As a drummer, my response to that would be, how would you like to play a bass with buttons rather than strings?
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2 Types of bassists it seems....
- Thread starter coffinbuilder
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As a drummer, my response to that would be, how would you like to play a bass with buttons rather than strings?
Of course there are whole octaves of stuff guitars don't touch...and neither do a lot of commercial bass cabs, and that includes a lot of these so-called monsters. The cabs are big, but there are too many drivers (15's or 18's) in those cabs (for the internal cab volume) to really go very low...perceptions aside.
And it begs the question...Why would you want to play with guitarists that want to ruin your tone? Seems to me a lot of this "need" has to do with battling egos, not gear.
And I'd really hate to be the guy hauling around a subwoofer with a concrete cab.
yeah, who would drag a concrete cabinet around? Doom metal bands? as far as guitarists and egos, thats breaking no new ground. I am speaking as a reformed midrange hog. I once had a guitarist say to me, "its like you are saying everything and I cant get a word in edgewise". After my own ego cooled down over the years I realized that I am not the worlds greatest bassist (maybe one or two guys better...) myabe I should focus on the low end and leave the rest of the real estate to the guitards.
I wish that little cabs with modern tech could replace the horn loaded and multi driver insanity of the 70's but to me its like car gas mileage. It hasnt really changed that much in 30 years even with all the new tech.
For what it's worth, I use D'Addario Chrome flatwounds with a pick. I don't use distortion, I boost a lot of upper bass and lo-mid and I fit in my own sonic space that my guitarist can't touch. Of course, I"m just playing the classic rock of the 70's, 80's, etc. not downtuned doom metal.
Yet if I really wanted to sit down below the guitarist completely, I'd have to build a dedicated subwoofer that is capable of producing a true fundamental, because there is very little out there that does, no matter how much you turn up your "bass" knob.
And a whole lot has changed with speaker design since the 70's. Perhaps you weren't paying attention in class.
And I never said anyone shouldn't have a lot of drivers or play insanely loud (I find it kind of fun myself). I only said that we don't have to rely on old, outdated and HEAVY designs to get there.I could load up a truckload of 3015LF loaded cabs and compare it to the volume and deep lows of any "vintage" rig you guys could manage to dig up off craigslist, and I'll haul these "little cabs with modern tech" all by myself and blow your old 100+ lb., 3/4" boxes to bits.
But hey, if you like hauling it, enjoy! Makes no difference to me. I'm just a curious person wanting to know; Why all the devotion to heavy cabs? I still haven't heard an answer that satisfies me. I've only heard that only the old heavy stuff works but I haven't heard why that's so. I'm not talking about comparing these mammoth rigs to a little combo. I'm talking straight up comparison of modern, lightweight designs that deliver the same volume and sound as the old stuff, but at perhaps as much as 1/4 the weight, and at least half as much.
I'm thinking some people who prefer the old heavy cabs may not even realize just how good we bass players have it with "modern" technology these days. Now that I could understand.
It's not like I don't know what this old stuff is like. I've been playing for over 30 years. I still have a Peavey 1820 (now that is a mud machine...loud but terrible) and a Peavey 115BXBW. Both weigh over 100 lbs. and yet my little 38 lb. 215 cab has more clarity, more punch and is louder than either of those old pieces of junk. Granted the 1820 goes deeper, but so does an echo in the Grand Canyon...and they both sound equally appealing. If I wanted a cab to go deeper, I could certainly build one that outdoes the 1820 at a fraction of the weight.
One thing that got brought up and quickly thrown to the wayside is that you can get a lot of these older cabs for dirt cheap.
That was one of my answer selections in a previous question I posted. That makes sense. I can understand that completely.
I use and Ampeg B50R and sometimes a B100R combo. For the venues I play (both small rooms and large stages) I have just not needed anymore. I used to have a Kustom Groovebass 210 combo (600 watts) that was just overkill. The problem with high watt rigs is you have to get them so loud to get any type of useable tone. With a smaller amp I can push it, get a great sound, and not blow away the audience and piss off whoever hires us. Our guitarist is of the same philosophy, so it works. He plays 5 watt, sometimes 10 watt combos or rigs that sounds great, hot, but are not deafeningly loud.
Hi all, as usual, just 2 cents worth here. Personally, I like 200 watts rms thru a 1x15, or 2x12, tuned cabinet. I make my own cabinets, and may take a year to get it as close to perfect as I can. Seems like the volume goes WAY up when I get there. And, yes, dogue, I use 3/4" plywood. (But hey, I AM a cabinet maker)
And since when is 200 watts "small"? I honestly do not care what anybody else runs. Just use the right tool for the job. I don't use a 20 ounce framing hammer to eat peas. At 200 watts, I rarely turn it past 7, even with the loudest drummer.
And since when is 200 watts "small"? I honestly do not care what anybody else runs. Just use the right tool for the job. I don't use a 20 ounce framing hammer to eat peas. At 200 watts, I rarely turn it past 7, even with the loudest drummer.
