Ambient/Post-Rock/Textural bass playing thread

[emjazz]

Would be curious to hear more about the process behind this. I've been digging stuff like this (@emjazz 's solo record too) and am thinking about doing some of my own as soon as the rig is set up.

It sounds to me like for most parts you have a maximum of two parts going at once. Do you go through one whole take with a setup and then just jam with yourself? Or did you do it some other way?

EDIT -- if you wrote about this on like page 200 of this thread, just send me there.

Ooh...I love that record of Steuarts!....and yes....your turn to make one!!

 

[JES]

I’m starting to think about keeping the Ventris for home for this purpose. More weirdo opportunities.

 

[cosmicevan]

Speaking of dirt. This seems like a good place to ask: I’d love suggestions for a single pedal that can go from mild grindy overdrive to absolutely punishing distortion (or fuzz—not picky) and work well on bass. No apps, all analog. Surely @monsterthompson and others have opinions. This is for solo work so it’s not important to fit into a mix other than whatever mess I create.

the Damnation MBD is the answer for this.

 

[cosmicevan]

I know that this has been covered, but this crew would know offhand...

what's worth looking into as far as little mixers or even matrix mixers? I have a Red Panda mixer that I love and is perfect. I'd like something along the lines of that...small, simple way to blend a few signals into one.

 

[JES]

Do you need auxes or a matrix? I like Saturnworks and they will build what you want.

 

[emjazz]

I had decided to stay out of the dirt pedal discussion. I have been through sooooo many. Dirt pedals are so personal. I'd go with what Steuart mentioned. I still haven't had the chance to try one, but they always sound amazing on records that he's made. They seem to be incredibly versatile.

 

[steubig]

Would be curious to hear more about the process behind this. I've been digging stuff like this (@emjazz 's solo record too) and am thinking about doing some of my own as soon as the rig is set up.

It sounds to me like for most parts you have a maximum of two parts going at once. Do you go through one whole take with a setup and then just jam with yourself? Or did you do it some other way?

EDIT -- if you wrote about this on like page 200 of this thread, just send me there.

these are sectional multitrack pieces, so not full track of anything, really. some have four (or more) things going at once.

process was something like this:

screwing around with bass/effects. come up with idea, hmmm. i'll try that. now what happens? let me try that. eh, destroy that one. okay, that works. now i want a contrasting section. which sounds do i want to use? screw around as before. add seasoning, change durations of space, etc.

that's basically how the first and last started out (though the last was the last done, i think). then it came down to how many do i want to and wanting to make them short. then do different pieces as contrasting ideas (sort of like a symphony will have contrasting sections.)

so:
idea -> improvised execution -> light compositional concepts to generate new ideas -> improvised execution -> listen -> let it sit -> listen -> make alterations (delete/add/move)

i've mentioned my fixation about gerhard richter's painting before. some of these were in direct response to that (use amp or cable noise to create a "white of gray background" that other colors peek out of . . .

 

[steubig]

I had decided to stay out of the dirt pedal discussion. I have been through sooooo many. Dirt pedals are so personal. I'd go with what Steuart mentioned. I still haven't had the chance to try one, but they always sound amazing on records that he's made. They seem to be incredibly versatile.

i like it because it doesn't sound compressed and fits what i want to do (and i've made it work for me).

that being said, almost every dirt pedal has a little fizz up top that i don't love and the elements is no exception.

in certain way i like the elements because it's *not* super full of character. (for example: for my money all the darkglass stuff has their sound, so if you love that character, it's on! i had a duality, which i liked for a while, but then moved.)

and really, sometimes the secret is in the blending of a few sounds.

do guys know who fred chalenor is? i recall hearing that he would go into four fuzz boxes that he mixed in a mixer against his clean sound. i think @mrgittleman might know about this?

 

[Slaymus]

@steubig The tracks on Unusual Events (awesome work !!! ) with the Elements were recorded direct or with mic’d speakers?

 

[mrgittleman]

Fred was amazing and is missed. He used many different setups @steubig is correct that he used a mixer with multiple fuzzes. From what I can recall boss OD-1, fuzz face, couple of homemade enclosures and maybe a colorsound. If you don’t know his work here are couple things. No guitars

 

[steubig]

@steubig The tracks on Unusual Events (awesome work !!! ) with the Elements were recorded direct or with mic’d speakers?

thanks.

mic’ed. two cabs in stereo. speakers facing at me, hence the lovely feedback.

a lot of the time, i kind of “ride” the exp pedals so i can get some movement in the sound.

