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Am I the jerk?

#101
Seanto said:
Also, no way in hell i am driving 4 hours to a charity gig to be paid less than gas money.
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YES!! I've started turning down shows where I only get $100 ($400 split 4 ways). Band's have been getting paid this amount for over 40 years now and it has to change! The only way it will change is if bands start refusing to accept it.

Now, I will only play for $100 at the non-smoking venues where we typically get $100 - $250 in tips. I will not fight off bronchitis and feel like total crap the next day from nicotine overdose, for pocket change!
 
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#103
4SG said:
No, you're not being a jerk. Yes, the scheduling is unrealistic and oppressive. But you and the BL have been together for 9 YEARS. Missing from the post is the part where you sat down with your bandmate of nearly a decade and had a calm discussion about his overzealousness. If you make that effort and get the wrong answer then you'll know for sure who the jerk is.

View attachment 4339299
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GOONIE GOO GOO!!
 
#106
DJS said:
The band I've been in for 9 years, once more of a hobby, now more serious, has been an increasingly challenging obligation. BL and I are the only original members, and since BL has retired, he's recruited some better musicians and set some lofty, sometimes unrealistic goals. He's gotten us some great gigs, the new members are inspiring and good people. We're practicing more, longer hours, all good things in theory. But he’s just nonstop.

I sensed this shift earlier in the year and scaled back (all but dropped) my other passion, cycling, (after training all winter for the season) thinking it might be ok to focus more on music for the time being given the situation with the band. One can't do it all. Plus, TBH, the cycling can be restarted again.

Well, life happens. I've had a busy year with my almost adult children, traveling to help them move out of town, solve more complex life problems, etc. Recently we decided to sell our house. So it's been a mad scramble getting that ready. Throughout it all, it’s still been possible to practice and keep up with band obligations.

BL booked a questionable out of town show (4 hour drive, not a great venue, $300 split 8 ways) this coming Saturday. It’s killing me to lose a Saturday for this, but fine, part of the deal with being in a band, we weren’t too busy when booked, plus it’s for charity.

We’ve been talking about recording for 2 months. I get informed yesterday that recording starts the Sunday after this out of town show. All day. I was surprised, and it seems so was the drummer. We had talked about recording “that week” and “on the same days we practice” but never locked down a time. It’s possible, verbally or non-verbally, some loose agreement was made to record that day, but I have no recollection of it. Nonetheless, recording was apparently scheduled without so much as a “Hey – you good with recording all day Sunday after that out of town Saturday show?” I’ve been pretty clear about being maxxed out with the upcoming move, which starts a few days after.

I can’t do it. I can’t lose a whole weekend, with a moving truck coming 3 days after, and declined. Well, recording hinged on getting drums and bass down first, then the rest of the week for others. (It’s not a studio, but BL’s house with a recording engineer.) BL says “he might have to be a d!ck” about this and get a sub or “he might have to be a d!ck” to everyone else and reschedule. That was fine with me - do what's best for the band. Then silence. The band slack is normally chatty, but is now quiet. Who knows what’s being said now offline. Simultaneously, I feel like I’ve let them down, and also this was quite unreasonable. Any thoughts?
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Do you need to be there for a recording? I mean, bass right?
DI signal recorded in an interface at home is nowadays as good as in studios, so... no need to be in studio precisely Sunday.
Or Pre-record a phantom track to help the drummer and you re-record your bass track later when you have time, right?
I don't see any issue here, don't feel bad.
 
#107
Seanto said:
The only way this is justified is if this band is on a definitive upward trajectory where not striking the match now would seriously stifle that momentum. But i highly doubt this is actually the case. All i can say is that if this were me, i could not commit to this project because the effort level sounds really high for little payoff. Also, no way in hell i am driving 4 hours to a charity gig to be paid less than gas money.
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This, as well as other responses sums it up pretty well.

I've done the 4-6 hour drive for a gig with sub-par pay before, where I even had to foot my own hotel bill but it was with a special lineup of people I would not typically get to play with, and one of the guys was an old friend dying of cancer with less than a year left.

At this point with more and more " adult responsibilities " and lower energy levels I would not consider being part of a project that put routine demands like far away gigs and all day/weekend recording sessions on my schedule. It sucks, but I just wouldn't have the energy or time for that and my day job, and thats not even bringing kids into the picture (don't have any fortunately or unfortunately).

