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AudioKinesis Cabs Part VI...

#3,161
Cool. From my recent experience, I'd think the setup you described would be good, if not quite a bit overkill (it'll go pretty stupid loud).

If I were going after that, I'd use much smaller cabs from Duke, but I strive for easy load in/out and don't need a lot of stage volume at all. Heck, I'd probably skip the cabs, run two DIs from my Axe-Fx to FOH and get a good monitor mix sent back xD

Good luck though! Hopefully someone who has used those two cabs simultaneously will chime in here for ya.
 
#3,162
Selta said:
Cool. From my recent experience, I'd think the setup you described would be good, if not quite a bit overkill (it'll go pretty stupid loud)...
Good luck though! Hopefully someone who has used those two cabs simultaneously will chime in here for ya.
Click to expand...

Yeah, anything worth doing is worth overdoing, right? You aught to hear this amp pushing a pair of 215's, can you say "locamotive"? Actually the amp is from a club PA I had and never sold, sometimes you use what you have. As far as the Fractal Audio gear I just don't think I need everything in that toolkit. I have also come to like the Sansamp tone. I'll get it all sorted out. :-)
Rondo
 
#3,163
rondodunbar said:
Sure,my feeling is to keep the signal chain for the two frequency bands seperate, most of the dirt will go to the higher frequencies. The 1855 is a bass cab with a baked in bass tone, the TC is more transparent. High frequencies need less power to project so that is one reason for the difference in ohms. From what I have read, a two amp (or in this case 2 channels on the same amp) solution is better sounding when splitting the signals like this. Think Royal Blood or Om (not the style I would play but using that concept).
Rondo
Click to expand...
The cone drivers in any of the Hathor cabs will 'probably' sound a bit better for distortion or OD type stuff: 'YMMV'.
IMO, if you insist on splitting the signal, one Hathor 1203, should be plenty for the higher frequency part.
I really think just the one Hathor 1855 would sound great.
 
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#3,164
rondodunbar said:
Hey folks,
Some of you may have seen cab questions I have had in other posts but I have finally decided to go with some of Dukes cabs. I talked to Duke about a custom build but decided I can achieve what I am after another way. I have decided to use one channel of my Carvin DCML3000 to drive bass frequencies through my VTRM (or the Bass Fly rig) and using an EHX Switchblade and Pog2 to send guitar frequencies through a Flyrig5.

I am thinking of using a Hathor1855 for bass frequencies at 4ohms, the amp on one channel at 4 ohms will do 950w. For the guitar frequencies I am considering using the Thunderchild 118 at 8ohms for 550w.

Have any of you paired these 2 cabs? Anyone have constructive comments about my proposed rig? The purpose is to fill sonic space in a bass/drums duo or trio. Basses are a fretless 5 tuned BEADG and a fretless 10 tuned B/f#/E/b/A/e/D/a/G/d. Genres are Blues, Alt Rock, Classic Rock, and Fusion. Thanks.
Rondo
Click to expand...
Couple questions - sorry, I'm totally unfamiliar with the equipment you use so I'd have to check the specs/manuals but I'm in a hurry:
-am I correct in understanding you're not using the internal crossover of the power amp (if there) and actually sending a full-range signal, not just "bass frequencies", to the 18" cab? If so, the Hathor makes sense, otherwise it wouldn't be a wise choice unless it's going to see some playing time on its own in other gigs - you'd pay for a crossover and mid drivers that would never see action. You'd be better served with a proper subwoofer (like the fEARful 15 sub) if a subwoofer is all you need;
-I'll echo the objections above about using a TC for the high side. Does the Pog (or maybe the Fly Rig) have built-in cab emulation, even analog in nature? If not, you may want to use a real guitar rig for guitar sounds. Well, this unless, again, you see yourself using the Thunderchild on its own outside of the dual-mono system, at least in some of your gigs.*

An unrelated question:
how do you like the lowest two courses of your 10-stringer? are the high strings a 5th or a 12th above the low? I'm asking because personally I'm not a fan of those intervals past (lower than) a certain point, to wit: the 55+82 Hz power chord. YMMV, of (double) course!


