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Ampeg Heritage Line

#321
I really have a lot of love for Ampeg. In fact, it's the only brand I'm even interested in. But this whole story makes me feel a bit awkward.

At first I thought moving production would be bad for Ampegs reputation. I heard bad things about the quality and I've seen exemples of badly build Ampegs.

After a while I heard more and more good stories about Vietnamese/Korean/Chinese Ampegs and I thought... heck... why not. If they have their qc up stuff can easiliy be as good/ even better than the US made stuff. In Europe I saw the prices drop and I thought: Wow, the money they save on production costs are now beneficial for the customers. That's the way it should work I guess.

The Heritage Series on the other hand make me feel a little awkward again. It's like they're saying the Asian models aren't as good as the US models.

It's not wrong having a US and an Asian product line, I think it's bad that people could buy Asian models during 3 years and might feel screwed when they discover the Heritage Series that is supposed to be better. You think you bought some top of the line stuff, but then they tell you the US made stuff from a couple of years earlier were in fact better. I'd be upset!
 
#322
jvdb said:
It's not wrong having a US and an Asian product line, I think it's bad that people could buy Asian models during 3 years and might feel screwed when they discover the Heritage Series that is supposed to be better. You think you bought some top of the line stuff, but then they tell you the US made stuff from a couple of years earlier were in fact better. I'd be upset!
Click to expand...

i understand what you're saying, however i really like my '07 (n)Ampeg VR. and to me, a good amp will always be a good amp, so i have no regrets about buying it. and installing better tubes in the new USA heritage series isn't enough to make a difference to me. i can always put my own choice of tubes in it.
 
#323
I know, and I'm not saying the Asian models aren't any good. But I know people how were convinced they bought top of the line stuff and now Ampeg is saying there are better amps --> the Heritage line.

John, you have a lot of knowledge and experience, but some people that just buy an Ampeg because of name and the sound expect that they just got the best can now be confused.

BTW - I just played a Asian VR stack at our rehearsal room and it was great. Can't wait to test it next to my vintage SVT rig.
 
#324
jvdb said:
I know, and I'm not saying the Asian models aren't any good. But I know people how were convinced they bought top of the line stuff and now Ampeg is saying there are better amps --> the Heritage line.

John, you have a lot of knowledge and experience, but some people that just buy an Ampeg because of name and the sound expect that they just got the best can now be confused.

BTW - I just played a Asian VR stack at our rehearsal room and it was great. Can't wait to test it next to my vintage SVT rig.
Click to expand...


In Reality it is just Marketing, people will eat that...
 
#325
Lalo said:
In Reality it is just Marketing, people will eat that...
Click to expand...
i have to say after watching pyotr mow the la....er....present new ampeg products at namm, that heritage grillcloth does look pretty cool under lights ;)

but i'm with johnk...the heritage heads probably won't sound much different from their chinese counterparts. the cabs may but i really don't see how the tone of the heads could be improved all that much. good tubes are always good to use, but they're not miracle workers. still, as fender has proven...people love their limited edition gear.
 
#327
JimmyM said:
the heritage heads probably won't sound much different from their chinese counterparts. the cabs may but i really don't see how the tone of the heads could be improved all that much. good tubes are always good to use...
Click to expand...

A better quality tube will improve the noise floor. Less hum and hiss is a good thing.

For a small amount of extra money, there are improvements that can be made to most amps to make them sound better or quieter. In the case of the CL or VR the amp can be improved by using a better quality transformer (like a Jensen) for the DI, using a higher quality shielded wire that runs from the input jacks to the pre-amp tubes and to the phase inverter, using twisted pairs for the heater wires, better RF filtering, lower noise components in the pre-amp, etc.

I downloaded the Heritage manual and compared the noise specs to that of the CL and they are identical both in terms of signal to noise and power rating total harmonic distortion. Other than the premium tubes, it doesn't look like they are doing anything differently inside.

