Take it easy...that was his first game and he's only 20...
Oh, and for everybody who doesn't know...Arizona is good! They have some bright, young talent that know how to play the game. Very impressive to watch.
Enjoy the benefits of a premium membership!
Upgrade Account
-
TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
Join free Log in
Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.
Baseball season 2007
- Thread starter SoComSurfing
- Start date
- Status
Take it easy...that was his first game and he's only 20...
Oh, and for everybody who doesn't know...Arizona is good! They have some bright, young talent that know how to play the game. Very impressive to watch.
The Sox could have used a little help - we took 3 of 4 from the Indians; the least the Tigers could have done was split with the Yankees.
The Sox split with the Angels which is OK with me - they have a strong team. The hitting has improved from spotty to merely inconsistent. Now we have to string together a few wins against Tampa and Chicago. I'll actually be at Chicago game on Thursday as I am currently visiting my inlaws in Milwaukee. I don't think we will outnumber the home fans as happens in Baltimore and Tampa but I hope that you'll hear us.
Flipping through the channels I saw a Larry King episode that had Rizzuto, Berra and Whitey Ford being interviewed a few years ago. When asked about all the home runs that had been hit, these keen baseball insiders cited the ball (Scooter compared it to a golf ball), smaller parks, and Ford added weaker pitchers due to expansion. I wonder did they not know it was largely the juice or did they not want to know it was the juice?
The Sox split with the Angels which is OK with me - they have a strong team. The hitting has improved from spotty to merely inconsistent. Now we have to string together a few wins against Tampa and Chicago. I'll actually be at Chicago game on Thursday as I am currently visiting my inlaws in Milwaukee. I don't think we will outnumber the home fans as happens in Baltimore and Tampa but I hope that you'll hear us.
Flipping through the channels I saw a Larry King episode that had Rizzuto, Berra and Whitey Ford being interviewed a few years ago. When asked about all the home runs that had been hit, these keen baseball insiders cited the ball (Scooter compared it to a golf ball), smaller parks, and Ford added weaker pitchers due to expansion. I wonder did they not know it was largely the juice or did they not want to know it was the juice?
I was at this past Saturday nights Sox/Angels game. I got to see a Big Papi Grand Slam! That is the second one I've seen live at Fenway by Ortiz himself! It turned out to be a very exciting game once the offense lit up. Schilling was less than impressive though...
I think Joshua might back me up on this but you never know...
I like Papi, he's a great hitter, not just a slugger, and I appreciate guys like that very much. I don't, however, blame Weaver at all for staring him down while he walked down the line admiring his ball like its the first time he's ever hit a homerun. I hate that. That's NOT the way the game's supposed to be played. His next at-bat should've been a fastball in his back. And I like the guy.
This is where the "throwing inside rule" has ruined baseball. Guys used to police themselves by throwing inside...you disrespect a player=you get a ball in your back. You disrespect the GAME=you get a ball near your ear. The game is and always has been bigger than any player that's ever stepped foot on the field. Its the unwritten rules in baseball that I love...I'm not an advocate of been-ball wars but there was a reason these 'unspoken/unwritten' rules came to pass...to preserve the game.
I'm done...for now.
Haha...Or Nolan Ryan? Or Pedro, Clemens, Randy Johnson...hell, Babe Ruth would have brushed him back. Warren Spahn wouldn't have liked it either...back in that day, the catcher would let him know when he came to home plate that he was about to get plunked his next at-bat.
Yeah, he hit a mammothly high grand slam. As soon as he made contact he didn't even move, he just stood there until the ball went out of the park then he proceeded to run the absolutely slowest home-run trot in history. Even Cecil Fielder would run his bombs out. Did Aaron and Ruth ever do this? No.
Yeah, he hit a mammothly high grand slam. As soon as he made contact he didn't even move, he just stood there until the ball went out of the park then he proceeded to run the absolutely slowest home-run trot in history. Even Cecil Fielder would run his bombs out. Did Aaron and Ruth ever do this? No.
