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Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by Thor, Jun 3, 2013.
Congratulations on revising, redesigning, and rebooting my favorite Double Bass cabinet. I'm so glad that you were able to put the TC 112 back into production once again. With a Walter Woods amplifier, the sound coming off a Thunderchild is astounding. If you're doubling on EB and DB this cabinet just rules the day.
Very cool. The 8ohm version is a great option, especially with the mid switch.
I'm really digging the 212. Stopped by my friend LennyJ's this week and brought it and the NV115 to play along side his Greenboy Bassic 12. A fun time. All three cabs sounded wonderful. It really becomes a matter of taste and form factor preference. I could be happy with any of them.
It was the first time I put the port plug in the 212. With the plug in the middle and the high end roll off switch engaged it sounded almost identical to the NV tone.
So my takeaway from the morning was the 212 can handle any gig I do in a 40lb box and sound very nice doing it.
Lenny has a TC amp and I was using a Streamliner 900 with a 5751 in V1. Both sounded very warm. The TC15 wouldn't have matched well with the Streamliner. But for some reason the 212 sounds great with this one. I'm not sure if it's a tighter voicing on the cab, the cleaner amp voicing with the 5751 or a combination of both.
I got the Streamliner to use with the NV but was pleasantly surprised by the TC combination. In fact, I was a little frustrated with the 212 when trying it with a Shuttlemax 9.2 and a GK MB800 and was ready to sell it and try something else. Both those amps with this cab had an upper mid/low treble ice pick to the ear quality I just couldn't dial out. Purely IMO and possibly due to my inadequacies. But the Streamliner has changed my mind about the cab and the NV is on the block.
Sorry, this post turned in to a ramble.
Thank you, Mark!
Between the v1 and v2 4-ohm versions, there is no difference in efficiency. The tone is virtually identical; I made a minor change to the crossover to take into account the wider vertical pattern of the new horn, and that's it.
I still have at least one issue to sort out on the Hathor 215, and probably won't have time to really focus on it until after mid-October. I'm trying to get two designs (collaborations with inventors) ready for a high-end home audio show in October, and that's dominating my R&D time for now.
I'm certain Mike has no plans to get back into composites. The fiberglass dust was seriously damaging his health, and he was taking all the precautions. It's just not worth it for him. On the other hand, if someone wanted Mike to tell them how to do what he was doing, they could contact him and inquire and he'd probably be very forthcoming with the information.
Small, densely-packed cabs benefit less from composites than large cabs do because less percentage of the weight is in the enclosure itself to start with.
Don't apologize...not a ramble, good info.
I am really GAS'ing for a TC212, but just got laid-off yesterday.
At least now I can hopefully get back to gigging (I was working every weekend & late hrs).
Once I get my situation sorted, I'm still hoping I can work out a way to score one of these cabs to replace my 110 lb EA CX-310 (love the tone, but she's a beeotch to haul around).
I have a jacked-up back as well, so the TC212 should cover any gig I would do & give my back a break (a double blessing: great tone & light weight).
Hi all. Sorry to jump in the middle of this and cover something that maybe was covered before, but I was wondering if what makes these cabs, the TC115 non-wide AF (with tilt back) in particular, so appealing is their portability.
In other words, putting aside weight and portability (for example, the cab will stay in a rehearsal space), would you still choose the TC115 over, say, a Berg HT115 or AG Tri115L, or your favorite 410, or a 212 or full-range cabs like the Whappo Jr.?
Also, have there been significant changes to the TC115 with tilt back since it first came out that would make you want the latest model?
Finally, is their a tonal difference between the wood cabs and the composite ones?
Thanks a lot, DM
The portability is nice, but not the deal maker for me - it's very much all about the sound. The TC line of cabinets have been described before as a studio monitor built for the road and that's what separates them from the pack (plus nice features like ports that can be blocked to re-tune the cabinet).
No one can really tell you that it's a better cabinet or not as good a cabinet as others - you have to decide that based on what bass you play, what amp you use and what your sound goals are. It works beautifully with my Markbass head and aggressive sounding basses. TB member Ken Jung is gifted at knowing how it all works together and was very helpful to me in finding this cabinet and knowing how to get the sound I was going after.
Thanks PDG. Good points.
I have a "living room rig" that is my little experiment in ultimate tone for me (modern vintage, as some have called it, for rock, blues, jam/improv, bluegrass at moderate volumes; no slapping). I run both tube amps and solid state, depending on my mood. I like my sound clean and usually scoop the mids a bit.
I already have a stoopid amount of equipment for a hobbyist, and currently have a Sadowsky SA410, Whappo Jr. and a Tecamp S212 in the mix of gear. All great cabs, but I have perpetual GAS, so I'm intrigued by these super driver cabs and wondering if I'm missing out on anything in terms of warmth, depth, and clarity.
So, before I go spend more money I probably shouldn't, I was just wondering what y'all think. Thanks again, DM
I'd put a big check mark by "clarity" - the definition in the low notes is amazing.
I'd say no to warmth - not as a bad thing but because the cabs don't add color. That's kind of their thing - you hear your bass and amp without further coloration. That's why it's so important to consider them when deciding if the cabinet is right for you.