I'm a fan of both. It depends on the gig. If I'm doing a rock gig in a cavern of a club or an outdoor fest give me that megawatt wall of 810's and 215's. If I'm doing a blues or fusion gig a tight and compact 100watts is the way. There's always the XLR out to the PA, if you really need to stop heartbeats and liquidate brain tissue without killing off your band mates.
If you're a guy who wants a big massive sound, you can get the same thing by having a good PAThat's my thinking and it's always panned out that way. Having tons of stage volume makes a mess of mics which often makes your PA sound like crap.
If your stage sound rules and your PA sound sucks, the crowd sure isn't going to care
+1
More is better.
I have no plans of using anything less than 2 or 3 large cabs for a long time, and if I had the money/a reason to have more I would. Hearing the bass isn't enough for me and for the genres of music I'm currently playing, volume so loud it moves every bit of air in the room and everyone in a room can feel the vibrations through their whole body is a must. And in my experience, seeing bands use 15 cab or more backlines in 400 person capacity bars, the bands using massive backline volume over letting the PA do the heavy lifting always sound better.
sell some of those needless cabs and you can afford a new van for your band.
My entire rig cost well under a grand. Nowhere near enough for a van. Try again.
And who exactly are you to tell me what I need and don't need?
Here's my experience with amps over 20 years of playing:
Living in Colorado - a.k.a. life with a CAR
14 years old:
Refrigerator sized folded horn cabinet with 800 watt head.
23 years old:
4x10 cab with 1x15 or 2x10 cab and 700 watt head (this was while I was touring and could carry it around the equipment van)
28 years old:
Ditched the extension cab went with the 4x10 only
Living in New York City - a.k.a. life on the subway
33 years old:
Markbass F1 and 2x10 cabinet as my "big" rig
34 years old:
Orange 25 Watt amp for my practice rig.
Why the big change? Two reasons... age (sure I'm not old, but being in my mid thirties I'm just not gonna haul big amps anymore)
and THE CITY!!
Most venues in Colorado were twice the size as the venues in NYC. Also, since most of us are riding around on the subway, the clubs furnish a backline. And believe me, even if it's a Behringer POS it's better than hauling your bass and amp on the train. When I do need to bring my own amp the Markbass rig MORE than covers it.
Would I like to have and SVT rig behind me? Heck yeah!! Am I gonna haul that around New York? No way! And an SVT would decimate the low ceiling, narrow clubs that are all over NYC.
Living in Colorado - a.k.a. life with a CAR
14 years old:
Refrigerator sized folded horn cabinet with 800 watt head.
23 years old:
4x10 cab with 1x15 or 2x10 cab and 700 watt head (this was while I was touring and could carry it around the equipment van)
28 years old:
Ditched the extension cab went with the 4x10 only
Living in New York City - a.k.a. life on the subway
33 years old:
Markbass F1 and 2x10 cabinet as my "big" rig
34 years old:
Orange 25 Watt amp for my practice rig.
Why the big change? Two reasons... age (sure I'm not old, but being in my mid thirties I'm just not gonna haul big amps anymore)
and THE CITY!!
Most venues in Colorado were twice the size as the venues in NYC. Also, since most of us are riding around on the subway, the clubs furnish a backline. And believe me, even if it's a Behringer POS it's better than hauling your bass and amp on the train. When I do need to bring my own amp the Markbass rig MORE than covers it.
Would I like to have and SVT rig behind me? Heck yeah!! Am I gonna haul that around New York? No way! And an SVT would decimate the low ceiling, narrow clubs that are all over NYC.
Maybe I should start going around TB telling everyone with 2xwhatever rigs that they NEED MOAR. 
Or there's the novel idea of living and let live, and accepting that different genres/bands call for different rigs/volume needs/etc and that one size never fits all.
Yeah, I'm liking that idea more. Now if only it would catch on...
Or there's the novel idea of living and let live, and accepting that different genres/bands call for different rigs/volume needs/etc and that one size never fits all.
Yeah, I'm liking that idea more. Now if only it would catch on...
When you gig regularly and rehearse 3, 4 times a week then a massive rig gets tedious FAST. I've gone backwards and forwards on size for a while but have found the goldilocks rig that does what I want - gets a tubey vintage tone, as much volume and clarity I need for any gig (I almost always gig with a PA) and gives me the 1 trip load out for rehearsals:
Mesa Walkabout with 2 x Aggy DB112's
... then again I guess it depends on the sort of music you play. If I played Doom Shredcore with my bass drop tuned to Z flat then my rig probably wouldn't cut it.
then you'd be surprised... thankfully most places have backlines so no one really worries about that stuff.
kinda funny, but arlene's grocery used to have that new TC Elec 450 head and 2x10/2x12 stack, which was fine, but i remember returning a few days later, and already, the cabs were replaced w/ a pair of ampeg 410s. go figure...
totally agree...
if anyone's seen "a place to bury strangers", then you too know this sensation...