I did notice that the last page of the Heritage user's manuals have the text flipped. It is a mirror image. For people claiming to be employing a higher level of quality control, they seem to have dropped the ball here.
 
#331
Thanks for the reference to your previous post. I hope what they told you is indeed true.

Their web site tells a different story. One would think that if they had a list of design or build improvements that they implemented, the marketing literature would be touting them.
 
#332
JimmyM said:
that heritage grillcloth does look pretty cool under lights ;)
Click to expand...

They really did look pretty darned good. I thought that the faceplate on the Heritage SVT-CL was a huge upgrade, esthetically.

but i'm with johnk...the heritage heads probably won't sound much different from their chinese counterparts. the cabs may but i really don't see how the tone of the heads could be improved all that much. good tubes are always good to use, but they're not miracle workers. still, as fender has proven...people love their limited edition gear.
Click to expand...

All I can say is, we spent some time playing through the Heritage gear, and while I can't really separate between the head and the cab, the sum of the parts sounded really, really good. The noise floor was super low, as well.

I hope that they do more Heritage line products. I'm thinking that a Heritage SVT-VR and a B-15 would be very cool, but that's just me. :cool:
 
#333
beans-on-toast said:
A better quality tube will improve the noise floor. Less hum is a good thing.

For a small amount of extra money, there are improvements that can be made to most amps to make them sound better or quieter. In the case of the CL or VR the amp can be improved by using a better quality transformer (like a Jensen) for the DI, using a higher quality shielded wire that runs from the input jacks to the pre-amp tubes and to the phase inverter, using twisted pairs for the heater wires, better RF filtering, lower noise components in the pre-amp, etc.

I downloaded the Heritage manual and compared the noise specs to that of the CL and they are identical both in terms of signal to noise and power rating total harmonic distortion. Other than the premium tubes, it doesn't look like they are doing anything differently inside.

I did notice that the last page of the Heritage user's manual has the text flipped. It is a mirror image. For people claiming to be employing a higher level of quality control, they seem to have dropped the ball here.
Click to expand...
oh snap!

well i can live with a page flopped in a manual if it's a good amp. and i'm not finding much to dislike about the loud svt's as they are. had to suffer through 2 or 3 broken ones over the last year, but the ones that work have been excellent. whether the chinese transformers are made as well or not i don't know, but they certainly sound great in the amps. and electrical windings didn't want to make the transformers anymore anyway, so they would probably have been outsourced to china regardless.

well i'm not sold on the heritage cl being vastly improved simply by installing jj's and winged c's, but i'm not a cl guy anyway. but i really do like that grillcloth so i think it's worth it just to get it ;)
 
#334
tombowlus said:
All I can say is, we spent some time playing through the Heritage gear, and while I can't really separate between the head and the cab, the sum of the parts sounded really, really good. The noise floor was super low, as well.

I hope that they do more Heritage line products. I'm thinking that a Heritage SVT-VR and a B-15 would be very cool, but that's just me. :cool:
Click to expand...
no tom, that's pretty much every ampeg fan's thinking :bassist:

i can see that i won't be able to touch the vr when the cl's $2400 but i'm holding out hope the b-15n won't be a ridiculous price. but if they do it in navy random flair, i'll pay it even if it's ridiculous!
 
#335
beans-on-toast said:
I did notice that the last page of the Heritage user's manuals have the text flipped. It is a mirror image. For people claiming to be employing a higher level of quality control, they seem to have dropped the ball here.
Click to expand...

I think the last page of the manuals are just for artistic reasons, rather than mistakes. The front of the manual shows the front of the amp with the text normal, the back page shows the back of the amp with the text flipped as if you were seeing the front page from the rear view.

While looking through the manul for the Heritage 810, I am surprised they didn't include this feature description from the 210AV manual:

"Foot cups on the top panel allow secure stacking of a Micro-VR amplifier
or up to four empty shot glasses ."

:p
 

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