While I do agree to a point about this, Ortiz has not had a stellar season. He has pretty much been struggling this year, and fighting off the fact that due to his injuries he may be done permanently after this season. He said himself in an interview he hasn't seen a pitch like that to him in a long time. He hit the ball hard. He took the game back after being down 5 runs. He hit a grand slam to do so. He knew the ball was out the second it left the bat. What some people might see as show boating and gloating, I see it as him savoring possibly the greatest hit he's had this year, maybe the last of his career. You talk about him running slow around the basses as well. While I'm sure it was a little slower than he could have run, the guy has a bum knee. I don't want him running any faster than he has to.
edit: I've watched Ortiz since he joined the red sox, and I don't remember once when he did the "stop and watch" home run stance. Now, Manny?.....I can remember dozens of times he's done that.
edit: I've watched Ortiz since he joined the red sox, and I don't remember once when he did the "stop and watch" home run stance. Now, Manny?.....I can remember dozens of times he's done that.
I know and understand what you're saying...BUT...he hit the ball to right field; he can go ahead and jog while he's watching the ball.
This just rings a bell with me. I played with a guy who always talked about "treating the game right" and what it does as far as karma goes. I've seen it ever since.
This just rings a bell with me. I played with a guy who always talked about "treating the game right" and what it does as far as karma goes. I've seen it ever since.
Oh, I totally agree. While I love the run support Ramirez has given the Red Sox in these past years, I've always frowned upon his general cockiness after hitting a home run. The way he just flicks his bat afterwards like he is simply the greatest....:scowl:
Exactly. Look at Griffey, Jr. While I like the guy, his cockiness during his homeruns, i.e. just standing there until the ball goes out, could be why his career slipped for those few years. Think about it. Karma caught up to him. It caught up to Pedro too...his shoulder is pooh. He used to be a cocky ass on the mound, constantly showing up umpires and such...you can't treat the game like that.
I don't know guys...if you think about how many genuine pricks there are in the Hall of Fame, I don't think you can honestly say that bad karma keeps too many of players from achieving greatness.
I pray you're right about the Braves! And my congratulations to Smoltz. He may not have the wins of Maddox or Glavine, but IMO, he is definitely HOF material!
Louie and Joshua - I know you guys are/were pitchers - and this post does have an edge to it - but I have to write what I honestly feel on this topic.
Johnson may not have thrown the beanball because in the days prior to helmets, he could easily have killed someone. While I understand that in the baseball world not wanting to mortally injure people qualifies a pitcher for sainthood; I always thought that was a rather low standard (and still think of the thousands of pitchers who still couldn't achieve it - Clemens threw at his kid - that is certifiably sociopathic).
Regarding admiring homeruns. You would think that Weaver would remember other considerations which xgabriele pointed out so well. Also Papi is a homerun hitter; it is not like he was some minor league callup 2nd baseman that curled one around the Pesky Pole; it was a monster shot; it was not like it just cleared the fence.
Just as a pitcher should be allowed to show some emotion when striking out a slugger with the bases loaded; batters should be allowed to savor their big moments. No need to turn the MLB into the N(o) F(un) L(eague).
Whenever I hear a pitcher say he wasn't mad he gave up a homerun, he was mad at the way the batter reacted/ran; he is lying. Just the same as a player that is cut or demoted or traded often says that it was the way he found out not that he was cut, etc.
I'm really sorry that pitchers feelings are hurt everytime a batter hits a homerun and doesn't immediately commence to sprinting at top speed so as not to prolong the humiliation one moment too long. Perhaps they should try pitching better instead of whining or making veiled threats - what putzes.
Johnson may not have thrown the beanball because in the days prior to helmets, he could easily have killed someone. While I understand that in the baseball world not wanting to mortally injure people qualifies a pitcher for sainthood; I always thought that was a rather low standard (and still think of the thousands of pitchers who still couldn't achieve it - Clemens threw at his kid - that is certifiably sociopathic).
