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Am I the jerk?

#61
You’re only a jerk if you act without talking to your band mate of nine years. I don’t know why people are so reluctant to open their mouths and talk things through.

Just be honest, the band is changing and it’s no longer what you signed up for. This isn’t Euclidean geometry; either you find a mutually satisfactory arrangement or you move on. No need for drama.
 
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#62
DJS said:
(4 hour drive, not a great venue, $300 split 8 ways)
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arbiterusa said:
OP, reread what you wrote here and tell us why anybody would stick with an outfit like this. $37.50 for eight hours of driving, never mind playing. Your BL must be a hell of a salesman.
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8 hours driving.... plus another 2 for setup/teardown (VERY generous estimate), and another 4 hours playing/breaks... for $37.50. If you think your time is worth more than $2.67/hr, and you should, it's no surprise you're unhappy with the circumstances.

I'd get out of that situation ASAP. It sounds like you think the BL might be ready to move on without you. Let him.
 
#64
DJS said:
The band I've been in for 9 years, once more of a hobby, now more serious, has been an increasingly challenging obligation. BL and I are the only original members, and since BL has retired, he's recruited some better musicians and set some lofty, sometimes unrealistic goals. He's gotten us some great gigs, the new members are inspiring and good people. We're practicing more, longer hours, all good things in theory. But he’s just nonstop.

I sensed this shift earlier in the year and scaled back (all but dropped) my other passion, cycling, (after training all winter for the season) thinking it might be ok to focus more on music for the time being given the situation with the band. One can't do it all. Plus, TBH, the cycling can be restarted again.

Well, life happens. I've had a busy year with my almost adult children, traveling to help them move out of town, solve more complex life problems, etc. Recently we decided to sell our house. So it's been a mad scramble getting that ready. Throughout it all, it’s still been possible to practice and keep up with band obligations.

BL booked a questionable out of town show (4 hour drive, not a great venue, $300 split 8 ways) this coming Saturday. It’s killing me to lose a Saturday for this, but fine, part of the deal with being in a band, we weren’t too busy when booked, plus it’s for charity.

We’ve been talking about recording for 2 months. I get informed yesterday that recording starts the Sunday after this out of town show. All day. I was surprised, and it seems so was the drummer. We had talked about recording “that week” and “on the same days we practice” but never locked down a time. It’s possible, verbally or non-verbally, some loose agreement was made to record that day, but I have no recollection of it. Nonetheless, recording was apparently scheduled without so much as a “Hey – you good with recording all day Sunday after that out of town Saturday show?” I’ve been pretty clear about being maxxed out with the upcoming move, which starts a few days after.

I can’t do it. I can’t lose a whole weekend, with a moving truck coming 3 days after, and declined. Well, recording hinged on getting drums and bass down first, then the rest of the week for others. (It’s not a studio, but BL’s house with a recording engineer.) BL says “he might have to be a d!ck” about this and get a sub or “he might have to be a d!ck” to everyone else and reschedule. That was fine with me - do what's best for the band. Then silence. The band slack is normally chatty, but is now quiet. Who knows what’s being said now offline. Simultaneously, I feel like I’ve let them down, and also this was quite unreasonable. Any thoughts?
Click to expand...


I don't think any of the specifics matter, if the project evolves such that it's a bad fit anymore, you have to decide what makes you the most happy.

I left a labor of love project about a year ago. I was playing with one of my bucket list players, all his original material. The band sounded tremendous. But things changed. Slid sideways on me, and I was miserable. It took me months to decide, but I left. I felt as though a weight was lifted off. But what I did was to tell them, "Please replace me." I continued to play with them until they found a guy, and made myself available if they needed bass for anything else. My initial replacement bailed on them, and they needed me to fill in while they found someone else. They were friends and I wanted to keep them friends, so I stepped up.

But leaving was something I needed to do for me, and I feel great about it.
 
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#65
DJS said:
The band I've been in for 9 years, once more of a hobby, now more serious, has been an increasingly challenging obligation. BL and I are the only original members, and since BL has retired, he's recruited some better musicians and set some lofty, sometimes unrealistic goals. He's gotten us some great gigs, the new members are inspiring and good people. We're practicing more, longer hours, all good things in theory. But he’s just nonstop.

I sensed this shift earlier in the year and scaled back (all but dropped) my other passion, cycling, (after training all winter for the season) thinking it might be ok to focus more on music for the time being given the situation with the band. One can't do it all. Plus, TBH, the cycling can be restarted again.

Well, life happens. I've had a busy year with my almost adult children, traveling to help them move out of town, solve more complex life problems, etc. Recently we decided to sell our house. So it's been a mad scramble getting that ready. Throughout it all, it’s still been possible to practice and keep up with band obligations.

BL booked a questionable out of town show (4 hour drive, not a great venue, $300 split 8 ways) this coming Saturday. It’s killing me to lose a Saturday for this, but fine, part of the deal with being in a band, we weren’t too busy when booked, plus it’s for charity.

