AudioKinesis Cabs Part VI...

[Passinwind]

I'm not making the Birdhaus cabs at this time. They might make a comeback at some point in the future, but I don't think they'd have the kind of voicing you're looking for.

Yeah, the one you sent me was pretty much like a set of midrange cannons.

 

[Al Kraft]

Yeah, the one you sent me was pretty much like a set of midrange cannons.

Charlie, do you have some insight on that question I tried to answer in the post right before yours? I think I recalled previous discussions correctly, but you know Duke's products and designs as well as anyone.

 

[Passinwind]

Charlie, do you have some insight on that question I tried to answer in the post right before yours? I think I recalled previous discussions correctly, but you know Duke's products and designs as well as anyone.

In all honesty I don't tend to mess with the port plugs much, because my own amp designs tend to address a lot of the same territory. My TC112 is from the first generation and there are only two ports. Anyhow, what you said seems about right to me, pending Duke's scary science clarification.

 

[Al Kraft]

In all honesty I don't tend to mess with the port plugs much, because my own amp designs tend to address a lot of the same territory. My TC112 is from the first generation and there are only two ports. Anyhow, what you said seems about right to me, pending Duke's scary science clarification.

Thanks Charlie! From a mechanical engineering standpoint it made sense to me, but I don't have full insight into the design decisions Duke made...and his results tell me that there is probably more innovative/creative thinking than traditional design practice in his products. It's often hard to explain what a genius did when you're working with my IQ level.

 

[Passinwind]

Thanks Charlie! From a mechanical engineering standpoint it made sense to me, but I don't have full insight into the design decisions Duke made...and his results tell me that there is probably more innovative/creative thinking than traditional design practice in his products. It's often hard to explain what a genius did when you're working with my IQ level.

Duke actually knows quite a bit about traditional approaches, and vintage weirdo ones too. As you know, it's not a bad idea to look at all the printed sheets before you throw them out for a white one.

 

[Dee-man]

0/2/4. Use 2 diagonally. It won't matter at low volumes, but at higher volumes, the driver could get tilted out of balance.

 

[bassically_eli]

Just to confirm what others have said, I seem to recall that the 4-port design was adopted exactly for that reason, to solve the asymmetrical loading issue. I think some early users ran into issues when pushing their cabs particularly hard. That said, I've never had that issue with my 2-port gen. 1 TC112, but I've only had it since around last May and haven't pushed it hard. I do run 1 plug in, 1 plug out the vast majority of the time. Even with two HPFs in my signal chain, putting in one plug still seems to be an improvement with my upright.

Edit: nvm, I was basically completely wrong per Duke's post below. Should've waited for him to respond. How embarrassing

 

[DukeLeJeune]

Obviously Duke gets the final word, but my sense would be that what matters most is when doing two ports open and two closed closed - I would do them diagonally one top and one bottom. This would best balance the acoustic loading on the woofer and enhance any natural convention to remove heat. With three open I would say it's less of an issue. With only one port open I'm not sure it would matter unless one of the ports was dead center on the woofer (which none are as best I know) or one was located significantly off to the side, above, or below the woofer (and I think they are symmetrically arranged around the it).

Al's response is right on the money.

Just to confirm what others have said, I seem to recall that the 4-port design was adopted exactly for that reason, to solve the asymmetrical loading issue.

The "asymmetrical loading" issue was actually only significant in my first prototype Thunderchild cabinet, which had two ports up high, behind the horn. On some loud low notes the asymmetry would cause enough wobble for the voice coil to click against the sides of the magnetic gap. To the best of my knowledge that has never happened in a production cab, as now the ports are all behind the woofer cone.

I switched to four ports primarily to increase the number of tuning options, as that seems to be a feature that some people like.

Also, on the Hathor 1203, three 2" ports was closer to the "ideal" tuning frequency than the original single 3" port, and so once I'd crossed that bridge, might as well do it for the other 112 cabs too. Two 2" ports open on the Hathor 1203 gave the same tuning as the single 3" port in the original.

 

[Al Kraft]

I switched to four ports primarily to increase the number of tuning options, as that seems to be a feature that some people like.

...and it's a nicely designed, well-integrated feature that I have yet to find on anyone else's cabs Duke!

 

[been_effected]

...and it's a nicely designed, well-integrated feature that I have yet to find on anyone else's cabs Duke!

This.

It's amazing how many new people I introduce to the cab who look at me like I'm a nutter when I start messing around with the ports in a room. Only after I show them the differences does the light go on.

 

[Al Kraft]

This.

It's amazing how many new people I introduce to the cab who look at me like I'm a nutter when I start messing around with the ports in a room. Only after I show them the differences does the light go on.

It's the first time I ever found something on a bass cabinet that was nearly as useful as a HPF on an amp for tuning a cab's output for specific rooms and/or differing styles of music. There is also an engineering elegance in how simply the concept is executed, although I know that the math and design trades to make the entire cabinet work as a system (ports, drivers, crossover, etc.) was not exactly simple.

 

[PDGood]

Help people.

I am an old guy and just got a deal on a Hathor 1203 and got a Mesa D-800.

