck.
• Our sound guy (also the guitarist) didn’t notice right away, but when we checked after the set the signal was clearly distorted.
• Mixer meters showed signal “barely hitting yellow,” so according to him it wasn’t clipping on the desk.
• I pulled the Zoom out of the chain and went bass → SB-2 → stagebox → mixer. Distortion gone. Played the rest of the night clean.

Extra info:

• Even with a bypoass patch on the Zoom, the distortion was there.
• Tested the exact same setup at home (same bass, DI, cables, batteries) for an hour straight into my amp and my audio interface → no distortion.
• Pedal wasn’t hot, we were playing outside, so not a heat issue.
• I’ve also had other weird problems with this same Allen & Heath mixer before, so I used to think it was just gain staging.

So…
Is this some kind of incompatibility between the MS-60B+’s line-level output, the SB-2, and certain mixer inputs? A one-off digital hiccup in the Zoom? Anyone run into something similar?

ChatGPT says the the MS-60B+send out line level signal and that I should be using an TRS to XLR cable instead of the StageBug.

 

[Appogee]

That can happen when your batteries are running low (and, I would conjecture, if a power supply is failing, or you're plugged into the mains but drawing too much current from the circuit).

Sometimes, "fresh batteries" aren't. I suggest you check that out if you still have the batteries, and/or measure the output from your power supply.

 

[FretRiff]

Clipping has been reported here before.

Your observation that the distortion disappears when bypassing the Zoom entirely supports the idea that the pedal itself or its output level is causing the problem.

But the Allen & Heath mixer you’re using might have some input sensitivity or gain staging quirks that make it more prone to interacting poorly with certain pedal outputs, especially if you’ve had past weird problems with that mixer. If you can, try testing another mixer to see if it exhibits the same distortion.

Trying a TRS to XLR cable to the Radial instead of possibly an unbalanced cable through the StageBug might better match line level signals (but it doesn't explain why it's happening all of a sudden).

 

[mikeynets]

That can happen when your batteries are running low (and, I would conjecture, if a power supply is failing, or you're plugged into the mains but drawing too much current from the circuit).

Sometimes, "fresh batteries" aren't. I suggest you check that out if you still have the batteries, and/or measure the output from your power supply.

Not exactly related to your situation, but I was using fresh alkaline batteries in my MS60B+ and was surprised how quickly they drained. Another TBer mentioned that is common and that Lith ion fair better. On that note, there are settings in the MS60B+ for what type of battery you are using, and also screen brightness and a power saving setting. It's possible the batteries just drained faster than expected and caused erratic behavior.

Another data point: Occasionally I notice that some patches I've made with amp sims, pre-amps or drives seem to behave a little differently from time to time — a little "gainier" once in a while but if I cycle through patches and/or turn on/off effects it will settle back to the expected level. I have no explanation for this one!

 

[GotGroove]

Clipping has been reported here before.

That's another pedal.

back OT: I run mine through a SB-2 as well using normal cables and haven't encountered any issues. I'm inclined to agree with @Appogee suggesting the batteries might be used, old or not completely charged. Batteries don't stay 'fresh' forever even when not used. For this reason I always charge 2 fresh sets a day before a rehearsal or show.

 

[doran.dragic]

Regarding the batteries, I do the same. I use a set of lithium rechargeables and it's a rather new set too. I always charge them a day before a concert.

Our sound man suggested the same. He thought it's the batteries. So when I came home I used the same set of batteries to test the issue. The MS-60B+ran for hours without any issues and after that I ruled out the batteries.

Your observation that the distortion disappears when bypassing the Zoom entirely supports the idea that the pedal itself or its output level is causing the problem.

But the Allen & Heath mixer you’re using might have some input sensitivity or gain staging quirks that make it more prone to interacting poorly with certain pedal outputs, especially if you’ve had past weird problems with that mixer. If you can, try testing another mixer to see if it exhibits the same distortion.

Trying a TRS to XLR cable to the Radial instead of possibly an unbalanced cable through the StageBug might better match line level signals (but it doesn't explain why it's happening all of a sudden).

Sorry I think I wasn't clear. The distortion didn't disappear when the Zoom was in bypass (all patches turned off). The distortion disappeared only after I removed the Zoom and plugged straight into the D.I.

Also regarding the TRS to XLR, ChatGPT suggested I bypass the StageBug and plug directly into the stage box.

 

[GotGroove]

So when I came home I used the same set of batteries to test the issue. The MS-60B+ran for hours without any issues and after that I ruled out the batteries.

Did you run it through the SB at home as well? If so, and you had no issues, the only other variable seems to be the stagebox on that gig. Might be a
bad /damaged input or cable?

 

[doran.dragic]

Did you run it through the SB at home as well? If so, and you had no issues, the only other variable seems to be the stagebox on that gig. Might be a
bad /damaged input or cable?

I did, I used the StageBug and the same XLR cable.