We’ve been talking about recording for 2 months. I get informed yesterday that recording starts the Sunday after this out of town show. All day. I was surprised, and it seems so was the drummer. We had talked about recording “that week” and “on the same days we practice” but never locked down a time. It’s possible, verbally or non-verbally, some loose agreement was made to record that day, but I have no recollection of it. Nonetheless, recording was apparently scheduled without so much as a “Hey – you good with recording all day Sunday after that out of town Saturday show?” I’ve been pretty clear about being maxxed out with the upcoming move, which starts a few days after.

I can’t do it. I can’t lose a whole weekend, with a moving truck coming 3 days after, and declined. Well, recording hinged on getting drums and bass down first, then the rest of the week for others. (It’s not a studio, but BL’s house with a recording engineer.) BL says “he might have to be a d!ck” about this and get a sub or “he might have to be a d!ck” to everyone else and reschedule. That was fine with me - do what's best for the band. Then silence. The band slack is normally chatty, but is now quiet. Who knows what’s being said now offline. Simultaneously, I feel like I’ve let them down, and also this was quite unreasonable. Any thoughts?
Click to expand...


Say goodbye!
 
#66
Talk it out. A lot of the studios I've recorded in did the bass after the guitars, or others. Maybe one of the guitarists, or others ( 8-way split?), can go in and you can go when it's more convenient for you. Or, if you're ready, pop in for a couple hours, nail your parts and leave.

If everyone is happy with the band, compromises can be found. If you're not happy, then bail, but do it gracefully.
 
#67
DJS said:
The band I've been in for 9 years, once more of a hobby, now more serious, has been an increasingly challenging obligation. BL and I are the only original members, and since BL has retired, he's recruited some better musicians and set some lofty, sometimes unrealistic goals. He's gotten us some great gigs, the new members are inspiring and good people. We're practicing more, longer hours, all good things in theory. But he’s just nonstop.

I sensed this shift earlier in the year and scaled back (all but dropped) my other passion, cycling, (after training all winter for the season) thinking it might be ok to focus more on music for the time being given the situation with the band. One can't do it all. Plus, TBH, the cycling can be restarted again.

Well, life happens. I've had a busy year with my almost adult children, traveling to help them move out of town, solve more complex life problems, etc. Recently we decided to sell our house. So it's been a mad scramble getting that ready. Throughout it all, it’s still been possible to practice and keep up with band obligations.

BL booked a questionable out of town show (4 hour drive, not a great venue, $300 split 8 ways) this coming Saturday. It’s killing me to lose a Saturday for this, but fine, part of the deal with being in a band, we weren’t too busy when booked, plus it’s for charity.

We’ve been talking about recording for 2 months. I get informed yesterday that recording starts the Sunday after this out of town show. All day. I was surprised, and it seems so was the drummer. We had talked about recording “that week” and “on the same days we practice” but never locked down a time. It’s possible, verbally or non-verbally, some loose agreement was made to record that day, but I have no recollection of it. Nonetheless, recording was apparently scheduled without so much as a “Hey – you good with recording all day Sunday after that out of town Saturday show?” I’ve been pretty clear about being maxxed out with the upcoming move, which starts a few days after.

I can’t do it. I can’t lose a whole weekend, with a moving truck coming 3 days after, and declined. Well, recording hinged on getting drums and bass down first, then the rest of the week for others. (It’s not a studio, but BL’s house with a recording engineer.) BL says “he might have to be a d!ck” about this and get a sub or “he might have to be a d!ck” to everyone else and reschedule. That was fine with me - do what's best for the band. Then silence. The band slack is normally chatty, but is now quiet. Who knows what’s being said now offline. Simultaneously, I feel like I’ve let them down, and also this was quite unreasonable. Any thoughts?
Click to expand...
Nope, you are not the jerk, just have life-stuff happening. Might be time for a band meeting, just to see if everyone has the same commitment level, you might not be the only one feeling overwhelmed or pressured. Could also talk with one or two of the other band members to get a feel with where they are with all of it, might be helpful.

I will only dedicate one day a week on average to band stuff, whether that is a gig or a rehearsal. That is an average, not a hard line, but that is what keeps it enjoyable to me, too much more and it becomes not fun. If that means losing my spot in the band, so be it, something else will come along that is a better fit, IMHO. Best wishes
 
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#68
DJS said:
Nope! Haven't been 20 for a good while. Hello fellow bassist/cyclist! I don't know many. Or any, really. What's your specialty? Mine is being mid pack filler in masters road and CX events.
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Cyclocross? Nice! I know that there's a few other cyclists here on TB. I don't remember who he is, but one member owns a bike shop. Haha Maybe we should start a club!