All in all sounds good - but no matter how I set it - it still sounds to High Fi. Tried the switches and all the knobs on the head and still to High Fi.

Any help or ideas from you guys. Oh yeah using a 71 P bass.

Lennyj

I have the D-800+ and Thunder children. I can tell you that the D-800 is a very hifi sounding amp to my ears. I have other amps to help me make that comparison. What you have are all good pieces but I would swap out the amp and keep the cab if it were me.

 

[LennyJ]

I have the D-800+ and Thunder children. I can tell you that the D-800 is a very hifi sounding amp to my ears. I have other amps to help me make that comparison. What you have are all good pieces but I would swap out the amp and keep the cab if it were me.

Thanks - but I have 3 other cabinets that I can get my sound with the D-800 and them. When I started playing NO BASS CABINET had horns or tweeters. And maybe there is my problem, thinking maybe they would work for me.

Like Duke said - maybe it is not for me. I will keep working at it, and if not it will go.

LJ

 

[bassically_eli]

Thanks - but I have 3 other cabinets that I can get my sound with the D-800 and them. When I started playing NO BASS CABINET had horns or tweeters. And maybe there is my problem, thinking maybe they would work for me.

Like Duke said - maybe it is not for me. I will keep working at it, and if not it will go.

LJ

The cool thing about Duke's cabs is that you can dial in pretty much any tone. That said, if you're shooting for a no tweeter/horn/mid driver tone, then it seems kind of silly to use one of these. The Mesa and AK cab combo is a bit of a surprising choice if you don't like HiFi. (Don't mean that to sound flippant, it's understandable why you might be tempted by all the well deserved praise here on TB.)

 

[steubig]

the first-gen tc112 has a switch where you can defeat the horn completely.

i have used that switch to get away from more high end.

 

[LennyJ]

The cool thing about Duke's cabs is that you can dial in pretty much any tone. That said, if you're shooting for a no tweeter/horn/mid driver tone, then it seems kind of silly to use one of these. The Mesa and AK cab combo is a bit of a surprising choice if you don't like HiFi. (Don't mean that to sound flippant, it's understandable why you might be tempted by all the well deserved praise here on TB.)

I got the Mesa because I have owned Mesa before and I figured to buy this since Gibson bought them and I wanted a good amp before Gibson screwed the company up and dissolved it after they got what they wanted.

Yes the cabinet is a nice little cab with a great rep and Duke is a great person. And it was a good deal and I wanted to give it a try. I am not sold against it yet as I have said MANY times. Just looking for ideas - many possibilities here.

I had asked for peoples help on adjustments to mellow it out and so far only two real good ideas have come thru. One from Duke himself and the other from Nutdog who is a good friend I met here on TB.

Thanks tho for your observations.

I like trying new things to see what's up. Basses do not interest me as far as all the new ones - but amps and cabs do. I play Fender P's and one Jazz bass. But I am not interested in all the remakes of the Jazz bass as an example - they are only Jazz copies that cost two to three times the price of the original.

Oh yeah - I have a Rumble 800 head and actually that sounds really nice with the Hathor cabinet. All Straight up with the mid scoop button. Go figure. . . . . . . .

Thanks

Lenny

 

[LennyJ]

the first-gen tc112 has a switch where you can defeat the horn completely.

i have used that switch to get away from more high end.

As I posted I have the Hathor not the TC and the Hathor does not have that switch.

 

[mmbongo]

I got the Mesa because I have owned Mesa before and I figured to buy this since Gibson bought them and I wanted a good amp before Gibson screwed the company up and dissolved it after they got what they wanted.

Yes the cabinet is a nice little cab with a great rep and Duke is a great person. And it was a good deal and I wanted to give it a try. I am not sold against it yet as I have said MANY times. Just looking for ideas - many possibilities here.

I had asked for peoples help on adjustments to mellow it out and so far only two real good ideas have come thru. One from Duke himself and the other from Nutdog who is a good friend I met here on TB.

Thanks tho for your observations.

I like trying new things to see what's up. Basses do not interest me as far as all the new ones - but amps and cabs do. I play Fender P's and one Jazz bass. But I am not interested in all the remakes of the Jazz bass as an example - they are only Jazz copies that cost two to three times the price of the original.

Oh yeah - I have a Rumble 800 head and actually that sounds really nice with the Hathor cabinet. All Straight up with the mid scoop button. Go figure. . . . . . . .

Thanks

Lenny

Do you run any pedals? If so you may need to add a low pass filter.

 

[LennyJ]

Do you run any pedals? If so you may need to add a low pass filter.

Hey- sorry I do not use any pedals. At this stage in my life - I play at church only and bass into the PA or into a amp when we play other churches.

When I do use my 2x8 cabinet I have used a FDeck HPF due to the lows and 2x8 cabinet - but that is the only pedal I have ever used. I feel - good bass, amp and cabinet no real need for a pedal (my opinion only).

THanks

 

[steubig]

As I posted I have the Hathor not the TC and the Hathor does not have that switch.

i know.

i thought it was good information for people who didn’t know or people who liked duke’s designs, but want to have an option to defeat the horn.