*To clarify (since it may look like I'm advising you to bring your business elsewhere): +1 on recombining the two signals before the amp and using just the 1855.
Ooor, maybe, getting Duke to put out his hybrid cab with a guitar speaker! In your case occupying typically guitar freq slots would not be a minus, on the contrary...
 
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#3,165
HaphAsSard said:
Couple questions - sorry, I'm totally unfamiliar with the equipment you use so I'd have to check the specs/manuals but I'm in a hurry:
-am I correct in understanding you're not using the internal crossover of the power amp (if there) and actually sending a full-range signal, not just "bass frequencies", to the 18" cab? If so, the Hathor makes sense, otherwise it wouldn't be a wise choice unless it's going to see some playing time on its own in other gigs - you'd pay for a crossover and mid drivers that would never see action. You'd be better served with a proper subwoofer (like the fEARful 15 sub) if a subwoofer is all you need;
-I'll echo the objections above about using a TC for the high side. Does the Pog (or maybe the Fly Rig) have built-in cab emulation, even analog in nature? If not, you may want to use a real guitar rig for guitar sounds. Well, this unless, again, you see yourself using the Thunderchild on its own outside of the dual-mono system, at least in some of your gigs.*

An unrelated question:
how do you like the lowest two courses of your 10-stringer? are the high strings a 5th or a 12th above the low? I'm asking because personally I'm not a fan of those intervals past (lower than) a certain point, to wit: the 55+82 Hz power chord. YMMV, of (double) course!


*To clarify (since it may look like I'm advising you to bring your business elsewhere): +1 on recombining the two signals before the amp and using just the 1855.
Ooor, maybe, getting Duke to put out his hybrid cab with a guitar speaker! In your case occupying typically guitar freq slots would not be a minus, on the contrary...
Click to expand...

Wow...where to start? The Sansamp Flyrig5 emulates several tweed amps, the plexi section adds the classic Brit Plexi overdrive as well, also it incorporates a delay and a reverb. The Bass Flyrig is based on the VT circuit giving the B15/SVT emulation, plus a tuner, compressor, and other useful things. The idea is to run bass freqs in channel A full range and guitar freqs through channel B full range. This shouldn't be a problem as the Pog2 won't pass bass frequencies to channel A when it is set to 'octave up'. This should be like having a bass and a guitar on 2 seperate amps.
My reasoning for using the 1855 for bass and the TC for guitar: the 1855 has a built in dip where guitar frequencies have a natural peak, the TC is clean and even throughout its range so in my mind better suited, of the two, to handle guitar frequencies. Further, I need more power to push bass frequencies than guitar frequencies which is why I am looking at 4ohms for the 1855 and 8ohms for the TC. If I were to recombine the signals I would just use a mixer and two PA speakers (what I use currently and may end up continuing to use if my experiment flops).
On the 10: I have commissioned the build based off using a pawn shop bass and string pairings for the tuning listed, I have not yet had a full complement of all ten on one instrument. So far, I haven't noticed anything too weird as far as harmonics. If it doesn't pan out I can simple go to straight octave tuning no harm. The idea for the 10 came from the desire to play in bass/drum duos and power trios. In those type of arrangements there is a lot of sonic space.
I don't think I want a hybrid cab. If this doesn't work out the 1855 and the TC both have excellent value, a hybrid maybe not so much.
I hope this clarifies what my thinking is. I realize this is a little outside the norm but I like to play around with stuff. :-)
Rondo
 