 

[steubig]

Fred was amazing and is missed. He used many different setups @steubig is correct that he used a mixer with multiple fuzzes. From what I can recall boss OD-1, fuzz face, couple of homemade enclosures and maybe a colorsound. If you don’t know his work here are couple things. No guitars

need to go back to those pig pen discs.

 

[ugly_bassplayer]

@mrgittleman ’
Thanks for the heads up on Fred Chalenor. I didn’t know him at all.
Currently digging in his discography. Started with Pigpen V as in Vinctim.......exploring some more today,
Awesome playing. Very tasty tone and playing.
His touch with the right hand is freakin amazing.
I have no clue what bass he’s using, but it’s a tone a freakin love. Nice and fat yet very defined...articulated...nuanced....wow.

 

[JES]

thanks.

mic’ed. two cabs in stereo. speakers facing at me, hence the lovely feedback.

a lot of the time, i kind of “ride” the exp pedals so i can get some movement in the sound.

Thanks for the lowdown on "the making of." One last question: are the two amps hard panned? Sometimes I hear one bass in one ear and another in another, and I'm wondering if you are overdubbing to play along with a previous recording or switching amps in real time.

 

[steubig]

Thanks for the lowdown on "the making of." One last question: are the two amps hard panned? Sometimes I hear one bass in one ear and another in another, and I'm wondering if you are overdubbing to play along with a previous recording or switching amps in real time.

these are all play along and then pan so there’s a stereo field. (the last cut starts with that drummy sort of thing; that’s two passes that are then panned to make it sound like a conversation.)

there are some things where i’m using the panning trem in the md-500, so some things move left to right, etc. some of the delays are dual with slightly different times to give more spread (dd-500).

i use live panning using an old ibanez vl-10 to do live panning on toques 02 and 03. (so hard pan on thing, loop, and hard pan the counter line on the other side.) those alb are all live improv, no overdubs.

 

[steubig]

Thanks for the lowdown on "the making of." One last question: are the two amps hard panned? Sometimes I hear one bass in one ear and another in another, and I'm wondering if you are overdubbing to play along with a previous recording or switching amps in real time.

p.s. there’s a lot of rv-500 morphing between the straight and reverse reverb on this.

 

[mrgittleman]

@mrgittleman ’
Thanks for the heads up on Fred Chalenor. I didn’t know him at all.
Currently digging in his discography. Started with Pigpen V as in Vinctim.......exploring some more today,
Awesome playing. Very tasty tone and playing.
His touch with the right hand is freakin amazing.
I have no clue what bass he’s using, but it’s a tone a freakin love. Nice and fat yet very defined...articulated...nuanced....wow.

Thanks for listening. Thanks to @steubig for mentioning him.
Fred left an amazing body of work:
Tone Dogs (2LPs)
Caveman Shoestore (4 LPs)
Hughscore (w Hugh Hopper, yes I’m a Canterbury freak) (4 LPs)
Land (2 LPs)
Pigpen (5 LPs)
Zony Mash (1st 2 LPs)
Boodlers (w Elliot Sharp) (2 LPs)
Slow Music Project (w Fripp 2 LPs)
This may not be complete but it’s what I have access to. He also played with Curlew, Walkabouts and 3 Swimmers. There are a bunch of live cassettes out there. He played Alembic, G&L 1000, Fender Jazz and P and a couple other ones I don’t recall. Fred used to tune his entire bass down a third to C. He was also a badass banjo player.

 

[ugly_bassplayer]

Thanks for listening. Thanks to @steubig for mentioning him.
Fred left an amazing body of work:
Tone Dogs (2LPs)
Caveman Shoestore (4 LPs)
Hughscore (w Hugh Hopper, yes I’m a Canterbury freak) (4 LPs)
Land (2 LPs)
Pigpen (5 LPs)
Zony Mash (1st 2 LPs)
Boodlers (w Elliot Sharp) (2 LPs)
Slow Music Project (w Fripp 2 LPs)
This may not be complete but it’s what I have access to. He also played with Curlew, Walkabouts and 3 Swimmers. There are a bunch of live cassettes out there. He played Alembic, G&L 1000, Fender Jazz and P and a couple other ones I don’t recall. Fred used to tune his entire bass down a third to C. He was also a badass banjo player.

C standard is my favorite tuning.

 

[monsterthompson]

first track (and many others) has a lot of multi-tracked 12-string basses with various elements flavor.

That deep clang at the 1:30 mark of 03 is sinister.

 

[steubig]

That deep clang at the 1:30 mark of 03 is sinister.

tambourine zil in the strings (see my avatar for what i mean) hit with a mallet with elements magic.