Regarding admiring homeruns. You would think that Weaver would remember other considerations which xgabriele pointed out so well. Also Papi is a homerun hitter; it is not like he was some minor league callup 2nd baseman that curled one around the Pesky Pole; it was a monster shot; it was not like it just cleared the fence.
Just as a pitcher should be allowed to show some emotion when striking out a slugger with the bases loaded; batters should be allowed to savor their big moments. No need to turn the MLB into the N(o) F(un) L(eague).
Whenever I hear a pitcher say he wasn't mad he gave up a homerun, he was mad at the way the batter reacted/ran; he is lying. Just the same as a player that is cut or demoted or traded often says that it was the way he found out not that he was cut, etc.
I'm really sorry that pitchers feelings are hurt everytime a batter hits a homerun and doesn't immediately commence to sprinting at top speed so as not to prolong the humiliation one moment too long. Perhaps they should try pitching better instead of whining or making veiled threats - what putzes.
At least Jered Weaver has his supporters on TB, if not his manager and center fielder.
My translation of Scioscia and Matthews comments is "shut the **** up, rook." Now that is one unwritten rule I wouldn't mind seeing enforced.
From the LA Times:
Scioscia firmly rejected any thought that the Angels -- or pitcher Jered Weaver, in particular -- would retaliate against Boston's David Ortiz for his antics after his grand slam Saturday. Before Ortiz started to trot around the bases, he flipped his bat and lingered to admire his shot, prompting a long stare from Weaver.
"I'll remember it the next time we play them, that's for sure," Weaver said after the game. "I'm not saying anything is going to happen, but it's definitely in the back of your mind."
Said Scioscia on Sunday: "He's going to remember, first of all, to make a little better pitch. I didn't take it [Weaver's comment] along the lines of any retaliation. There won't be. That's not what we're about."
Scioscia said hitters watching their home runs and pitchers pumping their fists after strikeouts are simply part of the game these days.
"People express themselves differently on the baseball field," he said. "You can't get caught up too much with that."
and
If Weaver was unhappy with his reaction, Ortiz said, so be it.
"I don't care about that," Ortiz said. "I don't pay any attention to those things."
Neither does Gary Matthews Jr. If the Angels' pitcher was offended, their center fielder was not.
"He's a superstar," Matthews said. "It's his thing. It's not like he hasn't done it before. I wasn't offended. . . If I hit a grand slam to put us ahead, I might be feeling it too. It's part of the game. I don't necessarily think it's a bad thing.
"It's what fans want to see. Fans wanted to see Dennis Eckersley get the save and pump his fist and scream. They pay to see Vladdy hit a walkoff home run and point to the sky. They pay to see Ortiz walk off and flip his bat."
My translation of Scioscia and Matthews comments is "shut the **** up, rook." Now that is one unwritten rule I wouldn't mind seeing enforced.
From the LA Times:
Scioscia firmly rejected any thought that the Angels -- or pitcher Jered Weaver, in particular -- would retaliate against Boston's David Ortiz for his antics after his grand slam Saturday. Before Ortiz started to trot around the bases, he flipped his bat and lingered to admire his shot, prompting a long stare from Weaver.
"I'll remember it the next time we play them, that's for sure," Weaver said after the game. "I'm not saying anything is going to happen, but it's definitely in the back of your mind."
Said Scioscia on Sunday: "He's going to remember, first of all, to make a little better pitch. I didn't take it [Weaver's comment] along the lines of any retaliation. There won't be. That's not what we're about."
Scioscia said hitters watching their home runs and pitchers pumping their fists after strikeouts are simply part of the game these days.
"People express themselves differently on the baseball field," he said. "You can't get caught up too much with that."
and
If Weaver was unhappy with his reaction, Ortiz said, so be it.
"I don't care about that," Ortiz said. "I don't pay any attention to those things."
Neither does Gary Matthews Jr. If the Angels' pitcher was offended, their center fielder was not.