#3,166
rondodunbar said:
Wow...where to start? The Sansamp Flyrig5 emulates several tweed amps, the plexi section adds the classic Brit Plexi overdrive as well, also it incorporates a delay and a reverb. The Bass Flyrig is based on the VT circuit giving the B15/SVT emulation, plus a tuner, compressor, and other useful things. The idea is to run bass freqs in channel A full range and guitar freqs through channel B full range. This shouldn't be a problem as the Pog2 won't pass bass frequencies to channel A when it is set to 'octave up'. This should be like having a bass and a guitar on 2 seperate amps.
My reasoning for using the 1855 for bass and the TC for guitar: the 1855 has a built in dip where guitar frequencies have a natural peak, the TC is clean and even throughout its range so in my mind better suited, of the two, to handle guitar frequencies. Further, I need more power to push bass frequencies than guitar frequencies which is why I am looking at 4ohms for the 1855 and 8ohms for the TC. If I were to recombine the signals I would just use a mixer and two PA speakers (what I use currently and may end up continuing to use if my experiment flops).
On the 10: I have commissioned the build based off using a pawn shop bass and string pairings for the tuning listed, I have not yet had a full complement of all ten on one instrument. So far, I haven't noticed anything too weird as far as harmonics. If it doesn't pan out I can simple go to straight octave tuning no harm. The idea for the 10 came from the desire to play in bass/drum duos and power trios. In those type of arrangements there is a lot of sonic space.
I don't think I want a hybrid cab. If this doesn't work out the 1855 and the TC both have excellent value, a hybrid maybe not so much.
I hope this clarifies what my thinking is. I realize this is a little outside the norm but I like to play around with stuff. :)
Rondo
Click to expand...

Would love to hear some of your music. Do you have anything on youtube?
 
#3,167
John D Harris said:
The cone drivers in any of the Hathor cabs will 'probably' sound a bit better for distortion or OD type stuff: 'YMMV'.
IMO, if you insist on splitting the signal, one Hathor 1203, should be plenty for the higher frequency part.
I really think just the one Hathor 1855 would sound great.
Click to expand...
I didn't even think of that! You probably are correct. That is why I posted, so many things melting my brain. So, reevaluating; I am still feeling lots of love for the 1855 in 4ohm for bass and perhaps the Hathor 1203 in 8ohm for guitar frequencies.
Rondo
 
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#3,169
rondodunbar said:
I didn't even think of that! You probably are correct. That is why I posted, so many things melting my brain. So, reevaluating; I am still feeling lots of love for the 1855 in 4ohm for bass and perhaps the Hathor 1203 in 8ohm for guitar frequencies.
Rondo
Click to expand...

That's how I'd roll for what you're trying to do. I've run my TC112 with other cabs a bit and often tend to prefer it for the low side of things, and from my limited experience with the TC118 I'd expect the same, although with a really nice modeler setup like Selta's I'm sure the TC118 kills for distorted bits too.
 
#3,170
Passinwind said:
That's how I'd roll for what you're trying to do. I've run my TC112 with other cabs a bit and often tend to prefer it for the low side of things, and from my limited experience with the TC118 I'd expect the same, although with a really nice modeler setup like Selta's I'm sure the TC118 kills for distorted bits too.
Click to expand...
Yes, I've heard that really high-quality HF drivers sound much better at handling OD-type or distorted signals, but I think the right paper cone drivers are just a bit more natural sounding (not sure if it would be enough to hear the difference on a gig unless you're soloing) & it probably depends on the type of signal you're working with & the type of tone you're trying to achieve.
I think with Duke's cabs, it would be difficult to go wrong either way.
 
#3,171
John D Harris said:
Yes, I've heard that really high-quality HF drivers sound much better at handling OD-type or distorted signals, but I think the right paper cone drivers are just a bit more natural sounding (not sure if it would be enough to hear the difference on a gig unless you're soloing) & it probably depends on the type of signal you're working with & the type of tone you're trying to achieve.
I think with Duke's cabs, it would be difficult to go wrong either way.
Click to expand...

Yep. It's kind of the same paradigm as running a DI to FOH vs miking. Either one can work well but you need the right overall signal chain to optimize whichever approach you use.
 