 

[bassbrad]

Hey folks,
had a strange thing happen on a gig last weekend and I can’t quite pin it down.


Setup:

• Bass → Zoom MS-60B+ → Radial StageBug SB-2 → stagebox → Allen & Heath digital mixer
• Running on fresh batteries in the Zoom
• Used this same rig many times before without problems on other mixers

What happened:

• Soundcheck was clean, no problems.
• During the first set the bass started distorting. I played with the same intesity I did at the soundcheck.
• Our sound guy (also the guitarist) didn’t notice right away, but when we checked after the set the signal was clearly distorted.
• Mixer meters showed signal “barely hitting yellow,” so according to him it wasn’t clipping on the desk.
• I pulled the Zoom out of the chain and went bass → SB-2 → stagebox → mixer. Distortion gone. Played the rest of the night clean.

Extra info:

• Even with a bypoass patch on the Zoom, the distortion was there.
• Tested the exact same setup at home (same bass, DI, cables, batteries) for an hour straight into my amp and my audio interface → no distortion.
• Pedal wasn’t hot, we were playing outside, so not a heat issue.
• I’ve also had other weird problems with this same Allen & Heath mixer before, so I used to think it was just gain staging.

So…
Is this some kind of incompatibility between the MS-60B+’s line-level output, the SB-2, and certain mixer inputs? A one-off digital hiccup in the Zoom? Anyone run into something similar?

ChatGPT says the the MS-60B+send out line level signal and that I should be using an TRS to XLR cable instead of the StageBug.

I tried using rechargeable AA, AAA and 9v batteries that caused a lot of issues like the one you describe. Instead I'm using a power bank to the usb jack that has not been an issue to date. Using the power bank for the MS60B+, Zoom Q2HD and apple iPad air and can get several sessions or gigs on a charge.
FWIW the @Pedalnetics DIm Stick is excellent.

 

[GotGroove]

I tried using rechargeable AA, AAA and 9v batteries that caused a lot of issues like the one you describe. Instead I'm using a power bank to the usb jack that has not been an issue to date.

I never had such issues so far. Rechargeable or not, my batteries (and the 60B+) behave as they should. I just have the habit of never using used batteries. I just can't trust them to last as long as I want them to. So I charge 2 sets before every show. Recently I've been using powerbanks more often. At first I only used it with my B6, but now that I have a few spare adapters (and a more powerful powerbank), I use it a lot more. Just because it's more convenient, not because of any battery issues I have or had. Anyway, back on topic:

I've seen this issue pop up a few times now in several other threads. I'm starting to wonder if there's any particular brand or amperage people are using that's causing these issues. I just find it odd that I never have such issues, yet I see a lot of people that do.

For me, I generally want them to be at least 2500mA. As for brands, I stick to whatever's available locally. Most of them are Panasonic Eneloop (took me a while to find a store that sells them but eventually all the others AA(A) batteries I have will be replaced by these. I love em), some Varta's, but I also have a few IKEA ones (I know, I know, I needed a few spares fast, ok?) and they all perform well so far (yes even the IKEA ones).

So what types of batteries are you all using that are causing these issues?

 

[doran.dragic]

I wanted to share an update.

Had a gig yesterday with the same band and the same mixing desk.

There was no proper sound check so I wasn't able to try out any different options.

I used a 1/4" to XLR adapter and went straight into the stage box, bypassing the D.I. I had no problem whatsover.

However, I also lowered the output level on the Zoom from 100 to 55 (factory setting).

Maybe if I have more time at the next gig I'll try lowered output into the D.I. to determine if the problem was in fact the output level or the pairing of the Zoom and the StageBug.

 

[cashews]

Looking for a good rock sound for my pj. Any recommendations or tips?

Edit: I run my ms60b+ into a Broughton HPF

 

[DJ Bebop]

Looking for a good rock sound for my pj. Any recommendations or tips?

Edit: I run my ms60b+ into a Broughton HPF

SVT or Fliptop with perhaps a boost or drive pedal before that in a chain, maybe a compressor or limiter in there too.

 

[cashews]

SVT or Fliptop with perhaps a boost or drive pedal before that in a chain, maybe a compressor or limiter in there too.

Thanks, I'll start there and see what I can come up with.

 

[InkCow]

Looking for a good rock sound for my pj. Any recommendations or tips?

Edit: I run my ms60b+ into a Broughton HPF

If you prefer a clean sound: Glam Compressor + DI Plus Preamp with color on.

Also, the MS60B+ has a HPF: the Low EQ effect can be set as either a shelf or high pass filter.

 

[nonohmic]

What does the Dark Overdrive sound like. Does it do a good job emulating the Darkglass pedal?

 

[FretRiff]

What does the Dark Overdrive sound like.

The 4 overdrives are briefly compared here.

 

[nonohmic]

The 4 overdrives are briefly compared here.

Sick, thanks

Blueberry and dark overdrive sound good to me!