At the end of the day a band or project should be fun and not a source of stress. Once it starts being a source of stress it's time to bail.

Also, there are far too many stories like this of bands consisting of older guys and there being lofty goals like gigs 5 hours away for little pay. On the one hand I get it, no one wants to give up the dream, and playing is fun, but on the other hand I think folks just aren't dealing with the reality of their lives and others lives.
 
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#109
I have this thing I do when things get heated over messages - text messages, slack, messenger, email, whatever text based medium - where I pick up my phone and call the person to talk using my voice. If I think you're being a jerk, or I think you think I'm being a jerk ... probably we need to talk with voices.

Probably you both have good intentions, and something is getting lost in the medium of communication. Talk to the guy, and listen to him.
 
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#110
$300 /8 with a 4 hr x 2 way drive is an unrealistic obligation ( unless all 8 people involved) agree to it.

I play with lots of retirees- they know my ability to do some gigs is not the same as mine because I’m still in the working world.
 
#111
Ask him what his goals are? Try to be realistic. How many ska bands full of guys in their 50s-60s make it big? Ska peaked 20 plus years ago. I am sure there is a niche market but driving you all crazy trying to chase some unrealistic goal is absurd. Have fun with it until its not fun anymore.
 
#112
YOU'RE MOVING in a few days for crying out loud. And I'm guessing it's not out of your dorm room.

Someone has blinders on and it's going to hurt when he takes them off or someone rips them off of him. If he is truly talented and has a real moneymaking musical future ahead of him, this is part of his learning process - jettisoning sidemen that can't give him what he needs just now.
 
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#115
DJS said:
BL booked a questionable out of town show (4 hour drive, not a great venue, $300 split 8 ways) this coming Saturday. It’s killing me to lose a Saturday for this, but fine, part of the deal with being in a band, we weren’t too busy when booked, plus it’s for charity.

I can’t do it. I can’t lose a whole weekend, with a moving truck coming 3 days after, and declined. Well, recording hinged on getting drums and bass down first, then the rest of the week for others. (It’s not a studio, but BL’s house with a recording engineer.) BL says “he might have to be a d!ck” about this and get a sub or “he might have to be a d!ck” to everyone else and reschedule. That was fine with me - do what's best for the band. Then silence. The band slack is normally chatty, but is now quiet. Who knows what’s being said now offline. Simultaneously, I feel like I’ve let them down, and also this was quite unreasonable. Any thoughts?
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If the BL "has to be a dick", tell him that you "might have to be a dick" and stand up to his BS. He's the only one who's retired, right? If so, remind him that the rest of you have other obligations and can't do the band thing full-time.

$37.50 each, eh? Now you can get that operation.
 
#116
When I was younger and was more involved with my kids' activities (coaching, school stuff, etc.), I was often in the uncomfortable position of having to cancel and/or reschedule practices. At the time, our drummer/BL sort of laid out an ultimatum for me to stick to the schedule. That was actually fair, because everyone else had to plan accordingly as well. For me, it was and is family first and at the time, schedules were constantly changing, so we parted ways and it was a better solution so that we remained friends. Nowadays, when we work with younger musicians that are in the same place I was, I try to be understanding to their limitations and family situations. As others have indicated, if it's not fun anymore, then maybe it's time to move on if no middle ground can be found. Good luck!
 
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#119
BoogieZK said:
Do you need to be there for a recording? I mean, bass right?
DI signal recorded in an interface at home is nowadays as good as in studios, so... no need to be in studio precisely Sunday.
Or Pre-record a phantom track to help the drummer and you re-record your bass track later when you have time, right?
I don't see any issue here, don't feel bad.
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Thanks. I think there are more than a few possible workarounds. Our guitar player is a great bass player also. I don't feel I'm derailing the whole process.
 
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#120
"The part where you have to drive 4 hours to do a show that you don't even cover gas for (charity or not) would make me quit immediately. Run away. Fast."

This seems to be a predominant though in the first page of this post. Such selfish and moronic thoughts to display publicly.
After more than a year of death, mayhem, and destruction with no end in sight at the moment and a nearly total shut down of live music, people seem to easily forget how are many are still suffering and how much fun was lost. People still and will need help.
Dump the band because their itinerary doesn't fit your life style, not because of the charity work. I know its not just because of that.
 

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