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#3,173
rondodunbar said:
Wow...where to start? The Sansamp Flyrig5 emulates several tweed amps, the plexi section adds the classic Brit Plexi overdrive as well, also it incorporates a delay and a reverb. The Bass Flyrig is based on the VT circuit giving the B15/SVT emulation, plus a tuner, compressor, and other useful things. The idea is to run bass freqs in channel A full range and guitar freqs through channel B full range. This shouldn't be a problem as the Pog2 won't pass bass frequencies to channel A when it is set to 'octave up'. This should be like having a bass and a guitar on 2 seperate amps.
My reasoning for using the 1855 for bass and the TC for guitar: the 1855 has a built in dip where guitar frequencies have a natural peak, the TC is clean and even throughout its range so in my mind better suited, of the two, to handle guitar frequencies. Further, I need more power to push bass frequencies than guitar frequencies which is why I am looking at 4ohms for the 1855 and 8ohms for the TC. If I were to recombine the signals I would just use a mixer and two PA speakers (what I use currently and may end up continuing to use if my experiment flops).
On the 10: I have commissioned the build based off using a pawn shop bass and string pairings for the tuning listed, I have not yet had a full complement of all ten on one instrument. So far, I haven't noticed anything too weird as far as harmonics. If it doesn't pan out I can simple go to straight octave tuning no harm. The idea for the 10 came from the desire to play in bass/drum duos and power trios. In those type of arrangements there is a lot of sonic space.
I don't think I want a hybrid cab. If this doesn't work out the 1855 and the TC both have excellent value, a hybrid maybe not so much.
I hope this clarifies what my thinking is. I realize this is a little outside the norm but I like to play around with stuff. :)
Rondo
Click to expand...
rondodunbar said:
I didn't even think of that! You probably are correct. That is why I posted, so many things melting my brain. So, reevaluating; I am still feeling lots of love for the 1855 in 4ohm for bass and perhaps the Hathor 1203 in 8ohm for guitar frequencies.
Rondo
Click to expand...
Ok, so the 1855 would indeed get signal up to where strings and pickups produce it, and give back sound until the mid drivers's rolloff; the "guitar" side would be hi-passed as well as amp-modelled; again sorry for the ignorance, but the modelling includes cabinet emulation, correct? Not familiar with tweed or tartan ^^'. If that's indeed the case, your original idea (4-ohm Hathor 1855 + 8-ohm Thunderchild 112) appears to indeed be very well thought out, and the TC is arguably a better platform for modelling as reported by some in these threads (again, if a guitar cab is emulated towards the end of the signal chain before the power amp). OTOH... the smaller Hathor might also be terrific for the high side, since everyone reports it sounds great with analog dirt.

Thanks for the comments about the 10-string, looking forward to seeing it come to life.
 
#3,174
HaphAsSard said:
Ok, so the 1855 would indeed get signal up to where strings and pickups produce it, and give back sound until the mid drivers's rolloff; the "guitar" side would be hi-passed as well as amp-modelled; again sorry for the ignorance, but the modelling includes cabinet emulation, correct? Not familiar with tweed or tartan ^^'. If that's indeed the case, your original idea (4-ohm Hathor 1855 + 8-ohm Thunderchild 112) appears to indeed be very well thought out, and the TC is arguably a better platform for modelling as reported by some in these threads (again, if a guitar cab is emulated towards the end of the signal chain before the power amp). OTOH... the smaller Hathor might also be terrific for the high side, since everyone reports it sounds great with analog dirt.

Thanks for the comments about the 10-string, looking forward to seeing it come to life.
Click to expand...
Indeed, two flavors of greatness!
 
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#3,175
HaphAsSard said:
your original idea (4-ohm Hathor 1855 + 8-ohm Thunderchild 112) appears to indeed be very well thought out, and the TC is arguably a better platform for modelling as reported by some in these threads (again, if a guitar cab is emulated towards the end of the signal chain before the power amp). OTOH... the smaller Hathor might also be terrific for the high side, since everyone reports it sounds great with analog dirt.
Click to expand...

Ron's original idea included a TC118, not the 112. That's a lot of extra cab size and weight if you're not really leveraging what the 18 brings -- not that there's necessarily anything wrong with that.
 
#3,176
Passinwind said:
Ron's original idea included a TC118, not the 112. That's a lot of extra cab size and weight if you're not really leveraging what the 18 brings -- not that there's necessarily anything wrong with that.
Click to expand...
Oops. And yeah, sounds scary to carry around all that cab for skinny string sounds. Weightwise it would be manageable and bulk is relative, but scary nonetheless for the audience...
 

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