I can't really say that I have a specialty, really. I own a mountain bike, a road bike, and a fixie all of which I ride depending on which is in the best working order. Aside from the occasional century, I don't really do any organized events. On the occasions that I do train, it's usually for a big climb. I live in Southern California, and we have some good-sized mountain roads here. My little fantasy right now is to someday do Angeles Crest Highway, but I would need an appropriately-geared bike as well as being in super-awesome condition for a ride like that. Last year I averaged 125-150 miles/wk on my fixie. This year hasn't been as good for me - I had a back injury in January, and in April I had some health issues that landed me the hospital for a few days. I'm gradually making a recovery from that, thank goodness.
 
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#69
Looks like I’m the only one on the BL side. Maybe because I’m a bit far from retirement.
Most of the bands I have been they were mostly started by me, and most of them ended because of un-commitment from one of the members. Not saying your not committed in any way.
I find it inspirational someone in its advanced age wanting to go a bit further than just Sunday jam.
Life happens to everyone and we all deal with it, and I find it hard to believe the BL and the other 6 elements aren’t sympathetic with your situation. Unless there’s an hidden agenda.

It was stated that when it stops being fun, get out. Sound like some quitter talk, and promoting mediocrity. It’s never a sea of roses; adversity happen and eventually endurance will pay out.
 
#70
Jeff Hughes said:
Is it me or does it seem like every recording project for original music with a band of people over the age of 25 is purely for personal documentation rather than a platform for fame or money?
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If you’re a) not already famous and b) sane, then I’d say yes.

Based on the number of posts I see here, where bassists are in the exact scenario you describe, and are not clear that their band won’t ever “make it”, it’s obvious that not everyone is on the same page as us lol.

Especially these days. Seems like people became more delusional after being cooped up for a year.
 
#71
Astronaut said:
I find it inspirational someone in its advanced age wanting to go a bit further than just Sunday jam.
Click to expand...

Odd. I’d argue that it’s more delusional than inspirational. But based on the rest of your post we have drastically different views on the prospects of a band in their 30s “making it” in 2021.

From my experience, if you’re trying to break out in a band, and are in your mid 30s (or older) and don’t already have a huge following, you just won’t.

At best you can play local gigs. Maybe make decent cash that way. But you’ll never be famous or have a profile that demands the commitment you’ve mentioned.
 
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#73
tbz said:
Odd. I’d argue that it’s more delusional than inspirational. But based on the rest of your post we have drastically different views on the prospects of a band in their 30s “making it” in 2021.

From my experience, if you’re trying to break out in a band, and are in your mid 30s (or older) and don’t already have a huge following, you just won’t.

At best you can play local gigs. Maybe make decent cash that way. But you’ll never be famous or have a profile that demands the commitment you’ve mentioned.
Click to expand...

Exactly, delusional or inspirational is a matter of perspective, just like “making it” depends on ones objectives.
 
#74
No offense intended and not to make too much "lite" of your situation but...It furthers the old adage about musicians who will pack up an $800 car with $2000 worth of gear, drive 100 miles and get paid $75. Fill in your own numbers on the (8-way?) split. Follow your heart my man.
 
#75
DJS said:
Simultaneously, I feel like I’ve let them down...
Click to expand...
No. Don't even go there. First of all, $300 split 8 ways? Nope, I'm not doing that at all. 4 Hours is a long way for charity and a bad split.

Second, and supremely more important, you got the move going on. That is #1 priority. Period. I just spent all of June moving from one house to another. I made it very clear to my band that the five bookings that month (and into July for another 5) were it for me, there is no way I had any time for rehearsing anything (because it was our first time back since NYE 2019 - covid and all) because of the move. They already got 5 of the 30 days I had available to do the move, that was it. And you know what? We've played better all month than we ever did pre-covid.

Stick to your guns re: the move. That's infinitely more important than a $37.50 gig and recording all the next day.
 
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#77
Beyond the communication breakdown...

The Three Parts of the Gig:

The Tunes

The Hang

The Ca$h

All of these elements must be in proportional alignment for any gig to workout...

If the Hang is GREAT, the Tunes are OK then the Ca$h is of much less importance. This is how six dudes jump into a VW Commbie and "tour" with the tip jar, frozen burrito's and don't shower for ten days.

If the Tunes are Great, the Ca$h is OK then as long as you don't want to strangle anyone the Hang can and will be dealt with for a long time.

If the Ca$h is Great the Hang doesn't matter and you'll play any Tunes at least for awhile!

When the Tunes, the Hang and the Ca$h are all GREAT then look around, because "you've made it, baby!" ;)
 
#78
You need to have a good honest conversation. Something that begins with something like....

"You're retired. I'm not. You may have time for X, Y, and Z, but I don't. I can do X, sometimes Y, and never Z"

Just tell him what you can commit to, and what you can't. If that isn't enough for him, it's in his court to tell you, and you gracefully exit.

Knowing your limitations and setting boundaries is not "being a dick" - It's being healthy. Someone telling you that they've decided what you're going to do without checking with your first? That's the dick move.
 

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