You don't really realize how much other cabs color your sound until you try a Thunderchild. You may like the coloration of other cabs or you may suddenly realize it was a negative (as I did) - but one way or another you'll become aware of what they contribute.
Thanks again, PGD. Yeah, guess I misspoke a bit. I realize warmth=baked in cab sound. Back in the day, at least, AG cabs were supposed to studio monitor-like, but I guess technology has moved the goal posts to even greater clarity and accurate reproduction.
You're going to get a range of opinions on this. I have back trouble that would have stopped me gigging years ago, if not for neo drivers and modern cab designs, so portability IS very important to me.
That said, the tone of my TC112AF is exactly what I've been looking for through years of home-brews, mini-PA setups, and exotics like Accugroove, Acme, et al.
The latest super twelves and fifteens really do offer light weight with no compromises. Still, it's a crowded market between AudioKinesis and others. What I consider Crème brûlée might taste like instant pudding to you...
I've A/B'd the wood and composite TC115's at a GTTG, and the tonal difference is vanishingly small, especially as you would experience in a noisy environment like a gig. People who've spent more time with them seem to define the composite difference as a little more space between the notes at the low end, as if there was a touch more resonant "hang" in the wood boxes.
Frankly, these cabs are probably tighter, more balanced and more controlled for a given amount of low end extension than pretty much anything you've ever experienced, so the point is moot.
One thing to note is that the composites are no longer available. Mike Arnopol has stopped building them due to health concerns with the fiberglass and epoxy.
I'd say "balanced" and "clear" but definitely not "harsh" or emphasizing any one frequency over the other.
IMHO, anyone looking at cabinets like the Bergantino CN212 or HD212, should give the TC212 a check-out as well. Very light, small stage footprint, good form-factor for hearing yourself onstage, & big, balanced sound.
In a way, yes. The fact that they can produce so much clean sound in such a small package is their strong point. Other more traditional cabs sound good but most are harder to move around. My main interest in these cabs is max quality sound/pound.
I could make just about any cab work in a rehearsal space and often do. When given a choice to use a cab on the premises or bring mine, mine stays at home.
I don't think so, except I don't think the TC115 is available new anymore. The good news is the 112 is more than capable of blowing away a living room and should sound much like the 115. As stated above by Duke, there are some new developments in the 12.
Edit: Looks like the 115 is now 8ohm based on the 3015lf speaker. Before they were 4ohm using a custom variant of the 3015lf.
Sorry to hear about that, and sincrely hoping in the long run the net result is something better for you. I took a big pay cut when the economy tanked and home audio sales disappeared, but then I discovered the bass cab world, and while I haven't gotten rich off of you guys, you got me through the recession.
I would imagine it comes down to personal preference. The cab I was gunning for, specifically, is the Whappo Jr, so consider that to be a compliment to AccuGroove.
No major difference between the wood and composite versions, but the composite versions are a bit better because of the combination of stiffness and internal damping in the panels.
Thank you, yeah that's a big cab shoehorned into a small footprint.
I haven't actually built & delivered any 8-ohm 115s yet because no one has ordered one yet, but the crossover design is done.
Switched to the TH500 from the Demeter powered preamp. The Demeter sounded great clean through the Hathor, but I felt when running my distortion pedals through the Demeter it seemed like the sound coming from the cab wasn't very integrated. Almost like the midranges seemed unnaturally separated from the woofer. Only noticed this with the fuzz pedals though.
With the TH500 and the fuzz pedals the cab sounds much more cohesive. Very strange phenomenon, but regardless, for my needs the TH500/Hathor pairing makes a lot more sense. (also sounds pretty killer with the little Bass Synth.)
That's a fabulous photo all the way around.
Sub'd to this thread.
My one consistent of the last few years has been my Bergantino AE112/AE210 stack. I like the portability and the upper mid cut of the AE112; I use it alone on my smaller gigs. I'll add the AE210 for the bigger gigs (i.e. when I play with a drummer). The AE210 filled out/beefed up the sound nicely.
My last gig was a tough load in/out and I got to thinking how nice it would be to have a lightweight, single cab solution . It was at that point I (foolishly ) decided to give Audiokinesis a call for information. This was when Duke managed to pull his "slight of hand" and lightened my wallet.
I told Duke I was looking for a lightweight, single cabinet solution that had a tight low end and pronounced upper mids.
What he proposed was a TC115-8; an 8 ohm, 15" ThunderChild. The cab should be just shy of 40 lbs and about the size of my AE210. With the smoothy/grindy switch set to grindy, it should have an added upper mid presence. And the total sound should be close to my AE112/AE210 stack (which should work as I'm in no way pushing the limit of my current cabs).
For the record, I'll be using an MTD 434-24, Lull P4, Pedulla Buzz and GK MB800.
While the Bergs are no slouch, I'm looking forward to what the TC115-8 does for my sound. I should have the cab the third week of September and I'll have an outdoor the following week to put it thru it's paces.
As an aside, it was a pleasure working with Duke. I'm not even sure he knew he was selling a cab until after going thru a few iterations, I said let's do it.
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