"He's a superstar," Matthews said. "It's his thing. It's not like he hasn't done it before. I wasn't offended. . . If I hit a grand slam to put us ahead, I might be feeling it too. It's part of the game. I don't necessarily think it's a bad thing.
"It's what fans want to see. Fans wanted to see Dennis Eckersley get the save and pump his fist and scream. They pay to see Vladdy hit a walkoff home run and point to the sky. They pay to see Ortiz walk off and flip his bat."
For those of you who watched...the Angels/Yankees game was a great BASEBALL game. Two managers that know how to play the game. 2 young pitchers who showed up with bells on. Timely hitting...great defense...it was just a pleasure to watch. And with the Yankees losing...just that much better. 
Rick Sutclif was talking about something very interesting last night as well...the subject of "getting down the line" after a homerun came up. He told a little story about his rookie year in the bigs...said Reggie Jackson did his "admire the baseball" trot after he hit a homerun and Sutclif said he was histerical and was ready to hit Jackson in the head. When going back out to the mound Bert Blyleven talked to him. He said, "You can do what you want, but that guy has over 500 of 'em. If anything, he's earned the right to do that."
I grinned to myself and I agreed. If you're in the game for a certain amount of time, you do earn the right to do certain things. In that situation, at that moment, fine. Weaver was stupid to say anything to the media about it, that's just his rookieness coming out. And I know Ortiz doesn't always do that, it was a big situation, so he gets a pass on this one.
Rick Sutclif was talking about something very interesting last night as well...the subject of "getting down the line" after a homerun came up. He told a little story about his rookie year in the bigs...said Reggie Jackson did his "admire the baseball" trot after he hit a homerun and Sutclif said he was histerical and was ready to hit Jackson in the head. When going back out to the mound Bert Blyleven talked to him. He said, "You can do what you want, but that guy has over 500 of 'em. If anything, he's earned the right to do that."
I grinned to myself and I agreed. If you're in the game for a certain amount of time, you do earn the right to do certain things. In that situation, at that moment, fine. Weaver was stupid to say anything to the media about it, that's just his rookieness coming out. And I know Ortiz doesn't always do that, it was a big situation, so he gets a pass on this one.
Weaver should have never talked to the press about it. However, the quotes from the manager certainly smack of "company line".
Boo!
I only caught thru about the 6th, enough to see ARod smack #40 and put the Yanks up 4-3. Didn't work out in the long run though...
Yea! Go Angels.
Of course, he shouldn't have talked to the press. The "company line" has the effect of taking Weaver off the hook a bit. Also, threats, once made explicit, tend to lose their power. Another lesson for the rook.
I agree completely...you don't need to hit anybody, that's stupid, I never hit one person on purpose while I played, although I was justified a few times. I don't like giving that guy a base. Having a fastball zing by your hands or just zing by your neck, however, is an art and a very beautiful thing when done correctly. Pedro utilized this pitch very effectively which allowed him to be effective. Nolan Ryan did it as well...he was a mean cuss on the mound. I don't see that anymore. While the game has changed a bit, if guys understand that the "brushback pitch" should be practiced just as much as the 2-seamer on the outer-half, it can be equally effective and be used in 2 ways...as an "effect" pitch and to keep the guys honest.
Standing on that bump with nothing but a glove is just as dangerous as hitting...the ball comes back about 20% faster than when you threw it. Throwing inside is the pitching equivilant of wearing a helmet.
edit: As far as the first sentence goes...I never hit anyone on purpose. I was, however, accused of it. My brother(he was a catcher) told me even though I tipped my hat, the grin on my face made them think otherwise..
Standing on that bump with nothing but a glove is just as dangerous as hitting...the ball comes back about 20% faster than when you threw it. Throwing inside is the pitching equivilant of wearing a helmet.
edit: As far as the first sentence goes...I never hit anyone on purpose. I was, however, accused of it. My brother(he was a catcher) told me even though I tipped my hat, the grin on my face made them think otherwise..
- Status
